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Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue

Statues are art, meant to represent a figure to inspire people to learn more about that person place in our history.
 
jdog21 said:
Statues are art, meant to represent a figure to inspire people to learn more about that person place in our history.
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Burn the books!
 
Ahlevah said:
Vikings contributed exactly nothing to the development of the New World, hence the creation of the United States. That's the reason there's a national holiday honoring Columbus and not some mythical Viking.
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Vikings are cool though.
 
Cardinal said:
Statues are for honoring and celebrating people. Books are for remembering and learning history. We didn't forget what happened in Nazi Germany because statues and giant swastikas were torn down.
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Good point. Let's hope those books are not changed.
 
lurchadams said:
Yep, a controlled speech utopia is what we want. Don't forget, we're waging war on Christmas. Also, Hillary Clinton would like to come take your guns away this week. What day's good for you?
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You laugh now. We will see. The more we suppress free speech, no matter how distasteful, the closer it gets.
 
lurchadams said:
Yep, a controlled speech utopia is what we want. Don't forget, we're waging war on Christmas. Also, Hillary Clinton would like to come take your guns away this week. What day's good for you?
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The Germans thought the National Socialists were a joke, too; they would never do anything.
 
holbritter said:
Just stop already! Our history is our history. Stop trying to erase it, good or bad.
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Removing statues =/= erasing history.

Yet another false equivalence to add to the growing pile we've seen over the past week.
 
nota bene said:
From the Columbus, Ohio NBC affiliate:
Protesters gathered in front of Columbus City Hall on Saturday to call for a statue of the city's namesake to be taken down.

Tynan Krakoff is the lead organizer of Showing Up For Racial Justice, the group putting on this rally, and said the statue of Christopher Columbus represents some of the bad in American history.

"We're calling on the city council, the mayor, and the city of Columbus to removed the statue, said Krakoff to NBC4 on Friday.

Some marchers draped a banner over the Columbus statue that read "TOPPLE WHITE SUPREMACY NOW."
Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue | NBC4i.com

In related news, vandals have damaged both a bust of MLK and a statue of Columbus.
MLK, Christopher Columbus statues vandalized in Houston parks - Houston Chronicle

This is lunacy. Hysteria.
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Hysteria indeed. Next it will be Mt Rushmore.
 
holbritter said:
You laugh now. We will see. The more we suppress free speech, no matter how distasteful, the closer it gets.
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I laugh when the right accuses the left of being hysterical and then the right makes hysterical statements such as yours.
 
apdst said:
The Germans thought the National Socialists were a joke, too; they would never do anything.
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You've convinced me. The American national socialists are coming. You take first watch, k?
 
PeteEU said:
Well no it is not. Christopher Columbus is a strange one in history and not exactly a saint.

On the one hand he said "screw you, I will go west to find India" and stumbled on the Americas and claimed to have found new land. He was not the first to find the Americas, that was the Vikings centuries before.

But the consequences of what he did both directly and especially indirectly lead to genocide of the local population. Yes it was in part out of ignorance on diseases but there was also subjugation of natives who were deemed subhuman by the Church.

So one has to question, what exactly are you celebrating by honoring Christopher Columbus? Mass murder in the name of religion? Dumb luck on re-finding a continent? Or is it a celebration of how brave people like him were to map the world? Dunno if all the "good" he did is enough to celebrate considering the genocide he caused.
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Are you saying we shouldn't celebrate a typical European of his time and position?
 
humbolt said:
Agreed, but those cultures did not provide what we associate with civilization. Nomadic hunting and gathering does not provide a sound foundation for the growth of human enterprise.
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And they weren't white. :eek:
 
CriticalThought said:
Christopher Columbus I can understand. He was a genocidal maniac.
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By today's standards, wasn't everybody back then?

People generally killed people that were different from themselves or that didn't belong to their group.
 
nota bene said:
From the Columbus, Ohio NBC affiliate:
Protesters gathered in front of Columbus City Hall on Saturday to call for a statue of the city's namesake to be taken down.

Tynan Krakoff is the lead organizer of Showing Up For Racial Justice, the group putting on this rally, and said the statue of Christopher Columbus represents some of the bad in American history.

"We're calling on the city council, the mayor, and the city of Columbus to removed the statue, said Krakoff to NBC4 on Friday.

Some marchers draped a banner over the Columbus statue that read "TOPPLE WHITE SUPREMACY NOW."
Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue | NBC4i.com

In related news, vandals have damaged both a bust of MLK and a statue of Columbus.
MLK, Christopher Columbus statues vandalized in Houston parks - Houston Chronicle

This is lunacy. Hysteria.
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Columbus was a slave trader and dope dealer from the business point of view. He caused the death of enough natives to be accused of genocide, not without foundations in truth. He brought Right, White, Christianity moving Westward with heavy weapons to the Americas. Columbus' story is where "obfuscation of truth in America" begins, but doesn't end.
/
 
nota bene said:
From the Columbus, Ohio NBC affiliate:
Protesters gathered in front of Columbus City Hall on Saturday to call for a statue of the city's namesake to be taken down.

Tynan Krakoff is the lead organizer of Showing Up For Racial Justice, the group putting on this rally, and said the statue of Christopher Columbus represents some of the bad in American history.

"We're calling on the city council, the mayor, and the city of Columbus to removed the statue, said Krakoff to NBC4 on Friday.

Some marchers draped a banner over the Columbus statue that read "TOPPLE WHITE SUPREMACY NOW."
Protesters call for removal of Christopher Columbus statue | NBC4i.com

In related news, vandals have damaged both a bust of MLK and a statue of Columbus.
MLK, Christopher Columbus statues vandalized in Houston parks - Houston Chronicle

This is lunacy. Hysteria.
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Yes it is lunacy.
The group involved is part of a network of "social justice" warriors. His particular group is comprised of white social justice warriors.
If you watched the coverage you immediately noticed the protestors were 99% white and 99% in their twenties.
Tynan Krakoff is not a native of Ohio. I believe he is from the San Francisco Bay area and within this national web of social justice groups travels around a lot.
When interviewed by NBC 4 he was wearing a BLM teeshirt.
Last year Tynan Krakoff was arrested in Columbus Ohio for forming a BLM protest march of about 150 people without a permit. He was charged with three misdemeanors one being resisting arrest.

The reason for the protest was because two undercover police officers shot a black man in South Linden. The two undercover cops who shot him happened to be white.
Since you are not from the Columbus area, South Linden.... The overall crime rate in South Linden is 145% higher than the national average. The police officers involved went before a grand jury and they refused to indict.
Officers in Henry Green shooting say they feared for their lives | NBC4i.com

So now Tynan Krankoff is back in Columbus this time protesting the Christopher Columbus statue. It was presented to the city of Columbus in October of 1955 by the United Italian-American Association. I guess because Ohio doesn't have any Confederate statues they feel they need to go after Columbus. They went after a Christopher Columbus statue in Detroit Michigan too. Another state that doesn't have any Confederate monuments.

My thoughts these are groups pushing this insanity that want to see the U.S. implode from within. Though the names of their groups are all touchy feely, their beliefs are more in line with Marxists and Fascists. The Communist Manifesto encourages destroying symbols and monuments of past history to bring about change. Older folks know this, younger folks are ignorant because our public education system has been taken over by leftists for decades.
 
vesper said:
Yes it is lunacy.
The group involved is part of a network of "social justice" warriors. His particular group is comprised of white social justice warriors.
If you watched the coverage you immediately noticed the protestors were 99% white and 99% in their twenties.
Tynan Krakoff is not a native of Ohio. I believe he is from the San Francisco Bay area and within this national web of social justice groups travels around a lot.
When interviewed by NBC 4 he was wearing a BLM teeshirt.
Last year Tynan Krakoff was arrested in Columbus Ohio for forming a BLM protest march of about 150 people without a permit. He was charged with three misdemeanors one being resisting arrest.

The reason for the protest was because two undercover police officers shot a black man in South Linden. The two undercover cops who shot him happened to be white.
Since you are not from the Columbus area, South Linden.... The overall crime rate in South Linden is 145% higher than the national average. The police officers involved went before a grand jury and they refused to indict.
Officers in Henry Green shooting say they feared for their lives | NBC4i.com

So now Tynan Krankoff is back in Columbus this time protesting the Christopher Columbus statue. It was presented to the city of Columbus in October of 1955 by the United Italian-American Association. I guess because Ohio doesn't have any Confederate statues they feel they need to go after Columbus. They went after a Christopher Columbus statue in Detroit Michigan too. Another state that doesn't have any Confederate monuments.

My thoughts these are groups pushing this insanity that want to see the U.S. implode from within. Though the names of their groups are all touchy feely, their beliefs are more in line with Marxists and Fascists. The Communist Manifesto encourages destroying symbols and monuments of past history to bring about change. Older folks know this, younger folks are ignorant because our public education system has been taken over by leftists for decades.
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Perhaps all this will create a "teachable moment." Sigh.
 
holbritter said:
Good point. Let's hope those books are not changed.
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Regardless of whether the books are changed, the statue is a piece of rock or metal. You were never going to "learn" meaningful from it. It's also very time and labor intensive to build statues as educational devices. This is why historians record history by writing books and making documentaries rather than build a statue every time something happens. Also, no library would be able to carry enough knowledge and history if all of their books were replaced with statues.
 
PeteEU said:
Well no it is not. Christopher Columbus is a strange one in history and not exactly a saint.

On the one hand he said "screw you, I will go west to find India" and stumbled on the Americas and claimed to have found new land. He was not the first to find the Americas, that was the Vikings centuries before.

But the consequences of what he did both directly and especially indirectly lead to genocide of the local population. Yes it was in part out of ignorance on diseases but there was also subjugation of natives who were deemed subhuman by the Church.

So one has to question, what exactly are you celebrating by honoring Christopher Columbus? Mass murder in the name of religion? Dumb luck on re-finding a continent? Or is it a celebration of how brave people like him were to map the world? Dunno if all the "good" he did is enough to celebrate considering the genocide he caused.
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I disagree. Yes, Columbus was responsible for the complete extermination of the Arawak Indians, and yes, the Vikings discovered America first. However, Europe did not have that knowledge, and it was Columbus who make it possible for Europeans to settle here. in addition, this is not the same issue as the removal of Confederate statues, which were not put up to celebrate a war or a culture, but erected during the times of Jim Crow to celebrate the fact that, in their eyes, some people were sub-humans and not deserving of equality.

Yes, Columbus had huge flaws, and was a monster, which is why we should not celebrate Columbus Day. But his statue represents history, as fractured as it is, and as ignorant as the knowledge of that history is, while Confederate monuments represent hatred, along with a desire to return to an era in which some people were more equal than others. There is a difference.
 
danarhea said:
I disagree. Yes, Columbus was responsible for the complete extermination of the Arawak Indians, and yes, the Vikings discovered America first. However, Europe did not have that knowledge, and it was Columbus who make it possible for Europeans to settle here. in addition, this is not the same issue as the removal of Confederate statues, which were not put up to celebrate a war or a culture, but erected during the times of Jim Crow to celebrate the fact that, in their eyes, some people were sub-humans and not deserving of equality.

Yes, Columbus had huge flaws, and was a monster, which is why we should not celebrate Columbus Day. But his statue represents history, as fractured as it is, and as ignorant as the knowledge of that history is, while Confederate monuments represent hatred, along with a desire to return to an era in which some people were more equal than others. There is a difference.
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Again, some of the protesters who are advocating removing colombus's statue may not have all of their facts straight.
 
holbritter said:
Good point. Let's hope those books are not changed.
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A small town library carries an average of ten thousand books. An average book is about 1"x9"x6", which makes for an average volume of 54 cubic inches. Assuming no horses, the average volume of an adult male is approximately 4933 cubic inches. This means that a library's shelf space that was required to store about 540,000 cubic inches in volume must now hold 49,300,000 cubic inches in volume, which means the average small town library must now be 91.3 times larger. Therefore, a 5625 sq/ft library would now need to be 513,562 sq/ft, or nine football stadiums.

Keep in mind that each statue needs to thoroughly tell history, and my calculation did not take into account additional figures or horses. If you include those, or increase the given size of the average library book, the actual size of each small town library will need to be be many, many times larger.
 
Unitedwestand13 said:
Again, some of the protesters who are advocating removing colombus's statue may not have all of their facts straight.
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Not unusual for groups such as the ones calling for Columbus's statute to come down.

They deal in emotion. Not rationality or facts. Basically, they're idiots.
 
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