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California Crops Rot as Immigration Crackdown Creates Farmworker Shortage

apdst said:
Looks like the farmers are going to have to figure something out. I reckon the days of two-dollar-an-hour labor, no payroll taxes, no SS and no workman's comp along with massive government subsidies are over.
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Is it a requirement for every Trump supporter to not be able to read?

They've already increased the pay and compensation and it's not working. Americans aren't flocking to the jobs you've been bitching the Mexicans stole.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
You're not getting it, they raised wages and offered benefits and Americans still aren't applying for the jobs. So more crops rot, which causes shortages. It doesn't matter how much we pay the immigrants, under or over minimum wage. They want the work. It's apparent that Americans do not, otherwise there would not be a problem.
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Require work for welfare, as California does not, and watch how many applications you would get. Until then, farmers are going to have to continue to raise wages or automate.
 
celticwar17 said:
This is the most mind boggling leftist point of view lol.... You want Higher wages, higher minimum wages.... but want to import second class citizens to work at slaves wages... This is exactly how you raise wages.... this is exactly how you create jobs..... YOU CREATE DEMAND FOR LABOR!!!! Is it going to be a perfect transition? No... because these markets are reliant on illegal slave labor essentially... it's going to take a few years to equalize...

I am amazed by the stupidity... or hidden malice o_O
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Ya and I'm not amazed that people aren't seeing the real world ramifications. It's not about the wages or having cheap labor. It's about having the labor at all. 90% of the food we eat passes through a migrant laborers hands. And if they are not doing the work, and farmers are offering fair wages and Americans are still not applying, who's going to do the work?

Hmm? We all just going to sit around and starve while patting ourselves on the back?
 
Ikari said:
Well it's likely not that they have no interest in working on farms, but rather they have no interest working on farms for the wages migrant labor was willing to do it for. Meaning that we were using illegal immigration, on some level, to undercut wages.

Regardless, the end would be the same and that would be that prices will increase. In this case, it's because supply will decrease due to the inability to get it from the fields. To make it so that farm work is appealing to more Americans, prices would increase because the increase in wages necessary to attract people to the job.

Of course, ultimately, you'll likely end up with better automation so that you need less people.
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I wasn't aware that anyone was unaware that migrant workers might be here because of higher pay for them and lower labor costs for the employer. And so now wage offers are rising. See how that works? Still few takers because farmers are not competing with other labor sources, but rather with welfare programs which still pay better than working, and you don't have to show up.

I reject the argument that the workers fear they won't be able to get back south.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
Is it a requirement for every Trump supporter to not be able to read?

They've already increased the pay and compensation and it's not working. Americans aren't flocking to the jobs you've been bitching the Mexicans stole.
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They're going to have to raise wages and benefits further, and some will go out of business. This is an industry that has relied on what amounts to slave labor for decades. We don't want that system to continue, and the new system will be better for Americans.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
Ya and I'm not amazed that people aren't seeing the real world ramifications. It's not about the wages or having cheap labor. It's about having the labor at all. 90% of the food we eat passes through a migrant laborers hands. And if they are not doing the work, and farmers are offering fair wages and Americans are still not applying, who's going to do the work?

Hmm? We all just going to sit around and starve while patting ourselves on the back?
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How do you know that they're fair wages? If Americans still don't want them, then clearly they're not high enough, or we need time to get people moved to these areas.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
Notice the last line of the quote from the article, farmers are now offering above minimum wage, with paid time off, and a 401k...
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Maybe they should try advertising, like any other business. Wont do any good though if the AG boys keep bending over to the Hispanic interests.

Dirty little secret in the AG and AG Transport in California has been essentially locked up by Mexican /Hispanic interests. Its exceptionally hard to get those jobs if you don't speak Spanish. Outsiders are generally run out either directly or by coercion of the employers. That's the reality on the ground, and the primary reason AG employers can realistically only hire Hispanics.
 
Ikari said:
And they'll have to keep doing to in order to attract enough American workers to take up the slack.
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We've tried that in other fields with labor shortage, and ended up having to import workers. Uneducated Americans want factory work, and they will sit on unemployment until that factory hires em back. It will never occur to them to go work on a farm. Hell, I've seen a plant close down in one town and another open up one town over and none of the workers from the first plant even bother applying at the second.

No one wants to move, or change their profession. And by the time we figure that out, again, we'll have food shortages.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
It is to the farmers that just lost 13 million in crops, because they can't pay Americans to do the work immigrants seek out...
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Just the beginning. Wait until it hurts the red southern states .
 
phattonez said:
You mean the ones that we already subsidize through our taxes? I'm so saddened by their losses.
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California farmers are generally not subsidized. If one is it is not to near the extent of Midwest farmers.
 
phattonez said:
How do you know that they're fair wages? If Americans still don't want them, then clearly they're not high enough, or we need time to get people moved to these areas.
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how do I know? you don't let 13 million in crops rot because you're hellbent on keeping your wage paid under 15 an hour. They upped the wage and upped the wage, then threw in 401k, and nothing.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
Ya and I'm not amazed that people aren't seeing the real world ramifications. It's not about the wages or having cheap labor. It's about having the labor at all. 90% of the food we eat passes through a migrant laborers hands. And if they are not doing the work, and farmers are offering fair wages and Americans are still not applying, who's going to do the work?

Hmm? We all just going to sit around and starve while patting ourselves on the back?
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Food prices will rise... Wages will increase... they'll get people into those jobs with more aggressive recruiting measures. There are plenty of people out of work or not working... You don't need to gather slaves for this caste system you want to perpetuate and implement... and if you do need to gather your illegal servants to accomplish this...then maybe we shouldn't accomplish this at all... Don't grow fruit here if you don't have the labor to pick it... We aren't starving any time soon, we have a food surplus.

Just because you want cheap orange juice, doesn't mean we should allow illegal caste system labor.
 
Ikari said:
Yup, and hello drastic increase in food costs.
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How drastic do you really think it will be? A nickel a piece for fruits and vegitable? Instead of $2.60 for three ears of corn at the grocery store, you'll pay $2.75?

There are 48 +/- ears in a bushel. Corn farms in the U.S average 170 bushels per acre. If the price goes up just 10 cents an ear, that's an extra $816 per acre. On a one thousand acre farm that's $816,000.

Damn near a million dollar increased revenue on a measly 10 cent increase in price. I don't think it's quite time to start freaking out.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Man, who could have guessed that the majority of Americans have no interest paying the prices for food that would have to be paid to pay farmworkers appropriately for their hard work.
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That's all we did in high school and college: farm work for our friend's farm Fathers; $1.25 an hour, best part was the farmer's wife's meal at lunch; or was it sliding down corn cobs in the corn cribs; throwing pitch forks at rats, walking beans was a bitch;

detasseling pays good money here now; sweet corn is always good; I must have orange tomatoes with my colon; garden's about ready; speaking of yard work, almost time to go back to work; took a break and listening to SF/CHC ;
 
ThoughtEx. said:
how do I know? you don't let 13 million in crops rot because you're hellbent on keeping your wage paid under 15 an hour. They upped the wage and upped the wage, then threw in 401k, and nothing.
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That all depends on the profit that you expect from those crops and the cost of the labor, doesn't it?
 
ThoughtEx. said:
Ya and I'm not amazed that people aren't seeing the real world ramifications. It's not about the wages or having cheap labor. It's about having the labor at all. 90% of the food we eat passes through a migrant laborers hands. And if they are not doing the work, and farmers are offering fair wages and Americans are still not applying, who's going to do the work?

Hmm? We all just going to sit around and starve while patting ourselves on the back?
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Go out there and hire on, if you think it's that big-a-deal.
 
celticwar17 said:
Food prices will rise... Wages will increase... they'll get people into those jobs with more aggressive recruiting measures. There are plenty of people out of work or not working... You don't need to gather slaves for this caste system you want to perpetuate and implement... and if you do need to gather your illegal servants to accomplish this...then maybe we shouldn't accomplish this at all... Don't grow fruit here if you don't have the labor to pick it... We aren't starving any time soon, we have a food surplus.

Just because you want cheap orange juice, doesn't mean we should allow illegal caste system labor.
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Slaveholders made the exact same arguments about the need for slave labor in the south. Meanwhile, poor whites were excluded from the market because of the practice. This is a very similar situation, but now with blacks taking the place of poor whites.
 
celticwar17 said:
Food prices will rise... Wages will increase... they'll get people into those jobs with more aggressive recruiting measures. There are plenty of people out of work or not working... You don't need to gather slaves for this caste system you want to perpetuate and implement... and if you do need to gather your illegal servants to accomplish this...then maybe we shouldn't accomplish this at all... Don't grow fruit here if you don't have the labor to pick it... We aren't starving any time soon, we have a food surplus.

Just because you want cheap orange juice, doesn't mean we should allow illegal caste system labor.
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All of this is an idiotic straw man. No one wants to have slave labor. I'm not against farmers paying better wages, in fact, I ****in hate farmers and hope they all go out of business in time. Time being the key word. We can achieve better results with hydroponics and aeropaunics at a lower cost.

The problem is these farmers can offer 30 dollars an hour, paid vacation, and full retirement. Americans still wont be applying. Which means crops will continue to rot. As far as your bs statement about food surplus'. You realize the food we are talking about is perishable right? I know you're slow, but that slow?

Yes there are plenty of people out of work, so why don't they go get a job in high tech manufacturing? A field were we have huge shortages in labor and have to import immigrants. I mean the pays super good, benefits, the works. Yet Americans aren't applying, hmmmm.

Instead of building a dumb wall that wouldn't work, and scapegoating these people. We need to open our borders and proved a better way for them to come work here legally for a fair wage. And then everyone wins. Except Trump's racist ass.
 
ThoughtEx. said:
Ya and I'm not amazed that people aren't seeing the real world ramifications. It's not about the wages or having cheap labor. It's about having the labor at all. 90% of the food we eat passes through a migrant laborers hands. And if they are not doing the work, and farmers are offering fair wages and Americans are still not applying, who's going to do the work?

Hmm? We all just going to sit around and starve while patting ourselves on the back?
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LOL.

0.006% of our annual crop yield rots and now we're all going to sit around and die!
 
ThoughtEx. said:
All of this is an idiotic straw man. No one wants to have slave labor. I'm not against farmers paying better wages, in fact, I ****in hate farmers and hope they all go out of business in time. Time being the key word. We can achieve better results with hydroponics and aeropaunics at a lower cost.

The problem is these farmers can offer 30 dollars an hour, paid vacation, and full retirement. Americans still wont be applying. Which means crops will continue to rot. As far as your bs statement about food surplus'. You realize the food we are talking about is perishable right? I know you're slow, but that slow?

Yes there are plenty of people out of work, so why don't they go get a job in high tech manufacturing? A field were we have huge shortages in labor and have to import immigrants. I mean the pays super good, benefits, the works. Yet Americans aren't applying, hmmmm.

Instead of building a dumb wall that wouldn't work, and scapegoating these people. We need to open our borders and proved a better way for them to come work here legally for a fair wage. And then everyone wins. Except Trump's racist ass.
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If you don't have the labor to produce the food... don't grow the food... simple as that.. Do you actually think we would starve without illegal second class citizen labor?
 
ThoughtEx. said:
**** that, you couldn't pay me enough to do farm work...

which is my point.
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Do you know who used to pick our crops before foreigners? Teenagers, blacks. Guess who has massive unemployment rates: teenagers, blacks.
 
phattonez said:
Slaveholders made the exact same arguments about the need for slave labor in the south. Meanwhile, poor whites were excluded from the market because of the practice. This is a very similar situation, but now with blacks taking the place of poor whites.
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I would favor say halving welfare to get people back to work in the transition phase; as well, I strongly support a 2-year mandatory AmeriCorps type service for the young; we already see HS requiring 80 hours of community service for graduation;

The college kids and church groups who came from out of state to volunteer when nearby Coal City got hit with tornadoes a few years back were a Godsend; my hours were accepted by our Sons of the American Legion for volunteer work ;
 
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