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Russian Government Sought to Aid Trump’s Candidacy, According to Email

Cardinal said:
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/10/us/politics/donald-trump-jr-russia-email-candidacy.html?_r=0

July 10, 2017: the day the Republican narrative officially transformed from "collusion is a hoax" into "yes, there was collusion but meh, whatever."
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IT'S THIS SIMPLE....How do you collude with someone by GIVING THEM NOTHING?. Who in the world of political campaigns
would NOT listen to alleged wrongdoings of their opponent?

All of the bombshells from all of the leaks, you have bought into hook, line & sinker & hear we go again. So many Trump haters,
are either in misery or high on a crest over this collusion nonsense. I wonder if your families are beginning to worry
about you loosing your minds hysterically because Trump is president.
 
Someone made this surprisingly helpful flowchart. All these Russian names are hard to keep in order.

DEaUf0IXcAE_phB.jpg
 
slick said:
IT'S THIS SIMPLE....How do you collude with someone by GIVING THEM NOTHING?. Who in the world of political campaigns
would NOT listen to alleged wrongdoings of their opponent?

All of the bombshells from all of the leaks, you have bought into hook, line & sinker & hear we go again. So many Trump haters,
are either in misery or high on a crest over this collusion nonsense. I wonder if your families are beginning to worry
about you loosing your minds hysterically because Trump is president.
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why no officer i am not buying drugs, i simply gave him $100 for this tiny bag of creatine

like the drug buyer, junior got burned trying to make an illegal transaction

i am anticipating the special investigator will burn him yet again
 
Cardinal said:
Apparently, the ones hanging their hats on Russia was Manafort, Kushner and Donald Trump Jr., seeing as they were so desperate for dirt on Clinton that they broke the law to try getting it.
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What law did they break? How did they break it?
 
Thoreau72 said:
What law did they break? How did they break it?
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First, a reframing of the way we think of collusion. Collusion actually is a political term; there's no line in the criminal code that says you go to jail for colluding with a foreign adversary.

But you can go to jail for conspiring with a foreign adversary to influence or undermine an election, and Jacobovitz thinks what Trump Jr. did, as documented by emails he himself shared on Twitter, could rise to that level.

“Absolutely,” Jacobovitz replied when asked if these emails firm up evidence that Trump Jr. had intent to commit a crime by conspiring with the Russians. “You may have crossed the line on conspiracy to commit election fraud or conspiracy to obtain information from a foreign adversary,” he said. “You cannot benefit from a foreign adversary in this kind of scenario.”
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ave-just-crossed-the-legal-line-on-collusion/
 
cpwill said:
The "information" was supposed to be that Russia was actively supporting the DNC, including with funds, and was supposed to come from a private Russian lawyer (whom, because apparently the Trump campaign staff wasn't exactly high-speed when it came to vetting, actually has ties to the Kremlin. We have no idea whether or not Jr knew this).


I realize there is a large contingent on the left who are not past the "Bargaining" phase..... but please. Stop pinning your hopes on the idea that anything run by Trump will be super-effective, or capable of keeping secrets. Trump is not a Manchurian Candidate; if nothing else, for the simple reason that he would be unable to avoid bragging about it on Twitter, were it so.
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Trump has spent his life hiding secrets of illegal "deals" he has made. He takes great pride in "outsmarting" the law every chance he gets. Now that his deals are all going to come to light he is doomed. He really did not expect to win and it is looking like Putin screwed him on that hope.
 
Cardinal said:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ave-just-crossed-the-legal-line-on-collusion/
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As it has been since Hillary and DNC broke the story, speculation is all there is to it. Maybe this, maybe that.

For such a supposedly high quality outfit as WaPo, maybe I missed it but nobody has cited any statute that was violated. No Title 18, Crimes and Criminal Procedures, reference.

Pure tabloid trash. I see more interesting stories in the National Enquirer while standing in line in the grocery store.
 
Thoreau72 said:
As it has been since Hillary and DNC broke the story, speculation is all there is to it. Maybe this, maybe that.

For such a supposedly high quality outfit as WaPo, maybe I missed it but nobody has cited any statute that was violated. No Title 18, Crimes and Criminal Procedures, reference.

Pure tabloid trash. I see more interesting stories in the National Enquirer while standing in line in the grocery store.
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Everything is through Jr.'s own admission. Read the emails that Boy Wonder himself released to the public just this morning.

As for statutes...

Title 11, Chapter I, Subchapter A, Part 110, Section 110.20(b)

A foreign national shall not, directly or indirectly, make a contribution or a donation of money or other thing of value, or expressly or impliedly promise to make a contribution or a donation, in connection with any Federal, State, or local election

[USC03] 52 USC 30121: Contributions and donations by foreign nationals
 
Mithros said:
It is illegal for a campaign to accept not just campaign donations, but anything of monetary value from a foreign national. That would include even legally obtained opposition research.
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1. Good luck making that argument, that somehow that counts as an in-kind donation.
2. Entertainingly, though, I'm 100% positive that it wasn't an issue the Clintons wanted to bring up, given their history of taking foreign money.
 
iguanaman said:
Trump has spent his life hiding secrets of illegal "deals" he has made. He takes great pride in "outsmarting" the law every chance he gets. Now that his deals are all going to come to light he is doomed. He really did not expect to win and it is looking like Putin screwed him on that hope.
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You got it, Iguanaman. Trump is secretly a genius, and the moronic-mouth-on-twitter routine is just a super duper secret identity.


yeesh.
 
Cardinal said:
Someone made this surprisingly helpful flowchart. All these Russian names are hard to keep in order.

View attachment 67219911
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:lol:

tumblr_of0s9kATLk1shfrlxo1_1280.png
 
Anyone want to bet money Comey fed this story to the NYTs ?
 
Cardinal said:
Hmm. Let's get the old cpwill from the days of debate yore back, shall we?
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:shrug: I had little time for the But-If-You-Connect-These-Three-Dots-Obama's-Certificate-Was-Falsified conservatives, and I don't think much of the "Lots Of Random Information..... [Something Happens]..... Trump Impeachment!!!!!" liberal fantasies that are out there, either.


Trump is neither smart nor disciplined enough to run an effective conspiracy. Love you, bro, but get past the bargaining phase. This is where America is, now.
 
Cardinal said:
Everything is through Jr.'s own admission. Read the emails that Boy Wonder himself released to the public just this morning.

As for statutes...

Title 11, Chapter I, Subchapter A, Part 110, Section 110.20(b)

A foreign national shall not, directly or indirectly, make a contribution or a donation of money or other thing of value, or expressly or impliedly promise to make a contribution or a donation, in connection with any Federal, State, or local election

[USC03] 52 USC 30121: Contributions and donations by foreign nationals
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But Trump junior is not a foreign national, this only incriminates the person he met. Am I missing another law that applies to citizens?
 
cpwill said:
:shrug: I had little time for the But-If-You-Connect-These-Three-Dots-Obama's-Certificate-Was-Falsified conservatives, and I don't think much of the "Lots Of Random Information..... [Something Happens]..... Trump Impeachment!!!!!" liberal fantasies that are out there, either.


Trump is neither smart nor disciplined enough to run an effective conspiracy. Love you, bro, but get past the bargaining phase. This is where America is, now.
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That wasn't an imaginary connect-the-dots image. It was literally the relationship of names as they apply to a barrage of legitimate news stories that just slammed the public. You're implying the flowchart is akin to a conspiracy theory for no better reason than that it's a jpeg.

I don't know what you're talking about with this "bargaining" thing. I brought up the topic of impeachment roughly around February, but I'm fairly sure that's the last time I seriously broached that topic.
 
L0neW0lf said:
But Trump junior is not a foreign national, this only incriminates the person he met. Am I missing another law that applies to citizens?
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The foreign national would be Veselnitskaya, and the law would apply to Jr. meeting with her.
 
Cardinal said:
That wasn't an imaginary connect-the-dots image. It was literally the relationship of names as they apply to a barrage of legitimate news stories that just slammed the public. You're implying the flowchart is akin to a conspiracy theory for no better reason than that it's a jpeg.

I don't know what you're talking about with this "bargaining" thing. I brought up the topic of impeachment roughly around February, but I'm fairly sure that's the last time I seriously broached that topic.
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The Five Stages of Grief

I'm implying that the notion that this is all some kind of grand conspiracy in which the Trump campaign colluded with the Russian government is... in fact... a conspiracy theory... since it's a theory.... about a conspiracy.

Nobody is surprised that Trump has business ties with Russian oligarchs, that has also never been hidden - he did business in Russia. Would Jr have loved to have gotten some real dirt on Hillary? Yup. Is Trump some kind of Super Secret PuppetMaster Pulling The Strings On A Grand Conspiracy To Overthrow Democracy? Nope.

:shrug: it's a reach. It's a very, very far reach. And folks are leaping on it, like it's the surest thing since Hillary's Underground Childrape Pizza Parlor.
 
cpwill said:
The Five Stages of Grief

I'm implying that the notion that this is all some kind of grand conspiracy in which the Trump campaign colluded with the Russian government is... in fact... a conspiracy theory... since it's a theory.... about a conspiracy.

Nobody is surprised that Trump has business ties with Russian oligarchs, that has also never been hidden - he did business in Russia. Would Jr have loved to have gotten some real dirt on Hillary? Yup. Is Trump some kind of Super Secret PuppetMaster Pulling The Strings On A Grand Conspiracy To Overthrow Democracy? Nope.

:shrug: it's a reach. It's a very, very far reach. And folks are leaping on it, like it's the surest thing since Hillary's Underground Childrape Pizza Parlor.
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It sounds like you're the one dealing with the five stages of grief, dude.
 
Cardinal said:
It sounds like you're the one dealing with the five stages of grief, dude.
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Nope. That was April 2016, when I was still working through the but-if-it-goes-to-Convention-and-Cruz-wins-over-the-delegates-after-the-first-vote......


:shrug: this episode shows (again) that the Trump campaign is made up of incompetent and immoral liars. It just doesn't seem to show illegal activity.
 
MTAtech said:
What about "Donald Trump Jr. was informed in an email that the material was part of a Russian government effort to aid his father’s candidacy," isn't clear? One can't claim he didn't know that the material came from the Russian govt when the email he received explicitly said it was.

1st, the Trump team claimed that there were no meetings.
2nd, when it was discovered that there were meetings, they said they were get to know you meetings or about policy.
Now, we learn all that was BS and proof of collusion.
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At the very least, an effort was made by the 45 campaign to coordinate.
 
cpwill said:
You got it, Iguanaman. Trump is secretly a genius, and the moronic-mouth-on-twitter routine is just a super duper secret identity.


yeesh.
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I wouldn't use that word for a sleazy lying scumbag who uses his money and his lawyers to skirt the law in every way possible. He learned from his father the slumlord. He thinks his twittering is smart BTW. It's just another reason he believes he can get away with the sleazy/illegal **** he does. He's special you know.
 
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iguanaman said:
I wouldn't use that word for a sleazy lying scumbag who uses his money and his lawyers to skirt the law in every way possible. He learned from his father the slumlord.
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His father is secretly Barack Obama's first political benefactor?

Man. Donnie Sr sure is going to be surprised.
 
cpwill said:
Nope. That was April 2016, when I was still working through the but-if-it-goes-to-Convention-and-Cruz-wins-over-the-delegates-after-the-first-vote......


:shrug: this episode shows (again) that the Trump campaign is made up of incompetent and immoral liars. It just doesn't seem to show illegal activity.
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You're defending Trump Jr. After all, the defense of Fredo is that he was just weak and stupid and didn't really understand what he was doing.

Are you doing this consciously or by accident? At this moment I can't say.
 
Cardinal said:
You're defending Trump. After all, the defense of Fredo is that he was just weak and stupid and didn't really understand what he was doing.

Are you doing this consciously or by accident? At this moment I can't say.
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If you honestly think "This is monumentally stupid and unethical, but I don't think it's illegal" is "defending Trump".......


I reminds me of the Trumpistas. Any critique of their orange god meant you were a secret Hillary agent :roll:


It's like there's this weird dynamic in American politics right now where not being deliberately inaccurate in defense of your tribe or in attack of theirs is somehow immoral.


Sent from my XT1526 using Tapatalk
 
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