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No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump[W:400]******

Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Moderate Right said:
Both Obamacare and the Republican plan suck. If the Republican plan fails we are still stuck with a huge failure. It is not a win for anyone.
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If the Republican plan passes...its an even bigger fail...so its failure to pass is a small win for the American people.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

vesper said:
The vote has been postponed but Rep. Meadows head of the Freedom Caucus told reporters he is hopeful as there are just two reasonable requests in the bill be changed and then the Freedom caucus is on board. It is also being reported that Republicans in the House are to be in House on Friday for a possible vote. But then again this all could be resolved by this evening. One thing I don't see happening is calling for a vote in the middle of the night which would be the wrong thing to do.
To me this sounds promising and at the same time if this bill can pass the scrutiny of the Freedom Caucus it will pass the Senate with no problem.
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I'm against ObamaCare Vesper, but what is so promising about losing 24M from the rolls of the insured - thereby increasing the total uninsured in America to 52M?

How can this possibly be considered a success?
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Chomsky said:
I'm against ObamaCare Vesper, but what is so promising about losing 24M from the rolls of the insured - thereby increasing the total uninsured in America to 52M?

How can this possibly be considered a success?
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Uh.....BENGHAZI!!!
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

disneydude said:
If the Republican plan passes...its an even bigger fail...so its failure to pass is a small win for the American people.
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Yes, a small win. But still a failing system in a downward trajectory that makes us the embarrassment of the free world, to say nothing of the very real death and human suffering involved, including economic destitution.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

TheGoverness said:
Good. Maybe now they can actually come up with something that's better than the ACA.
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the Aha.....was definitely NOT better than the ACA
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Perotista said:
Obamacare is dying a natural death due to insurance companies pulling out of exchanges. That along with the higher premiums and deductibles. That being said, representatives from either party are elected to represent the people of their district, not the president or their political party. If the folks back home in these guys districts are against repeal and replace, more power to them for standing up and representing the people of their district. That is the way it should be.

With Obamacare, quite a lot of Democratic house representatives and senators told the people of their district and state to stick it where the sun doesn't shine. They showed their loyalty was to their political party and Obama and not to the people who elected them. Then 2010 happened and it was payback for those Democrats who told their constituents to go to Hades.

Personally, I have been very anti-Obamacare. But if the people in those Republican districts want their representatives to vote against repeal and replace, by golly gee, they better vote against it and vote accordance with the wishes of those whom elected them. Not for a political party or a president, any president or party. Represent the people that sent you to Washington, if not, you're replaceable. Just ask those 63 house democrats who lost 2010.

Vote the wishes of the people, I don't care if its Obamacare 101 and Trump's repeal and replace zero.
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Greetings, Pero. :2wave:

Well said! :thumbs: It is odd that people who are elected to represent their constituents often seem to forget just WHO it was that elected them! Must be something in the water in DC.... :thumbdown:
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Chomsky said:
Yes, a small win. But still a failing system in a downward trajectory that makes us the embarrassment of the free world, to say nothing of the very real death and human suffering involved, including economic destitution.
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I agree....which is why we need to scrap the entire "For Profit" US healthcare system.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

The deficit reductions are significantly reduced, the same number will be uninsured as previous CBO estimate, they make coverage far worse with each iteration of this bill, and they continue to target people with disabilities with each edit.

Optional mental health coverage (no EHB)
Capped and/or block granted Medicaid
Medicaid Expansion destroyed
Lose coverage for pre-existing condition if you have gap in health coverage.

This bill just keeps pissing on those of us with disabilities.

Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
 
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Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Lutherf said:
If they suggested single payer the Democrats would still oppose them simply because it would be a Trump policy. Hell, if the Republicans proposed giving everyone $1M, a pony and a lifetime supply of ice cream the democrats (and any Republicans associated with McCain) would oppose it just because it was a Trump thing.
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BS.....plain and simple.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Chomsky said:
If you're speaking of supplementary insurance like in Medicare or that used in the UK, I have no problem at all.

I was addressing Luther's concern with single-payer of possibly not having options for some procedures or tests (which is not at all that different than the rationing done by insurance companies currently).
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There is always rationing at some point, of course. But you can take out a wide variety of levels of coverage, I suspect. At least you could, when I looked into US policies. But that is quite a while ago. Many of the available policies covered much more than NHS or the German system both of which are reducing i.e. rationing their coverage of existing contracts in a type of retroactive manner.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

mbig said:
Actually, it's the reverse.
'Mandates' was a Republican idea to stop freeloading. They just didn't like it when/because the Dems adopted it.

"ACA" always polled 20 points higher that "Obamacare".
You've stumbled onto spectacular hypocrisy... of your own side.
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Bingo!
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Chomsky said:
I'm against ObamaCare Vesper, but what is so promising about losing 24M from the rolls of the insured - thereby increasing the total uninsured in America to 52M?

How can this possibly be considered a success?
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It still remains a question of why people do not take out insurance. After all, most people could, if they decided that they wanted to. Of course, there are trade offs and they will certainly be painful at the low end of the income scale. But one finds similarly hard decisions in housing or food.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Chomsky said:
I'm against ObamaCare Vesper, but what is so promising about losing 24M from the rolls of the insured - thereby increasing the total uninsured in America to 52M?

How can this possibly be considered a success?
Click to expand...

Well Chomsky already more and more are without insurance because they can't pay the premiums. And others who do pay for insurance can't afford to use it because of the high deductables. What good is it to say you have an insurance card if you can't afford to use it?

There are now 6 states who have no provider for Obamacare and over 1/3 of the counties have only one choice. I guess we could just stand by and let it totally implode and do nothing but that wouldn't be good for a lot of people.

Lots of back and forth going on, guess the Freedom Caucus are all in Ryan's office at the moment and food has been ordered as it looks like they are all trying to reach an agreement tonight.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Well from my view they're all (with possible exception of a handful of moderates) out to screw tens of millions for sake of a political "win" over democrats

What's hilarious about it is they're battling each other instead due to unexpected backlash from those tens of millions

To me this is how democracy is supposed to work - whatever the attempts to rig and lie their way thru elections, when you present something so terrible that 90% put their foot down, it's dealt a very public death at the critical moment

Actually....yeah we should demand better than reaching this point
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

disneydude said:
BS.....plain and simple.
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Actually if they presented single payer, or even something that doesn't strip tens of millions of medical treatment, i'd probably oppose it till i read the fine print, so great would be the shock
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Fiddytree said:
The deficit reductions are significantly reduced, the same number will be uninsured as previous CBO estimate, they make coverage far worse with each iteration of this bill, and they continue to target people with disabilities with each edit.

Optional mental health coverage (no EHB)
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The elimination of the EHBs would be a bigger deal than just the loss important benefits. It would effectively get rid of the limits on out-of-pocket spending for the individual, as well as the prohibition on annual or lifetime limits on what the insurer spends on the individual's behalf. The concept of the ACA's market-based subsidies (which were supposed to stick around at least for a year or two before going over to GOP's flat subsidies that don't take into account costs in your market) would no longer make sense.

Getting rid of them would be destructive in a lot of ways beyond the immediately obvious.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

polgara said:
Greetings, Pero. :2wave:

Well said! :thumbs: It is odd that people who are elected to represent their constituents often seem to forget just WHO it was that elected them! Must be something in the water in DC.... :thumbdown:
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That is exactly what happened to the Democrats in 2010. They forgot whom they represented or elected them. One could say the same thing happened to them in 1994 also and to the Republicans in 2006. When a representative, especially in what is known as swing districts or districts where the party affiliation is close, voting against the wishes of the majority of people in their district usually leads to defeat in the next election. Especially when it is a hot button issue like Obamacare was for example.

Mark my word, if the Republicans side with Trump and the party leadership, which by the way, the party leadership are in safe districts. The Democrats will regain control of the House in 2018. The Democrats will probably do so anyway unless Trump starts to govern more according to the wishes of the people. Voters who expect one thing and a president who does the opposite, they take their wrath out on the president's party in the mid term elections. Trump may be the best thing that ever happened to congressional Democrats.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

vesper said:
Well Chomsky already more and more are without insurance because they can't pay the premiums. And others who do pay for insurance can't afford to use it because of the high deductables. What good is it to say you have an insurance card if you can't afford to use it?
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This critique of the ACA makes no sense if it's used to defend a bill that will raise deductibles and premiums for people.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

mbig said:
I can't believe this failed in the House, IF indeed it is 100% over: I don't think so.
Trump simply can't lost Battle/Issue #1. His and the GOP's signature legislation. The GOP 'repealed' O'care 52 times while Obama was President.
But they have nothing to replace it.
"Art of the Deal", or just/IAC the Charles Manson-of-Twitter?

No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump
by LEIGH ANN CALDWELL -
MAR 23 2017, 1:53 PM ET
No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump - NBC News
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Trump was right. I'm getting so much winning.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

NIMBY said:
Actually, progress---ives have been dreaming of a health care system since GOP president Theodore Roosevelt first introduced it .
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"Health care" as it was back then wasn't so essential. In fact going to a hospital could kill you. Pregnant women were more likely to survive giving birth at home. This is why socialist UK didn't create the NHS until after WW2

FDR proposed it among his '2nd bill of rights', probably the first well known example of linking health care to civil rights
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

Greenbeard said:
This critique of the ACA makes no sense if it's used to defend a bill that will raise deductibles and premiums for people.
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They surely could've created something that lowers the cost, but they were hellbent on giving handouts to the rich (tax credits based on age rather than wealth and cutting the tax on $500k+ that pays for this) who can already easily afford insurance

It's never been about good legislation on behalf of the voters they're supposed to serve, but about kickbacks to themselves and their friends, as always
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

polgara said:
Greetings, Vesper. :2wave:

I haven't had time to keep up with this, so what are your thoughts, if you wish to share? I have always trusted your thorough research on any topic you are interested in - Common Core being one example where you were so correct, contrary to the hype others were giving it - so will the GOP plan be an improvement for most people, IYO? Is there a link I could use to read about it for myself?
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I think the ultimate goal is to get premiums down so more people can afford insurance. Like I told someone else the other day it is a sausage making process. There's been a lot of good proposals and I think ultimately it will end up to be a decent bill.
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

CBO estimate didn't have time to include EHB loss.

Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

mbig said:
I can't believe this failed in the House, IF indeed it is 100% over: I don't think so.
Trump simply can't lost Battle/Issue #1. His and the GOP's signature legislation. The GOP 'repealed' O'care 52 times while Obama was President.
But they have nothing to replace it.
"Art of the Deal", or just/IAC the Charles Manson-of-Twitter?

No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump
by LEIGH ANN CALDWELL -
MAR 23 2017, 1:53 PM ET
No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump - NBC News
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They only voted to repeal it cause they knew he would veto and they wouldn't be held accountable for destructive legislation that deprives 25 million of health care. It's the most cynical form of politics they're guilty of

As for failing to pass this now, don't promise destructive things and this won't happen. Most voters are too stupid to realize what's good for them until it slaps them in the face. Well that time is now and the politicians want sympathy and to be reelected again for their deceptive and coercive tactics. Here Trump is today even saying "it's going to be great you'll love it, call your congressman to pressure them" Yet more deception and coercion
 
Re: No Deal on Health Care Bill After Conservative Meeting With Trump

JANFU said:
Then fix it and as Trump would say, it will be beautiful, everyone will be covered, yada,yada, and it will be huge.
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"terrific" Everything it "terrific" or "incredible" as in "China is cheating us so badly it's incredible."

I guess this is what he meant when he said he would have the "greatest 100 day start in history."
 
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