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Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted assur

Rogue Valley

Rogue Valley

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Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted assurances on election meddling

By David Filipov and Damian Paletta July 8, 2017

HAMBURG — A Kremlin spokesman on Saturday defended Russia’s top diplomat’s account of President Trump’s closed-door discussion with Russian President Vladimir Putin about Moscow’s interference in the 2016 U.S. election. After the two presidents met Friday, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov told reporters that Trump, after listening to Putin’s denial that he had overseen a hacking and disinformation campaign, had accepted those assurances and dismissed the U.S. investigation into Russian interference. Tillerson said at a separate news conference that Putin, along with the denials, had nonetheless agreed to bilateral talks to address preventing future interference in U.S. elections. The highly anticipated meeting of Trump and Putin during the G-20, eight months after a presidential election that U.S. intelligence agencies say Russia tried to sway, was unique in the annals of modern U.S. history. It pitted Trump, under fire at home for alleged collusion with Russia, against the man accused of overseeing that interference.

When Tillerson and Lavrov emerged with different accounts of how the meeting had gone, it caused a stir that overshadowed the other outcomes — a deal on a partial cease-fire in the Syrian war and an agreement to hold bilateral talks on a range of issues. And the session offered little clarity on the question of Russian election interference, which had made this the most anticipated meeting between a U.S. president and his Russian counterpart in recent memory. Instead, both sides indicated that they wanted to move beyond the subject Lavrov came away from the meeting saying Trump had heard out Putin’s assurances that Moscow did not run a hacking and disinformation effort, and had dismissed the entire U.S. investigation into the Russian role. “The U.S. president said that he heard clear statements from President Putin about this being untrue and that he accepted these statements,” Lavrov told Russian reporters. U.S. intelligence agencies have concluded that Putin ordered a campaign of cyberattacks and propaganda last year aimed at undermining the presidential election and helping Trump by discrediting his Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton. The Justice Department has named a special counsel to investigate possible coordination between Trump’s associates and Russian officials during the campaign.
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Firstly, I'm surprised that Trump brought up Russia's election meddling at all. Of course Putin would deny the evidence-based accusation. It's what Putin does. Invade neighbors, sow discord globally, and deny all allegations. I'll give Trump props for bringing up Russia's attack during the meeting, but also acknowledge the domestic political pressure to do so was immense.

Who is telling the truth regarding what came of this confrontation? I'm inclined to believe Lavrov. On 6 July in Poland when asked about Russian meddling in the 2016 US election by a reporter, Trump said this: "Nobody really knows for sure."

In short, the day before meeting with Putin, Trump refused to definitively call-out/finger Moscow. I think Lavrov has it right. When Trump asked and Putin denied, Trump probably said something like "I accept that you didn't attack us, but I had to ask you personally because of sweeping political considerations back home. Your personal denial is good enough for me Vladimir. Now let's move on to other matters." In effect, throwing the US intelligence community under the bus.

I wonder what Trumps excuse/attitude will be come 2018/2020. Without a clear and compelling reason to stop, Putin will certainly increase Russian election meddling exponentially.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

I think Trump bought what Putin was selling because the United States is now entering into a joint cyber security working group with Russia. That seems like a very strange thing to do if he actually thought Russia meddled in the election.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Rogue Valley said:
Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted assurances on election meddling



Firstly, I'm surprised that Trump brought up Russia's election meddling at all. Of course Putin would deny the evidence-based accusation. It's what Putin does. Invade neighbors, sow discord globally, and deny all allegations. I'll give Trump props for bringing up Russia's attack during the meeting, but also acknowledge the domestic political pressure to do so was immense.

Who is telling the truth regarding what came of this confrontation? I'm inclined to believe Lavrov. On 6 July in Poland when asked about Russian meddling in the 2016 US election by a reporter, Trump said this: "Nobody really knows for sure."

In short, the day before meeting with Putin, Trump refused to definitively call-out/finger Moscow. I think Lavrov has it right. When Trump asked and Putin denied, Trump probably said something like "I accept that you didn't attack us, but I had to ask you personally because of sweeping political considerations back home. Your personal denial is good enough for me Vladimir. Now let's move on to other matters." In effect, throwing the US intelligence community under the bus.

I wonder what Trumps excuse/attitude will be come 2018/2020. Without a clear and compelling reason to stop, Putin will certainly increase Russian election meddling exponentially.
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The big problem anti-Trump forces have is trying to maintain any kind of coherent message.

The Russians are not to be trusted they say. Don't trust them when they say they didn't interfere in the election. Trump and Putin are in bed together and they shouldn't be trusted, they say. On and on it goes.

Yet, when a Russian who shouldn't be trusted, claims something that feeds the anti-Trump narrative, he should be trusted.

Is it that difficult to see how all this is viewed by those outside the liberal/socialist progressive bubble?
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Rogue Valley said:
Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted assurances on election meddling



Firstly, I'm surprised that Trump brought up Russia's election meddling at all. Of course Putin would deny the evidence-based accusation. It's what Putin does. Invade neighbors, sow discord globally, and deny all allegations. I'll give Trump props for bringing up Russia's attack during the meeting, but also acknowledge the domestic political pressure to do so was immense.

Who is telling the truth regarding what came of this confrontation? I'm inclined to believe Lavrov. On 6 July in Poland when asked about Russian meddling in the 2016 US election by a reporter, Trump said this: "Nobody really knows for sure."

In short, the day before meeting with Putin, Trump refused to definitively call-out/finger Moscow. I think Lavrov has it right. When Trump asked and Putin denied, Trump probably said something like "I accept that you didn't attack us, but I had to ask you personally because of sweeping political considerations back home. Your personal denial is good enough for me Vladimir. Now let's move on to other matters." In effect, throwing the US intelligence community under the bus.

I wonder what Trumps excuse/attitude will be come 2018/2020. Without a clear and compelling reason to stop, Putin will certainly increase Russian election meddling exponentially.
Click to expand...

I listened to an interview with Tillerson regarding the meeting.

I thought the nugget from that interview was that Trump and Putin agreed that neither man nor the countries they represent is happy with what has come before, but that both men and the countries they represent need to be mindful that the future starts now.

I have said many times to many people who regret where they have arrived at a particularly bad moment in their life that the only place anyone may start anything is from the point on which they currently stand.

Isn't it funny that 7 decades of deception and threats is thought to be fixable in a 2 hour meeting?
 
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Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

MrPeanut said:
I think Trump bought what Putin was selling because the United States is now entering into a joint cyber security working group with Russia. That seems like a very strange thing to do if he actually thought Russia meddled in the election.
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Do you have a link to support this thought?
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

The OP means the FBI will work all the harder on the interference and collusion investigations.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Rogue Valley said:
Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted assurances on election meddling



Firstly, I'm surprised that Trump brought up Russia's election meddling at all. Of course Putin would deny the evidence-based accusation. It's what Putin does. Invade neighbors, sow discord globally, and deny all allegations. I'll give Trump props for bringing up Russia's attack during the meeting, but also acknowledge the domestic political pressure to do so was immense.

Who is telling the truth regarding what came of this confrontation? I'm inclined to believe Lavrov. On 6 July in Poland when asked about Russian meddling in the 2016 US election by a reporter, Trump said this: "Nobody really knows for sure."

In short, the day before meeting with Putin, Trump refused to definitively call-out/finger Moscow. I think Lavrov has it right. When Trump asked and Putin denied, Trump probably said something like "I accept that you didn't attack us, but I had to ask you personally because of sweeping political considerations back home. Your personal denial is good enough for me Vladimir. Now let's move on to other matters." In effect, throwing the US intelligence community under the bus.

I wonder what Trumps excuse/attitude will be come 2018/2020. Without a clear and compelling reason to stop, Putin will certainly increase Russian election meddling exponentially.
Click to expand...

Trump: "Did you interfere in our election?"
Putin: "No."
Trump: turns to audience and rolls his eyes, "Okay, I brought up Russian election meddling. ARE YOU HAPPY NOW??"
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

MrPeanut said:
I think Trump bought what Putin was selling because the United States is now entering into a joint cyber security working group with Russia. That seems like a very strange thing to do if he actually thought Russia meddled in the election.
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Might as well as enter a joint anti-terrorist security working group with ISIS.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Cardinal said:
Trump: "Did you interfere in our election?"
Putin: "No."
Trump: turns to audience and rolls his eyes, "Okay, I brought up Russian election meddling. ARE YOU HAPPY NOW??"
Click to expand...

Was there an audience to this meeting?

You imagine it one way.

I imagine that these two powerful and forceful leaders considered this topic on various levels and probably laughed about the reaction from the American press and the Democrats when they considered that particular level.

They might have also laughed at the previous President's warning to "Cut it out!". To actual men of power and action, Obama must be seen as being impotent a little comical.

Finally, I imagine that Putin feels less secure in his international posture and planning now than when Obama continuously retreated from any Red Line he proposed.

I suppose we'll find out whose imagination is less fanciful.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

code1211 said:
Cooperative efforts seem like a good thing especially in this arena.

Is there a cut and paste-able nugget from this that indicates the Trump "bought what Putin was selling"?
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The United States intelligence community believes that Russia interfered with the 2016 election. In 2017 the United States decides to work with Russia on cyber security. It should be plain as day who Trump trusts more at this point. Of course, there is always the option that this is a clever way of gaining access to how Russians operate, but I haven't seen anything about that yet.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Both Tillerson's and Lavrov's version had one thing in common. They both said the American people were concerned about Russian meddling. That makes perfect sense considering all of Trumps previous statements on the matter. It also means he didn't actually confront Putin at all. He brought it up and Putin put it down.
So there went 2 minutes of the meeting. What was the remaining two hours about? Both said they worked to set up a cease fire in the south of Syria where the opposition holds some territory. What else? We will never know.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

code1211 said:
Was there an audience to this meeting?
Click to expand...

Yes. The world.

code1211 said:
You imagine it one way.

I imagine that these two powerful and forceful leaders considered this topic on various levels and probably laughed about the reaction from the American press and the Democrats when they considered that particular level.
Click to expand...

Funny you should mention that. Putin looked at the press and said to Trump, "These are the people who hurt you?" and they both giggled.

code1211 said:
They might have also laughed at the previous President's warning to "Cut it out!". To actual men of power and action, Obama must be seen as being impotent a little comical.

Finally, I imagine that Putin feels less secure in his international posture and planning now than when Obama continuously retreated from any Red Line he proposed.

I suppose we'll find out whose imagination is less fanciful.
Click to expand...

Putin bought a US President for $200,000,000. For reference, the Koch brothers paid $400,000,000 in 2012. I think Putin feels pretty good.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

MrPeanut said:
The United States intelligence community believes that Russia interfered with the 2016 election. In 2017 the United States decides to work with Russia on cyber security. It should be plain as day who Trump trusts more at this point. Of course, there is always the option that this is a clever way of gaining access to how Russians operate, but I haven't seen anything about that yet.
Click to expand...

Just as a point of curiosity, is it your feeling that the CIA and other spy agencies from the US and around the world do NOT attempt to influence the inner workings of other countries and and their elections?

Throwing the first stone seems to be the habit of the particularly sin filled.

Here is an interesting article that is artful in its deceptive presentation of implied lies while being literally accurate:

17 intelligence organizations or 4? Either way, Russia conclusion still valid | PolitiFact

The Headline says:
<snip>

[h=1]17 intelligence organizations or 4? Either way, Russia conclusion still valid[/h]<snip>

Then in the body of the article:

<snip>
It’s valid for Trump to criticize news organizations for not being specific enough in their reports (more on that in a bit). But this does not invalidate the report by the CIA, FBI, NSA and Director of National Intelligence, nor their "high confidence" in their judgment that Russia engaged in an influence campaign directed at the election.
<snip>

See the not-so-subtle difference?

The attributed quote says influence while the headline screams collusion.

Interesting to those of us who like to examine the propaganda side of "news reporting".
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Cardinal said:
Yes. The world.



Funny you should mention that. Putin looked at the press and said to Trump, "These are the people who hurt you?" and they both giggled.



Putin bought a US President for $200,000,000. For reference, the Koch brothers paid $400,000,000 in 2012. I think Putin feels pretty good.
Click to expand...

Not to be too much of a stickler for accuracy, but you imagine how Putin feels.

Did the world watch the meeting?

Do you have a tape of that you might link to?
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Rogue Valley said:
Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted assurances on election meddling



Firstly, I'm surprised that Trump brought up Russia's election meddling at all. Of course Putin would deny the evidence-based accusation. It's what Putin does. Invade neighbors, sow discord globally, and deny all allegations. I'll give Trump props for bringing up Russia's attack during the meeting, but also acknowledge the domestic political pressure to do so was immense.

Who is telling the truth regarding what came of this confrontation? I'm inclined to believe Lavrov. On 6 July in Poland when asked about Russian meddling in the 2016 US election by a reporter, Trump said this: "Nobody really knows for sure."

In short, the day before meeting with Putin, Trump refused to definitively call-out/finger Moscow. I think Lavrov has it right. When Trump asked and Putin denied, Trump probably said something like "I accept that you didn't attack us, but I had to ask you personally because of sweeping political considerations back home. Your personal denial is good enough for me Vladimir. Now let's move on to other matters." In effect, throwing the US intelligence community under the bus.

I wonder what Trumps excuse/attitude will be come 2018/2020. Without a clear and compelling reason to stop, Putin will certainly increase Russian election meddling exponentially.
Click to expand...

Step ONE: PROVE Russian meddling or get a mea culpa from the Intelligence Community.
/
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

MrPeanut said:
I think Trump bought what Putin was selling because the United States is now entering into a joint cyber security working group with Russia. That seems like a very strange thing to do if he actually thought Russia meddled in the election.
Click to expand...
That's like the fox and hens forming a joint effort to make henhouses more secure.
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

trblmkr said:
Both Tillerson's and Lavrov's version had one thing in common. They both said the American people were concerned about Russian meddling. That makes perfect sense considering all of Trumps previous statements on the matter. It also means he didn't actually confront Putin at all. He brought it up and Putin put it down.
So there went 2 minutes of the meeting. What was the remaining two hours about? Both said they worked to set up a cease fire in the south of Syria where the opposition holds some territory. What else? We will never know.
Click to expand...

Interesting story. Now, since you haven't presented evidence you were sitting next to Putin and the President, are there any other stories you'd like to tell?
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

MTAtech said:
Comey has no doubt whatsoever that Russia was behind election hacks

U.S. intelligence chiefs have unequivocally said Russia meddled in the U.S. election

There is no doubt, except in those that have an emotional investment to doubt.
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Step ONE: PROVE Russian meddling or get a mea culpa from the Intelligence Community.
CIA and Vietnam
CIA and Kennedy Assassination
CIA and Nicaragua
CIA and Iran Hostages
CIA and Bay of Pigs
CIA and Allende
CIA and 9-11
CIA and Drug Dealing
CIA and Mossadegh
CIA and Arbenz
CIA and Haiti
CIA and Brazil, Indonesia, Greece ad infinitum
"Clinton’s is a common defense of the CIA: namely, the American people should stop criticizing the CIA because they don’t know what it really does. This, of course, is the heart of the problem in the first place. An agency that is above criticism is also above moral behavior and reform. Its secrecy and lack of accountability allows its corruption to grow unchecked.
Furthermore, Clinton’s statement is simply untrue. The history of the agency is growing painfully clear, especially with the declassification of historical CIA documents. We may not know the details of specific operations, but we do know, quite well, the general behavior of the CIA. These facts began emerging nearly two decades ago at an ever-quickening pace. Today we have a remarkably accurate and consistent picture, repeated in country after country, and verified from countless different directions."
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

code1211 said:
Not to be too much of a stickler for accuracy, but you imagine how Putin feels.

Did the world watch the meeting?

Do you have a tape of that you might link to?
Click to expand...

Putin is said to be one of the richest men on earth, with an estimated net value of 70 billion dollars. If he paid out of his own pocket (and I'm sure he didn't), he would have invested .3% of his total net worth to successfully buy the next President of the world's most powerful country.

To put that in perspective, let's say you're worth a cool half million dollars, and you spend $1400 to buy the next President of the United States, and you succeed. How would you feel? Pretty good, I imagine, right?
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

Cardinal said:
Putin is said to be one of the richest men on earth, with an estimated net value of 70 billion dollars. If he paid out of his own pocket (and I'm sure he didn't), he would have invested .3% of his total net worth to successfully buy the next President of the world's most powerful country.

To put that in perspective, let's say you're worth a cool half million dollars, and you spend $1400 to buy the next President of the United States, and you succeed. How would you feel? Pretty good, I imagine, right?
Click to expand...

No evidence has been offered anywhere that Russia maddled in the USA election. OTOH, the USA meddles in foreign elections continually attempting regime change.'/'
?
 
Re: Russian official defends his account of Trump-Putin talks, saying U.S. accepted a

DaveFagan said:
No evidence has been offered anywhere that Russia maddled in the USA election. OTOH, the USA meddles in foreign elections continually attempting regime change.'/'
?
Click to expand...

Prove that.
 
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