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FCC Chief Ajit Pai Develops Plans to Roll Back Net Neutrality Rules

And?

What alternative do you propose?

...keeping net neutrality?

The internet has worked this way more or less by default since its inception. Is there something fundamentally wrong with the way things have been working?
 
Republican politicians: "We're going to make sure your internet provider can sell your browsing history, and we made it illegal for local municipalities to set up their own isps in competition with large corporate isps. Also, you can't see who visits the White House, we're waving away ethics rules for White House advisers and you can't see the President's tax returns."

Republican voters: "Yayyyyy!!"

Just weird.

Trump and Congress has no problem with this but he won't release his taxes. Go figure.
 
You guys realize that the removal of net neutrality would enable your ISP to charge this website a fee in order to display webpages quickly? Why would anybody support that?

No it wouldn't, it didn't before, and it won't going forward, but keep up the BS it's amusing.
 
You guys realize that the removal of net neutrality would enable your ISP to charge this website a fee in order to display webpages quickly? Why would anybody support that?

Since the OP's article is locked behind a pay wall, I had to go elsewhere to try to find a description of what the article actually said. Basically it seems like...


Internet should be a service, not a utility <--- One of my biggest splits with Republicans in this day and age. Suggesting that access to the internet is in any way different to access to telephone service in this modern world is, frankly, ridiculous.


The FCC isn't good enough on privacy, the FTC will do better with it <---- says the guy who was supportive of the party basically going "Hey, remember that privacy you guys had from your ISP selling every single thing you do to people? Yeah, that's cute, it's gone". Truly, I have a ton of faith in Republicans like this individual having a concern about my "privacy" :roll:


We'll make the telecomms pinky promise to adhere to net neutrality standards <---- Yeah, I'm sure that will work and last. Because you know, pseudo-monopolies with significant influence with the government are TOTALLY trustworthy to keep their words on something like this.


Ultimately, the move is pretty much inevitable and it's in a "wait and see" type of model. But considering the actions Republicans have already taken on this...such as the horrible move in terms of the privacy rules and the tone deaf and unrealistic defenses of it given in some town halls recently...I don't have a lot of hope.


But no...no, I'm sureeeeee this will "spur competition", because a util-...sorry "service" like this has such a low cost of entry. I mean, sure...tiny incompetent companies without any real capital like that weird "google" are finding it exceedingly difficult to actually get off the ground with an ISP competitor. But you know, I'm sure random local small businesses will have better ability to do it then such an inconsequential tiny business like them.
It's incredible, this whole thing won't help the consumer, it won't help competition, it won't help anyone actually, except a few fat cats who own the large corporate ISP's... And you want to go on about government.

Best explanation on why the Net Neutrality rules Obama et al pushed were not the good deal we've been told it wa and how this push by Ajit Pai is actually going to be good for all.
[FONT=&quot]Net neutrality works by requiring internet service providers to treat all information equally. The logic is that a bit is a bit, and that therefore ISPs shouldn’t be able to charge more for some bits than for others, refuse to transmit certain bits, or slow down the speed at which certain bits are transferred.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]But the truth is that while all bits may be technically the same in isolation, the context in which this information occurs matters. For example, some providers like Netflix and YouTube transfer so much data that it can put a strain on network infrastructure. When that happens, ISPs can respond by allocating more bandwidth to those sites by charging the sites more for the increased usage, or by simply allowing the content to chug along slowly and inefficiently. Net neutrality limits flexibility in dealing with these content hogs. It’s not about creating an “internet fast lane”; it’s about making sites that consume massive amounts of resources pay for the bandwidth reallocation that has to take place.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The alternative is that ISPs have to charge everyone more for bandwidth in order to support the data consumption of the big sites. This means that, contrary to claims that net neutrality benefits small sites, those who consume small amounts of bandwidth are effectively subsidizing the larger sites in the form of higher rates.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]- See more at: https://www.conservativereview.com/...aul-net-neutrality-rules#sthash.7zZyxDoe.dpuf[/FONT]
 
Best explanation on why the Net Neutrality rules Obama et al pushed were not the good deal we've been told it wa and how this push by Ajit Pai is actually going to be good for all.

The 'best explanation" for your stance on net neutrality isn't even accurate. I hope this is important to you.
 
All that seeming "best explanation" does is basically say "we should get rid of net neutrality so we can literally do the things that caused you to want net neutrality in the first place."

Things like Netflix and YouTube don't use lots of bandwidth due to themselves....but because END USERS use their services. Removing the notion that a bit is a bit forces higher costs of entry on the next YouTube, or Netflix, or whatever and REQUIRES that any webservice monetize itself to continue to exist in a worthwhile fashion.

The articles logic is flawed, and its arguments highlight why the concept of net neutrality is needed. It also blows the bs arguement out of the water when people suggest that these kind of "paid fast lanes" are not EXACTYwhat ISPs will do if they get their way.
 
All that seeming "best explanation" does is basically say "we should get rid of net neutrality so we can literally do the things that caused you to want net neutrality in the first place."

Things like Netflix and YouTube don't use lots of bandwidth due to themselves....but because END USERS use their services. Removing the notion that a bit is a bit forces higher costs of entry on the next YouTube, or Netflix, or whatever and REQUIRES that any webservice monetize itself to continue to exist in a worthwhile fashion.

The articles logic is flawed, and its arguments highlight why the concept of net neutrality is needed. It also blows the bs arguement out of the water when people suggest that these kind of "paid fast lanes" are not EXACTYwhat ISPs will do if they get their way.

Sure, your Net Neutrality means we all pay more, and ISP's aren't free to adjust to the market forces cause "regulations"... that always ends well...
 
This is actually the best part of the article, and it's that way due to the saldly ironic natur

"A voluntary system would allow customers to decide what’s important to them, punishing offending ISPs by withholding their business. If companies violate net neutrality principles, it will either be for a good reason, or because customers don’t care. Of course, if we had an actual free market in ISPs — rather than the artificial oligopoly created by government — none of this would be a problem in the first place."

The second sentence is why the first is bunk. No, many consumers cannot realistically "punish" an ISP. Often they either have no choice, a significantly hampered choice, or one other choice that is basically no different than the first one. And when a company the size of Google is finding it neigh impossible to create a worth while local ISP, in what reality are we believing "competition" can fill the gap.

Would I rather an unregulated option? Sure. But the realities of our telecom system is that it's not an open and fair market, and it is growing (if not there) to become a necessity for modern life, and thus the REALITY must be dealt with realistically.
 
Also, while Ajit is here basically saying "don't worry, the FTC will monitor their 'voluntary' promise and they're better equipped to handle this", the FTC is going "Yeah, legally we can't really do anything to them about this"

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...tary-net-neutrality-lets-isps-call-the-shots/

So basically....we're supposed to trust one of the least competitive businesses, peddling what's basically a necessity, to act against their own profit based interested because of a pinky promise that is largely both unenforceable and I punishable by government or consumers. Yeah, that always ends well.
 
Sure, your Net Neutrality means we all pay more, and ISP's aren't free to adjust to the market forces cause "regulations"... that always ends well...

Again with the econ 101 platitudes.

Net neutrality promotes competition in the content.

ISPs have no real competition and therefore are in a better position to abuse those market forces. Are you against regulating power and water infrastructure as well?

ISPs have no real competition. That's the little problem your econ 101 thinking is missing. The usual market forces are not sufficiently present here.

Think about it: the bastion of honest free market competition you're wanting to trust with this ability is ****ing Comcast.
 
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Be specific. How does "net neutrality" solve the problem?

It solves the problem of paid prioritization which is an anti-competitive practice and would make it harder for, say, DeuceShop, to start up and compete with Amazon. Net Neutrality promotes free and open competition of web content, at the expense of some inconvenience to an ISP's practices and arguably their bottom line. Given the literal billions of dollars taxpayers have handed them to upgrade infrastructure, and the inherent anticompetitive market that is internet service, I am comfortable with regulating practices that are bad for the consumer.

I'd rather regulate to the detriment of one ISP than allow a practice that is a detriment to millions of websites.
 
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No it wouldn't, it didn't before, and it won't going forward, but keep up the BS it's amusing.

What do you mean "it didn't before"?

https://www.cnet.com/news/fcc-formally-rules-comcasts-throttling-of-bittorrent-was-illegal/

Federal regulators voted 3-2 on Friday to declare that Comcast's throttling of BitTorrent traffic last year was unlawful, marking the first time that any U.S. broadband provider has ever been found to violate Net neutrality rules.

which led to Comcast suing the FCC (and winning)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comcast_Corp._v._FCC

which led to

In December 2010, FCC approved new net neutrality rules, formalized in an FCC order. While these rules did not reclassify a broadband service as a communications service under the Title II regulation, it would forbid cable and DSL Internet service providers from blocking or slowing online service. It would also prohibit mobile carriers from blocking VoIP applications such as Skype and blocking websites in their entirely, while restrictions are fewer than those on cable and DSL.
 
It still costs money.

You already pay your ISP. Why should they charge both you and the website? It's not like Comcast hosts the server where this website is stored.
 
I wouldn't exactly call thottling excessive BitTorrent traffic an example of an "ISP charging a website a fee in order to display webpages quickly." The problem there was a few users bogging things down for everyone else. I think they've already moved on to address this by charging users more for heavy use.
 
You already pay your ISP. Why should they charge both you and the website? It's not like Comcast hosts the server where this website is stored.

I don't think any of you really know what net neutrality is, or does. All any of you know is that it's another government regulation on the provate sector, Obama said it's great, so you insist we can't live without it.
 
It solves the problem of paid prioritization which is an anti-competitive practice ...

That's fine. Access to the Internet is basically an essential service and, like all essential services, is not really provided best under a free market model of cost-cutting and competition.

Net Neutrality promotes free and open competition of web content, ...

No; it doesn't.

I am comfortable with regulating practices that are bad for the consumer.

And it has not been shown how removing 'net neutrality' is bad for consumers.
 
I don't think any of you really know what net neutrality is, or does. All any of you know is that it's another government regulation on the provate sector, Obama said it's great, so you insist we can't live without it.

It's a meaningless buzzword slogan.

The Internet, by its nature, is not and cannot be 'neutral'.
 
That's fine. Access to the Internet is basically an essential service and, like all essential services, is not really provided best under a free market model of cost-cutting and competition.



No; it doesn't.



And it has not been shown how removing 'net neutrality' is bad for consumers.

Its not an essential service. No one will die or be enslaved without it. Essential services are protection of life and freedom. Everything else can be self served through free markets, and the internet has been. Govt regulation of the internet has been nearly non existent for 40 years.
 
I'll never get some Americans when it come to being this overwhelmingly pro-business.

Like I get being pro-business, but pro-business to the point where you're supporting something so clearly and unrepentantly anti-consumer and anti-competition... There's just something wrong with your worldview at that point.
Because that takes a minimum level of intellect to grasp reality and some integrity to admit what blind partisanship obscures.
 
I don't think any of you really know what net neutrality is, or does. All any of you know is that it's another government regulation on the provate sector, Obama said it's great, so you insist we can't live without it.

Well, Republican are for it, so it must be all good!
I'm just looking forward to the day that my internet aligns with my cable service, where the ISP are allowed to regulate and charge its customers for content.
I mean extra fees to access DebatePolitics - sign me up!

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Its not an essential service. No one will die or be enslaved without it. Essential services are protection of life and freedom. Everything else can be self served through free markets, and the internet has been. Govt regulation of the internet has been nearly non existent for 40 years.

I obviously meant "essential" in the sense of being "essential to the maintenance of a 21st century lifestyle and standard of living" and not "essential" in the sense of being "essentially only a little better than living in a cave".
 
I obviously meant "essential" in the sense of being "essential to the maintenance of a 21st century lifestyle and standard of living" and not "essential" in the sense of being "essentially only a little better than living in a cave".

So, not essential then. Perhaps you meant convenience.
 
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