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What To Expect in the Senate Health Care Bill

Cardinal said:
False equivalency fail.

The ACA was debated for over a year, had over a hundred hearings, took 161 amendments to the bill from Republicans, Obama himself answered questions about the bill over the year, and countless town hall meetings took place to get input from voters.

Trumpcare is written by thirteen people in secrecy over the course of two weeks, has no hearings, no amendments, no town hall meetings, and neither the majority of the Senate nor Trump himself knew what was in the bill as it was being crafted.
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Weren't you one of the people whining about how long it was taking? Now you want to whine that it's not taking long enough?
 
bubbabgone said:
1) Politifact (yes, even Politifact) said the criticism of that Pelosi statement was mostly true.
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If you'd like to link to the article, that would be great, but I followed the debate closely and it was easy knowing what the bill did or didn't do at any point in time because the process was almost entirely in the open. The final negotiations were somewhat secret but they affected big provisions on the margins and anyone who when the final bill was published didn't know what the bill did in general terms just was not paying attention at all.

2) Would this be a good time for you to once again avoid answering my question about whether the Democratics and their surrogates lied about Obamacare before it was passed?
You did bring up Obamacare public hearings here and it is a different thread and all.
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If you want to make your point, show us these lies. I'm not interested in playing this game. Sorry.
 
iguanaman said:
P
The Context Behind Nancy Pelosi?s Famous ?We Have to Pass the Bill? Quote | Mediaite


And she was right about it. The ACA has never had such high approval as it has today.



FACT CHECK: Was the Passage of Obamacare Was Just as Secretive as GOP Efforts to Repeal It?
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What is quite interesting is how many people truly appreciated Obamacare after it was passed. Democrats lost the house in 2010, 2012 and lost the Congress in 2014 and 2016 so tell me again how many of people appreciated Obamacare?

I understand completely that you believe it is my responsibility to pay for your health insurance, but I don't believe it is your responsibility to pay for mine. Why such a disconnect on your part?

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iguanaman said:
There is no spin just facts. Sorry if facts have a liberal bias. Now tell me that you like the fact that the Senate bill removes all the revenue from the ACA while keeping the subsidies that it paid for. Let's see you "spin" that.
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As I have stated many times you and the rest of the left believe choice is only involved when it comes to abortion not when it comes to a personal responsibility issue like insurance. You seem to have a serious misconception that Healthcare is a right when it is a nothing more than a responsibility. Obamacare cost the Democrats the house and then the Congress period keep denying that reality

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JasperL said:
If you'd like to link to the article, that would be great, but I followed the debate closely and it was easy knowing what the bill did or didn't do at any point in time because the process was almost entirely in the open. The final negotiations were somewhat secret but they affected big provisions on the margins and anyone who when the final bill was published didn't know what the bill did in general terms just was not paying attention at all.



If you want to make your point, show us these lies. I'm not interested in playing this game. Sorry.
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If you like your plan you can keep your plan if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor - Barack Obama

"This bill was written in a tortured way to make sure [the Congressional Budget Office] did not score the mandate as taxes. If CBO scored the mandate as taxes, the bill dies. OK? So it’s written to do that. In terms of risk-rated subsidies, if you had a law which said healthy people are going to pay in — you made explicit that healthy people pay in and sick people get money — it would not have passed. OK? Lack of transparency is a huge political advantage. And basically, call it the stupidity of the American voter or whatever, but basically that was really, really critical to get the thing to pass. Look, I wish … we could make it all transparent, but I’d rather have this law than not." - Jonathan Gruber
 
Conservative said:
What is quite interesting is how many people truly appreciated Obamacare after it was passed. Democrats lost the house in 2010, 2012 and lost the Congress in 2014 and 2016 so tell me again how many of people appreciated Obamacare?

I understand completely that you believe it is my responsibility to pay for your health insurance, but I don't believe it is your responsibility to pay for mine. Why such a disconnect on your part?

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The GOP bill pays nearly the same subsidies as the ACA it just removes the revenues that pay for them. It's the best of both worlds for you then. The Govt. pays for my insurance and we put the bill on the credit card. That is the GOP way.
 
bubbabgone said:
If you like your plan you can keep your plan if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor - Barack Obama

"This bill was written in a tortured way to make sure [the Congressional Budget Office] did not score the mandate as taxes. If CBO scored the mandate as taxes, the bill dies. OK? So it’s written to do that. In terms of risk-rated subsidies, if you had a law which said healthy people are going to pay in — you made explicit that healthy people pay in and sick people get money — it would not have passed. OK? Lack of transparency is a huge political advantage. And basically, call it the stupidity of the American voter or whatever, but basically that was really, really critical to get the thing to pass. Look, I wish … we could make it all transparent, but I’d rather have this law than not." - Jonathan Gruber
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Great, you've made your point. Noted.
 
iguanaman said:
The GOP bill pays nearly the same subsidies as the ACA it just removes the revenues that pay for them. It's the best of both worlds for you then. The Govt. pays for my insurance and we put the bill on the credit card. That is the GOP way.
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That is your opinion but for someone who claims to be concerned about the credit, Obama added 9.4 trillion to it during his term as well as losing the House and then the Congress. Seems you live in an alternate universe
 
Whythink said:
Unfortunately that is the game. Watch the bill not have full implementation until 2019 or 2021 so we don't feel it's effects until after election(s)
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The Senate bill phases in Medicaid cuts over more time. The people still get ****ed, but this way the GOP doesn't have to deal with major political blow-back until 2020.

Always taking care of their Congressional seats before taking care of the people. They'll spend trillions on multiple wars, but deny decent and affordable healthcare to all Americans.
 
Reading through these healthcare threads is absolute torture most of the time.

Obamacare is collapsing and something has to be done. Can people not even agree on that?
 
Conservative said:
That is your opinion but for someone who claims to be concerned about the credit, Obama added 9.4 trillion to it during his term as well as losing the House and then the Congress. Seems you live in an alternate universe
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Bailing out the GOP economy and 2 unfunded GOP wars.

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Jack Fabulous said:
Reading through these healthcare threads is absolute torture most of the time.

Obamacare is collapsing and something has to be done. Can people not even agree on that?
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Yes, I'm in full agreement. I say let the Republicans do whatever they want. Full speed ahead.
 
Whythink said:
Bailing out the GOP economy and 2 unfunded GOP wars.

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Is that why he lost the House in 2010-2012 and then the Congress in 2014-2016? Seems your alternative universe doesn't recognize reality. Keep buying the liberal spin as their leadership loves making a fool out of supporters. Those wars were funded but you wouldn't know that because facts get in the way of your ideology. Keep supporting the radicals on the left
 
Winston said:
Yes, I'm in full agreement. I say let the Republicans do whatever they want. Full speed ahead.
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In other words you want the same conditions which brought Obamacare to law in the first place but with the roles reversed?

Odd.
 
Jack Fabulous said:
In other words you want the same conditions which brought Obamacare to law in the first place but with the roles reversed?

Odd.
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There were over 100 hearing on PPACA. No, I want the Republicans to get everything they want because I think it's horrible public policy that the left will be able to attack them for.
 
Winston said:
There were over 100 hearing on PPACA. No, I want the Republicans to get everything they want because I think it's horrible public policy that the left will be able to attack them for.
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Even more odd.

I just want the very real problem we are facing with healthcare to be addressed in a professional manner with the goal being to help the citizens of this nation. Does that make me a bad guy?
 
Cardinal said:
You're no better than Republicans who voted for Trump under the misguided notion that a better nation will be built on its rubble. You're just the left wing version of a Trump supporter.
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I get where he's coming from. Pain is a great teacher. There's a part of me that wants the moronic Trump slurpers to get exactly what they get from the con man known as the Great Tweeto
 
I think that it is pretty clear that the federal government needs to have as little involvement as possible with our healthcare. The free market and competition should be a major part of healthcare costs in this country. Just cancel Obamacare, and they'll have done much better than what they are doing now.
 
Jack Fabulous said:
Even more odd.

I just want the very real problem we are facing with healthcare to be addressed in a professional manner with the goal being to help the citizens of this nation. Does that make me a bad guy?
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No, it makes you a great guy actually.

But, just so we're clear, that is not what Republicans want, at all. And I think their cruel proposals will open them up to being attacked. Unfortunately, the healthcare debate has become so polarized, that any real solutions are dripping in ideology and bias. So, like Trump said of Obamacare, let it self-destruct. I say pass the AHCA in current form, and let the GOP reap those political rewards in 2020. Because I believe things are going to get so bad, that people will demand single-payer. It's the same logic that I applied in choosing not to vote for HRC. I didn't want neo-liberal incrementalism, I want real change. So, my theory was that if Trump and the Republicans were allowed everything that I believe is horrible policy, then they will own the outcomes of the policy. And if the policy is as horrible as I estimate, then Republicans will be tied to the misfortune of others. It's a cruel world out there and Republicans aren't the only ones who are allowed to play dirty.
 
Conservative said:
Is that why he lost the House in 2010-2012 and then the Congress in 2014-2016? Seems your alternative universe doesn't recognize reality. Keep buying the liberal spin as their leadership loves making a fool out of supporters. Those wars were funded but you wouldn't know that because facts get in the way of your ideology. Keep supporting the radicals on the left
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Tell me who was President when the economy collapsed? Who was President when we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan?

I don't know why the GOP wasn't punished more for that.

That is reality.

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Whythink said:
Tell me who was President when the economy collapsed? Who was President when we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan?

I don't know why the GOP wasn't punished more for that.

That is reality.

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Will be happy to when you convince me you took basic civics and know who makes the laws and who controls the purse strings? Of course you don't know why because you have been indoctrinated into the leftwing ideology and the left hasn't explained it to you because to do so would force them to admit that liberalism and radicalism is a failure in this country. Reality is people always vote their pocketbooks and that is why Democrats lost the Congress and state houses all across the nation
 
Conservative said:
Will be happy to when you convince me you took basic civics and know who makes the laws and who controls the purse strings? Of course you don't know why because you have been indoctrinated into the leftwing ideology and the left hasn't explained it to you because to do so would force them to admit that liberalism and radicalism is a failure in this country. Reality is people always vote their pocketbooks and that is why Democrats lost the Congress and state houses all across the nation
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I get that Congress does. I also understand that POTUS usually is held accountable along with his party.

Don't attempt to insult me. If you had a decent argument you would stop with these pathetic cowardly cheap shots.

This is a message board. If you begin by assuming you are the smartest you are wrong and spend your day ..................... to everyone trying to have an actual discussion.

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Whythink said:
STFU. I get that Congress does. I also understand that POTUS usually is held accountable along with his party.

Don't attempt to insult me. If you had a decent argument you would stop with these pathetic cowardly cheap shots.

This is a message board. If you begin by assuming you are the smartest you are wrong and spend your day being a little bitch to everyone trying to have an actual discussion.

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Seems like in your world only Republicans are held accountable when in the WH. Cheap shots? It was you that generated the cheap shot totally ignoring that Democrats controlled the Congress from January 2007 to January 2011 when the economy supposedly collapsed and it was you that gave Obama credit for bailing out the economy totally ignoring his actual results and TARP. I don't have to assume anything with regard to my intelligence as you are proving it for me. Learn how to do research before buying what you are told by the left
 
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