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Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue

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nota bene

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From the Columbus, Ohio NBC affiliate:
Protesters gathered in front of Columbus City Hall on Saturday to call for a statue of the city's namesake to be taken down.

Tynan Krakoff is the lead organizer of Showing Up For Racial Justice, the group putting on this rally, and said the statue of Christopher Columbus represents some of the bad in American history.

"We're calling on the city council, the mayor, and the city of Columbus to removed the statue, said Krakoff to NBC4 on Friday.

Some marchers draped a banner over the Columbus statue that read "TOPPLE WHITE SUPREMACY NOW."
Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue | NBC4i.com

In related news, vandals have damaged both a bust of MLK and a statue of Columbus.
http://www.chron.com/houston/article/Reports-Christopher-Columbus-statue-vandalized-11883027.php

This is lunacy. Hysteria.
 
They have been after Columbus for a long time now. This isnt anything new.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk
 
nota bene said:
From the Columbus, Ohio NBC affiliate:
Protesters gathered in front of Columbus City Hall on Saturday to call for a statue of the city's namesake to be taken down.

Tynan Krakoff is the lead organizer of Showing Up For Racial Justice, the group putting on this rally, and said the statue of Christopher Columbus represents some of the bad in American history.

"We're calling on the city council, the mayor, and the city of Columbus to removed the statue, said Krakoff to NBC4 on Friday.

Some marchers draped a banner over the Columbus statue that read "TOPPLE WHITE SUPREMACY NOW."
Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue | NBC4i.com

In related news, vandals have damaged both a bust of MLK and a statue of Columbus.
http://www.chron.com/houston/article/Reports-Christopher-Columbus-statue-vandalized-11883027.php

This is lunacy. Hysteria.
Click to expand...

Any statue we put in its place will be met with the same resistance. This is dumb.
 
nota bene said:
This is lunacy. Hysteria.
Click to expand...

Well no it is not. Christopher Columbus is a strange one in history and not exactly a saint.

On the one hand he said "screw you, I will go west to find India" and stumbled on the Americas and claimed to have found new land. He was not the first to find the Americas, that was the Vikings centuries before.

But the consequences of what he did both directly and especially indirectly lead to genocide of the local population. Yes it was in part out of ignorance on diseases but there was also subjugation of natives who were deemed subhuman by the Church.

So one has to question, what exactly are you celebrating by honoring Christopher Columbus? Mass murder in the name of religion? Dumb luck on re-finding a continent? Or is it a celebration of how brave people like him were to map the world? Dunno if all the "good" he did is enough to celebrate considering the genocide he caused.
 
Why stop at the statue of Columbus? The city is named Columbus, Ohio. What good is removing a statue and leaving in place the name?
 
Fletch said:
Why stop at the statue of Columbus? The city is named Columbus, Ohio. What good is removing a statue and leaving in place the name?
Click to expand...

Yes, and rename it Marxtopia. :rolleyes:
 
nota bene said:
From the Columbus, Ohio NBC affiliate:
Protesters gathered in front of Columbus City Hall on Saturday to call for a statue of the city's namesake to be taken down.

Tynan Krakoff is the lead organizer of Showing Up For Racial Justice, the group putting on this rally, and said the statue of Christopher Columbus represents some of the bad in American history.

"We're calling on the city council, the mayor, and the city of Columbus to removed the statue, said Krakoff to NBC4 on Friday.

Some marchers draped a banner over the Columbus statue that read "TOPPLE WHITE SUPREMACY NOW."
Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue | NBC4i.com

In related news, vandals have damaged both a bust of MLK and a statue of Columbus.
MLK, Christopher Columbus statues vandalized in Houston parks - Houston Chronicle

This is lunacy. Hysteria.
Click to expand...

Just stop already! Our history is our history. Stop trying to erase it, good or bad.
 
trouble13 said:
They have been after Columbus for a long time now. This isnt anything new.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Yes, I remember the late '80's and the DWEMs.
 
I am 100% opposed to any Confederate statue, but I do not agree with this.

Columbus wasn't the first to discover America, but he was the most important. When the Vikings discovered America, it meant nothing to anyone. When Columbus discovered America, it opened America to Europe.

The celebration isn't about subjugation or genocide, the celebration is about the discovery of the New World by the Old World. The significance of this event cannot be over-stated, despite unfortunate ramifications.
 
holbritter said:
Just stop already! Our history is our history. Stop trying to erase it, good or bad.
Click to expand...

That is the dilemma, who says "we stop here?" And by what authority/right? Slippery slope defined, extra long cleats recommended!
 
ecofarm said:
I am 100% opposed to any Confederate statue, but I do not agree with this.

Columbus wasn't the first to discover America, but he was the most important. When the Vikings discovered America, it meant nothing to anyone. When Columbus discovered America, it opened America to Europe.

The celebration isn't about subjugation or genocide, the celebration is about the discovery of the New World by the Old World. The significance of this event cannot be over-stated, despite unfortunate ramifications.
Click to expand...


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Columbus#/media/File:Viajes_de_colon_en.svg

Christopher Columbus discovered what is modern day Haiti.
 
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Rexedgar said:
Christopher Columbus discovered what is modern day Haiti.
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He opened the New World to the Old World. The Viking's discovery was meaningless.
 
PeteEU said:
Well no it is not. Christopher Columbus is a strange one in history and not exactly a saint.

On the one hand he said "screw you, I will go west to find India" and stumbled on the Americas and claimed to have found new land. He was not the first to find the Americas, that was the Vikings centuries before.

But the consequences of what he did both directly and especially indirectly lead to genocide of the local population. Yes it was in part out of ignorance on diseases but there was also subjugation of natives who were deemed subhuman by the Church.

So one has to question, what exactly are you celebrating by honoring Christopher Columbus? Mass murder in the name of religion? Dumb luck on re-finding a continent? Or is it a celebration of how brave people like him were to map the world? Dunno if all the "good" he did is enough to celebrate considering the genocide he caused.
Click to expand...

Columbus is recognized for his effort in the establishment of civilization on this continent. Hanging all of the ills of that civilization on Columbus, whatever his flaws, is not rational or reasonable. Perhaps you can explain exactly how removing a statue will cure any of the ills you mention.
 
humbolt said:
Columbus is recognized for his effort in the establishment of civilization on this continent. Hanging all of the ills of that civilization on Columbus, whatever his flaws, is not rational or reasonable. Perhaps you can explain exactly how removing a statue will cure any of the ills you mention.
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I think the debate here is not about "curing ills," but more about the folly that we have embarked upon with the removal of monuments. Glass houses/stones and the like>
 
take down the Washington monument; he was a slave owner .......
 
Rexedgar said:
I think the debate here is not about "curing ills," but more about the folly that we have embarked upon with the removal of monuments. Glass houses/stones and the like>
Click to expand...

Of course it's folly. It's the stated justifications for their removal that I'm speaking of, since some of those ills were referred to in the post I responded to.
 
humbolt said:
Columbus is recognized for his effort in the establishment of civilization on this continent. Hanging all of the ills of that civilization on Columbus, whatever his flaws, is not rational or reasonable. Perhaps you can explain exactly how removing a statue will cure any of the ills you mention.
Click to expand...

No, he is recognized for discovering America... establishment of civilization? LOL.. Civilization existed in the Americas long before Columbus stumbled over the continent.
 
PeteEU said:
No, he is recognized for discovering America... establishment of civilization? LOL.. Civilization existed in the Americas long before Columbus stumbled over the continent.
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If you believe the late stone age is civilization, I can understand your confusion.
 
holbritter said:
Just stop already! Our history is our history. Stop trying to erase it, good or bad.
Click to expand...

Statues are for honoring and celebrating people. Books are for remembering and learning history. We didn't forget what happened in Nazi Germany because statues and giant swastikas were torn down.
 
Rexedgar said:
Interesting counterpoint. Never heard of the source, sounds plausible. Kinda found it, (the Caribbean) by accident.

The Truth About Christopher Columbus
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Not bad. I liked this part:

There are lot more examples, writings, and research that points to one fact – Christopher Columbus was a lamentable individual. Nobody’s perfect- if we restricted celebrated individuals to those who didn’t have any major flaws, we’d have few humans to celebrate- and it’s extremely important to view things in the context of the time individuals lived in. But even in his age, many of his acts were considered deplorable by his peers, which is in no small part why Columbus was arrested for his conduct in the New World. Combined with his truly historic and widespread impact being incidental to what he was actually trying to do (so a little hard to celebrate him for even that side of his life), maybe it is time that we let go of the myths we learned about Christopher Columbus in elementary school and stop celebrating Columbus, the man.
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I can agree with the sentiment, however, my two points remain:

1. The Viking's discovery was meaningless.
2. The significance of opening the New World to the Old cannot be over-stated.

Perhaps we can recognize that he was a horrible person and that he symbolizes the meaningful discovery of the New World.

I will admit my position on the statue is wavering.
 
humbolt said:
Columbus is recognized for his effort in the establishment of civilization on this continent. Hanging all of the ills of that civilization on Columbus, whatever his flaws, is not rational or reasonable. Perhaps you can explain exactly how removing a statue will cure any of the ills you mention.
Click to expand...

Various civilizations already exited in the Americas before Columbus arrived. I think you just mean the establishment of European civilization.
 
humbolt said:
If you believe the late stone age is civilization, I can understand your confusion.
Click to expand...

Boy, you really dont know much about history eh? So the Aztecs, Mayans, Incas were "late stone age" peoples?
 
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