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Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions[W:460]

Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

Ap, we already know the obedient conservative narratives but as is the case with all obedient conservative narratives, it ignores reality. 4 people in the Trump admin or campaign lied about meeting the Russians.

Cite the law that was broken. If you can't, then the meetings are irrelevant.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

my goodness, you post something that has been proven false by 8 investigations but call me a liar. See con, I don't have to make things up or ignore reality when I post. This is one of the many clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 that Bush ignored.

In July 2001, an FBI agent in the Phoenix field office sent a memo to FBI headquarters and to two agents on international terrorism squads in the New York Field Office, advising of the “possibility of a coordinated effort by Usama Bin Ladin” to send students to the United States to attend civil aviation schools.The agent based his theory on the “inordinate number of individuals of investigative interest” attending such schools in Arizona.8

http://govinfo.library.unt.edu/911/report/911Report.pdf

Now if you can come up with a better reason Bush ignored the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 than "his secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq" I'm all ears. Here's me proving Bush had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq.

And what happened at President Bush's very first National Security Council meeting is one of O'Neill's most startling revelations.

“From the very beginning, there was a conviction, that Saddam Hussein was a bad person and that he needed to go,” says O’Neill, who adds that going after Saddam was topic "A" 10 days after the inauguration - eight months before Sept. 11.

“From the very first instance, it was about Iraq. It was about what we can do to change this regime,” says Suskind. “Day one, these things were laid and sealed.”

Bush Sought 'Way' To Invade Iraq? - CBS News


this is how debate works, make a point, back it up. Repeating "nuh uh" over and over is not debate.

Truferisms, eh?
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

Cite the law that was broken. If you can't, then the meetings are irrelevant.

All you're doing is looking for a string of words to convince yourself. This is a debate forum not a chat room. We know four members of trump's admin or campaign lied about meeting the Russians. I don't have to back up why we have a special prosecutor investigating collusion and obstruction. As with most if not all conservatives, you have a hard time dealing with reality.

Truferisms, eh?
cue the cowardly deflection. You posted something that 8 investigations proved a lie. You called me a liar for posting Bush ignored the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 for his secret day 1 agenda for invading Iraq. I posted just one of the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 that Bush ignored and I proved Bush had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq. Oh, here's another clear and repeated warning Bush ignored. this is also in the 9-11 commission report.

There was substantial disagreement between Minneapolis agents and FBI headquarters as to what Moussaoui was planning to do. In one conversation between a Minneapolis supervisor and a headquarters agent, the latter complained that Minneapolis’s FISA request was couched in a manner intended to get people “spun up.”The supervisor replied that was precisely his intent. He said he was “trying to keep someone from taking a plane and crashing into the World Trade Center.” The headquarters agent replied that this was not going to happen and that they did not know if Moussaoui was a terrorist [/B]
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

my goodness, you post something that has been proven false by 8 investigations but call me a liar. See con, I don't have to make things up or ignore reality when I post. This is one of the many clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 that Bush ignored.

In July 2001, an FBI agent in the Phoenix field office sent a memo to FBI headquarters and to two agents on international terrorism squads in the New York Field Office, advising of the “possibility of a coordinated effort by Usama Bin Ladin” to send students to the United States to attend civil aviation schools.The agent based his theory on the “inordinate number of individuals of investigative interest” attending such schools in Arizona.8

http://govinfo.library.unt.edu/911/report/911Report.pdf

Now if you can come up with a better reason Bush ignored the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 than "his secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq" I'm all ears. Here's me proving Bush had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq.

And what happened at President Bush's very first National Security Council meeting is one of O'Neill's most startling revelations.

“From the very beginning, there was a conviction, that Saddam Hussein was a bad person and that he needed to go,” says O’Neill, who adds that going after Saddam was topic "A" 10 days after the inauguration - eight months before Sept. 11.

“From the very first instance, it was about Iraq. It was about what we can do to change this regime,” says Suskind. “Day one, these things were laid and sealed.”

Bush Sought 'Way' To Invade Iraq? - CBS News


this is how debate works, make a point, back it up. Repeating "nuh uh" over and over is not debate.

The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 is a United States Congressional statement of policy stating that "It should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq..." It was signed into law by President Bill Clinton

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Liberation_Act
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 is a United States Congressional statement of policy stating that "It should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq..." It was signed into law by President Bill Clinton

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Liberation_Act

I don't equate "supporting efforts" with "letting 9-11" happen. Do you? Oh and what about the fact that AP posted the Benghazi lie but called me a liar. There were many layers to our conversation.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

I don't equate "supporting efforts" with "letting 9-11" happen. Do you? Oh and what about the fact that AP posted the Benghazi lie but called me a liar. There were many layers to our conversation.

"I don't equate "supporting efforts" with "letting 9-11" happen."

"Letting" 9/11 happen is no more than piss-poor conspiracy theory.

"Do you?"

Do you still beat your wife ??

"Oh and what about the fact that AP posted the Benghazi lie but called me a liar. There were many layers to our conversation."

I have no idea WTF you're talking about, do you ??
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

That, IMO, is just hot air that people seem to love saying. Politics has, and always will, require wheeling and dealing with the powers of a nation, and outside a nation to a degree.
To suggest that a party isn't for the little guy because of that, is absurd.

Clearly Bernie and to a lesser extent, HRC ran on a platform that was far more pro middle/lower class, then Republicans ever implement IMO. We can detail it I'm sure, but I wrote my one long post for the day.
Its not hot air at all. Political influence is for sale and it comes at a high price.

As for which party offers the little guy the best is a matter of opinion. I see pros and cons in both ideological positions. I favor less goverance and more independence.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

Its not hot air at all. Political influence is for sale and it comes at a high price.
As for which party offers the little guy the best is a matter of opinion. I see pros and cons in both ideological positions. I favor less governance and more independence.
Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
Which is a fools errand. Removing government doesn't equate to independence, that's a false choice that libertarian idealists just can't mentally get over. Governments are not monolithic either, our government is much different than say, Russia's.

Freedom is largely about power. When the average person no longer has either an enormous union/social group to bolster their power, or a reasonable government granted such power for the people, it's the rich/powerful that call the shots. So much for your "independence".

Instead of hating on government, try shaping it to ensure it protects important freedoms for everyone, and limits those who would infringe on individual freedoms. Either that, or just wish for it...surely that's a better play...
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

This is setting an untenable precedent.

The next time a Democrat gets into office the Republicans are going to spend the entire first term investigating them for any potential, possible, devastating to national security contacts with unsavory characters. Then the next Republican elected will be water boarded until they confess to something and the circle will continue.

This isn't about politics and it's not about national security. It's about a political outsider getting elected and the political insiders getting their panties in a bunch. That's all it's about and the shenanigans really need to stop.

Trump isn't a political outsider as much as he is a normal person outsider. That he managed to suck half the electorate into his megalomaniacal orbit, and manages still to keep them sucked there, is a tragedy for the nation.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

Which is a fools errand. Removing government doesn't equate to independence, that's a false choice that libertarian idealists just can't mentally get over. Governments are not monolithic either, our government is much different than say, Russia's.

Freedom is largely about power. When the average person no longer has either an enormous union/social group to bolster their power, or a reasonable government granted such power for the people, it's the rich/powerful that call the shots. So much for your "independence".

Instead of hating on government, try shaping it to ensure it protects important freedoms for everyone, and limits those who would infringe on individual freedoms. Either that, or just wish for it...surely that's a better play...
I dont hate on government. It serves a very important role. I think it has grown too big and controlling. The difference in our opinion is that you think bigger gov works to the advantage of the lower classes and i see it as the opposite. I see it making rules to help the rich stay rich and keep the poor being poor

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...o-expand-probe-to-trump-business-transactions

It's been my opinion for the past couple months that it will be finances and not Russian collusion that will end up being the most harmful story for the Trump administration. This is supported by years of assiduously refusing to reveal his tax returns, and a damning paragraph in yesterday's NYTimes article only underscores the point:



Trump absolutely loathes the Russia story because, if we accept Trump's own statements, he feels Russian interference and the investigation into collusion undermines the legitimacy of his Presidency. To put the the financial aspect into perspective, he prefers that we focus on Russia.

First of all, Trump is right about that. Mueller is tasked to investigate Russian interference in the 2016 election, not comb through 20 years of Trump tax returns looking for errors. In the absence of collusion during the campaign, I don't see how some shady business deal 10 years ago could possible cause Trumps removal from office. First of all, it would take years to put a case like that together and longer to litigate. But the idea that Mueller is investigating old business dealings might mean that there isn't much to the collusion story.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

I dont hate on government. It serves a very important role. I think it has grown too big and controlling. The difference in our opinion is that you think bigger gov works to the advantage of the lower classes and i see it as the opposite. I see it making rules to help the rich stay rich and keep the poor being poo

What world do you live in though? How is government, the largest employer in the United States, with trillions of dollars in power and thousands upon thousands of regulations, etc., interfering with your life on a daily basis?

Taxes, which aren't going anywhere, is about it for most people. Really, what's this massive control that's just gotten way too big, that you're so dismayed about? Social safety nets like social security and medicare/aid? Come on, this is all just political propaganda from the right when you look closely at it. Just like all the right-wing drones that claim we pay way too much in taxes...when it's not only lower than they realize, it's probably half that of the rest of the developed world.

But really, look at the Republican success while in full control of the WH and congress. They can't do ****, because none of their positions make sense. The only thing they *really* want is to cut taxes on the wealthy. They proposed FIVE way to do that recently. cut income tax, estate tax, corporate tax, capital gains tax, and remove the alternative minimum tax. Net effect is the wealthy benefit from the vast majority of their cuts.

And who suffers? The average person.

Call it like you see it.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

I didn't ask you for excuses to continue to rationalize "death panels" that exists only your mind. I simply pointed out that the same people telling you "corrupt" are the same people who lied to you that President Obama was born in Kenya, his BC was a forgery, he wanted to kill old people, the stimulus will cause hyper inflation, dollar collapse, market to zero and of course the vile and disgusting stand down lies.

No one said obama was born in kenya

How could anyone including obama apologists say where he was born when no redible observer has seen or physically examined his actual birth ertificate?
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

"I don't equate "supporting efforts" with "letting 9-11" happen."

"Letting" 9/11 happen is no more than piss-poor conspiracy theory.
"

I think I understand your problem. You don't know what a "piss-poor conspiracy theory" is. "President Obama wants to kill old people" or "is a secret muslim terrorist" is a piss poor conspiracy theory. there was no factual reason to believe it. But the fact that I can point out the clear and repeated warnings combined with Bush doing absolutely nothing makes mine a good theory. You can flail but you cant dispute the actual facts. And again, I don't have to invent things or ignore reality to say Bush ignored the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 because he did exactly that. So I think we're in agreement that my theory has moved up from "piss-poor" to good.

Lets move it up the scale some more. I've also given a perfectly logical reason why bush would ignore the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11. And I don't have to make anything up (use that metric for every conservative narrative you believe) because Bush did nothing and he had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq. That makes the theory better.

Lets get the theory to "excellent". I've posted 2 FBI reports of "TERRORISTS IN FLIGHT SCHOOLS" that were ignored. They didn't stumble upon these terrorists. The FBI was told to monitor flight schools. Just so you understand, they didn't find something odd that they didn't know what to make of it. They found something they were looking for. And don't forget, I've already posted the blurb from the 9-11 commission of the Minneapolis FBI agent arguing with someone at HQ. What shreds the " it fell through the cracks" excuse conservatives like to parrot is that the guy at HQ sabotaged the Minneapolis search warrant request.

The fact is that key FBIHQ personnel whose job it was to assist and coordinate with field division agents on terrorism investigations and the obtaining and use of FISA searches (and who theoretically were privy to many more sources of intelligence information than field division agents), continued to, almost inexplicably,5 throw up roadblocks and undermine Minneapolis' by-now desperate efforts to obtain a FISA search warrant, long after the French intelligence service provided its information and probable cause became clear. HQ personnel brought up almost ridiculous questions in their apparent efforts to undermine the probable cause.6 In all of their conversations and correspondence, HQ personnel never disclosed to the Minneapolis agents that the Phoenix Division had, only approximately three weeks earlier, warned of Al Qaeda operatives in flight schools seeking flight training for terrorist purposes!

TIME.com: Coleen Rowley's Memo to FBI Director Robert Mueller

So in case you missed the point, it didn't fall through the cracks. It was pushed into the crack. Read this part again "almost inexplicably,5 throw up roadblocks and undermine Minneapolis' by-now desperate efforts to obtain a FISA search warrant" So in case you missed the point, its "almost inexplicable" if you assume we had a president who wanted to prevent terrorist attacks in America. Its quite "explicable" if say someone had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq. So my theory is excellent.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

What world do you live in though? How is government, the largest employer in the United States, with trillions of dollars in power and thousands upon thousands of regulations, etc., interfering with your life on a daily basis?
Are you kidding?? You must still be in college, or never held a job and certainly never attempted to run a business of your own, or attempted to purchase the health insurance plan, or purchased a product. I suspect if you have spent your life living in mommy and daddys house under the bed, you have no experience with governmental control or regulation.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

No one said obama was born in kenya

How could anyone including obama apologists say where he was born when no redible observer has seen or physically examined his actual birth ertificate?

You my friend have the worst case of Romnesia ever recorded in human history. The usual "flail" is for you to say that you didn't believe he was born in kenya. But since you have the worst case of Romnesia ever recorded in human history, you posted "no one said that". That is remarkable. And fyi, he not only posted his BC on his campaign website, he let credible observers see it. That's when you and yours started claiming it was a forgery. The reason you don't remember is because again, you have worst case of Romnesia ever recorded in human history.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

I think I understand your problem. You don't know what a "piss-poor conspiracy theory" is. "President Obama wants to kill old people" or "is a secret muslim terrorist" is a piss poor conspiracy theory. there was no factual reason to believe it. But the fact that I can point out the clear and repeated warnings combined with Bush doing absolutely nothing makes mine a good theory. You can flail but you cant dispute the actual facts. And again, I don't have to invent things or ignore reality to say Bush ignored the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11 because he did exactly that. So I think we're in agreement that my theory has moved up from "piss-poor" to good.

Lets move it up the scale some more. I've also given a perfectly logical reason why bush would ignore the clear and repeated warnings of 9-11. And I don't have to make anything up (use that metric for every conservative narrative you believe) because Bush did nothing and he had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq. That makes the theory better.

Lets get the theory to "excellent". I've posted 2 FBI reports of "TERRORISTS IN FLIGHT SCHOOLS" that were ignored. They didn't stumble upon these terrorists. The FBI was told to monitor flight schools. Just so you understand, they didn't find something odd that they didn't know what to make of it. They found something they were looking for. And don't forget, I've already posted the blurb from the 9-11 commission of the Minneapolis FBI agent arguing with someone at HQ. What shreds the " it fell through the cracks" excuse conservatives like to parrot is that the guy at HQ sabotaged the Minneapolis search warrant request.

The fact is that key FBIHQ personnel whose job it was to assist and coordinate with field division agents on terrorism investigations and the obtaining and use of FISA searches (and who theoretically were privy to many more sources of intelligence information than field division agents), continued to, almost inexplicably,5 throw up roadblocks and undermine Minneapolis' by-now desperate efforts to obtain a FISA search warrant, long after the French intelligence service provided its information and probable cause became clear. HQ personnel brought up almost ridiculous questions in their apparent efforts to undermine the probable cause.6 In all of their conversations and correspondence, HQ personnel never disclosed to the Minneapolis agents that the Phoenix Division had, only approximately three weeks earlier, warned of Al Qaeda operatives in flight schools seeking flight training for terrorist purposes!

TIME.com: Coleen Rowley's Memo to FBI Director Robert Mueller

So in case you missed the point, it didn't fall through the cracks. It was pushed into the crack. Read this part again "almost inexplicably,5 throw up roadblocks and undermine Minneapolis' by-now desperate efforts to obtain a FISA search warrant" So in case you missed the point, its "almost inexplicable" if you assume we had a president who wanted to prevent terrorist attacks in America. Its quite "explicable" if say someone had a secret day 1 agenda to invade Iraq. So my theory is excellent.

Oh vern, you know that engaging in that sort of CT nonsense is against doctors orders. No rational mind can hold the conflicting thoughts that you spew out here. Bush cannot be both a bumbling idiot and the mastermind of 9/11. I know its important that you maintain your democrats good, republicans evil mindset, but its getting harder and harder to take you seriously.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

OMG! :lamo

That's going to provide years of entertainment! :lamo

If you are going to entertain yourself with very obvious things... Sun rises in the east and sets in the west. There... have a ball.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

First of all, Trump is right about that. Mueller is tasked to investigate Russian interference in the 2016 election, not comb through 20 years of Trump tax returns looking for errors. In the absence of collusion during the campaign, I don't see how some shady business deal 10 years ago could possible cause Trumps removal from office. First of all, it would take years to put a case like that together and longer to litigate. But the idea that Mueller is investigating old business dealings might mean that there isn't much to the collusion story.

If he finds crimes that arise out of his investigation into the initial scope of the investigation, he can go there.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

You my friend have the worst case of Romnesia ever recorded in human history.



The usual "flail" is for you to say that you didn't believe he was born in kenya.

But since you have the worst case of Romnesia ever recorded in human history, you posted "no one said that". That is remarkable. And fyi, he not only posted his BC on his campaign website, he let credible observers see it. That's when you and yours started claiming it was a forgery. The reason you don't remember is because again, you have worst case of Romnesia ever recorded in human history.

Sorry about that

Try hitting on high school kids who are still figuring libs out
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

No one said obama was born in kenya

LOL. The only people who can say that have the memory of gnats, or were asleep/coma/drunk/stoned for much of the Obama years.

How could anyone including obama apologists say where he was born when no redible observer has seen or physically examined his actual birth ertificate?

Likewise, who can say where Trump was born, or Bush I or Bush II or Reagan or Carter or Nixon or LBJ or Ford, etc.?? The standard that to verify Politician X was born in city Y is for a partisan to physically examine that politician's BC was an entirely new standard that for some reason has in our history only EVER applied to the black guy with a funny name.

BTW, wonder when Trump's panel will issue the findings on its investigation into the Obama birther stuff? Or did I miss it, and can you provide a link to its findings? Bottom line is Trump's status as political con man telling lies to the gullible started then and hasn't changed. We knew all we needed to know at that point and for some reason, nearly half the public didn't listen.
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

Your making a bunch of assumptions about me and you have the nerve to be condescending about it. Why, because I dont share your self rightous opinion. Your awfully high on yourself. I at least to other peoples views and give them consideration. I dont need to agree with someone to respect them.

What world do you live in though? How is government, the largest employer in the United States, with trillions of dollars in power and thousands upon thousands of regulations, etc., interfering with your life on a daily basis?

The trillions of dollars and thousands of regulations make our lives much more expensive and it makes it much more difficult for small guys to compete with the big boys. Thats how it interferes with my life.

Taxes, which aren't going anywhere, is about it for most people. Really, what's this massive control that's just gotten way too big, that you're so dismayed about? Social safety nets like social security and medicare/aid? Come on, this is all just political propaganda from the right when you look closely at it. Just like all the right-wing drones that claim we pay way too much in taxes...when it's not only lower than they realize, it's probably half that of the rest of the developed world.


But really, look at the Republican success while in full control of the WH and congress. They can't do ****, because none of their positions make sense. The only thing they *really* want is to cut taxes on the wealthy. They proposed FIVE way to do that recently. cut income tax, estate tax, corporate tax, capital gains tax, and remove the alternative minimum tax. Net effect is the wealthy benefit from the vast majority of their cuts.

And who suffers? The average person.

Call it like you see it.

I could care less about taxes. You can thank Reagan for turning defict spending into a national past time. You dont need taxes to finance your self rithgous crusades. Borrow more from future generations just like always. Spend spend spend, your worth it. Your allturism is more important than my childrens future and my independence.





Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

No one said obama was born in kenya

His grandmother in Kenya said, ‘Oh, no, he was born in Kenya and I was there and I witnessed the birth.’ She’s on tape. I think that tape’s going to be produced fairly soon. Somebody is coming out with a book in two weeks, it will be very interesting.

Donald Trump - April 7, 2011, on MSNBC's "Morning Joe"

"He didn't know he was running for president, so he told the truth. The literary agent wrote down what he said ... He said he was born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia ... Now they're saying it was a mistake. Just like his Kenyan grandmother said he was born in Kenya, and she pointed down the road to the hospital, and after people started screaming at her, she said, 'Oh, I mean Hawaii.' Give me a break."

Donald Trump - May 24, 2012, interview with The Daily Beast's Lloyd Grove, responding to an erroneous report about Obama

"There are three things that could happen. And one of them did happen. He was perhaps born in Kenya. Very simple, OK? He was perhaps born in this country. But said he was born in Kenya because if you say you were born in Kenya, you got aid and you got into colleges. People were doing that. So perhaps he was born in this country, and that has a very big chance. Or, you know, who knows?"

Donald Trump - May 27, 2014, in remarks at the National Press Club​
 
Re: Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions

The trillions of dollars and thousands of regulations make our lives much more expensive and it makes it much more difficult for small guys to compete with the big boys. Thats how it interferes with my life.

So because you "feel" thee government is too big and makes your life too difficult, without citing a single example, you think that's a respectful way to debate?

How about citing specific, significant examples? I mean, if it's the #1 priority on how you vote, you'd think you could rattle of half a dozen legit issues without this hand waiving you're doing.
 
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