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CBO: AHCA Would Leave 24 Million More Uninsured by 2026

Wait, what?

"In 2026, an estimated 52 million people would be uninsured, compared with 28 million who would lack insurance that year under current law," the analysis said.

I thought everybody had coverage under Obamacare? 28 million won't?
 
prometeus said:
Funny, all the other industrialized nations can afford it. Why do you think we can not make it also?
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They pay around 10% GDP to do it, we spend 17% and going up.

That is a huge problem, that is getting near double what it should cost.

Why cant we do it....well I note that we cant seem to do much of anything else correctly either.

It is us, We the People, WE are the problem.
 
Fenton said:
I thought Ryans bill provided susidies to insurers so they could provide older and sicker Americans with affordable policies while not passing that cost onto the rest of us
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The problem is that while the subsidies are age adjusted, which is a good idea, they are not sufficient to where older Americans could afford coverage. Average health insurance premiums for someone that is 25 is around 2500 a year. If you are 60, its around 12k a year. So even if you get a couple of grand in tax credits, its not sufficient for many people to be able to afford it on the individual market.

The ACA made insurance for older people cheaper by making insurance for younger people more expensive. That was flawed because a lot of younger people did not get insurance, and insurance needs younger people to function.

The Republican Plan will make insurance for younger people much cheaper, but insurance for older people will be much more expensive. Ideally more younger people will get coverage, but that doesn't help with getting older people coverage.

Personally, I don't think the GOP plan is that bad. I think they are running into the same problem the ACA did though. They are trying to build upon a system that is basically a market failure in that no matter how expensive necessary health care is, it has no impact on demand for it.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
Public Policy should never be driven by the wants and needs of one theoretical individual or family.
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It's not just one. This is the whole purpose of a healthcare safety net: to protect against circumstances which no human being living in a civil society should have to face. Without a safety net, these types of scenarios are too numerous to count.
 
prometeus said:
So what do you believe that will make the product better?
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I argue for nationalizing the entire health system for 20 years, reorganizing it, and then selling it off.

We dont have time for incremental change, that will take at least a generation, and this son-of-a-bitch is bankrupting us now.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
They pay around 10% GDP to do it, we spend 17% and going up.

That is a huge problem, that is getting near double what it should cost.

Why cant we do it....well I note that we cant seem to do much of anything else correctly either.

It is us, We the People, WE are the problem.
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I thing you got this part right, but to be clear, it is only part of "we the people" that impede the solution.
 
Fenton said:
The same thing could be said for the Democrats and Obama when they not only ignored the consequences of their healthcare law on tens of millions of Americans but continued to sing its praises

Talk about chosing party over Country, the Democrats are still defending ObamaCare even when they know the amount of damage its done over the last 6 years
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I think the majority of Dems, including Clinton, freely admit the bill needed adjustments, but they've been arguing against a group that has called it a total disaster and inflexibly suggested until about 3 months ago that it HAD to be repealed and replaced. Obamacare did a number of things pretty well considering its goal of making a private for profit health insurance market work for sick people. It stabilized hospitals that were drowning in taking care of uninsured people and extended access to health coverage to millions of low income people. It also standardized a minimum level of care and worked to prevent fraud and abuse by health insurance companies. Aside from all of that, it did a million other behind the scene things that have vastly improved our healthcare system from changing medicare partially to a pay for performance system, incentivizing going to electronic medical record systems that save lives, and encouraging training of primary care physicians and paying them extra to open offices in underserved communities. The partisan outcry about Obamacare totally overshadowed what was in reality a fairly successful bill considering its actual goals. Unfortunately, the Affordable care act is a total misnomer since it did very little to address the costs of healthcare in America. Insurance premiums went up because Obamacare required insurers to pay for healthcare that is incredibly expensive here compared to the rest of the world. The Repubs plan does squat for that too and that's why it will be a failure.
 
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ataraxia said:
It's not just one. This is the whole purpose of a healthcare safety net: to protect against circumstances which no human being living in a civil society should have to face. Without a safety net, these types of scenarios are too numerous to count.
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That is what the law stating that emergency rooms must treat is for, as well as charity care.
 
prometeus said:
I thing you got this part right, but to be clear, it is only part of "we the people" that impede the solution.
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The problem with that is that I almost never see the so-called good people even talking about the problem, much less driving solutions.

ARGUMENT REJECTED
 
Fenton said:
Wouldnt that "persons " child qualify for Medicaid " Chip " then ?

Even under the old system we had before the disaster that is ObamaCare that child would have been covered.
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So you are saying there is a place for government in healthcare? And Medicaid, of all things!? :shock:Bite your tongue! And you call yourself a conservative!
 
Conservative said:
didn't read the report, did you? Who is booting anyone off ACA? People have a choice since they don't have to pay the penalty any more. cannot believe how many people are indoctrinated into the liberal ideology and don't have a clue
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Guess what, if the GOP passes this absolute disaster I'll likely be fine.

But you know who's going to get absolutely screwed, (and that's putting it very very mildly) Trump supporters... If you're a Trump supporter, you're likely to be older, non-college educated, and live in a sparsely populated county with a small economic output. So for your sake I hope you've got a nice nest egg saved up. Because Trump care will start by taking as much as $6000/ year out of your pocket. That's how much your premium support from the government will go down. Then get ready to add in 20% increases for the next two years. But don't worry. They'll end up being slightly cheaper in 8 years. (oh, just the premium cost.. you're still going to have to pay another 6k / year extra)

Oh.. and better yet.. just think about your neighbors. I'll assume you're gainfully employed, but if you live in a Trump county your dealing with as much as twice the level of unemployment, significantly lower paying jobs, and lower economic output overall. That means there's not going to be nearly as much money to pay the doctors you want to go see. Good doctors aren't going to stick around in some place where no one can afford insurance and no one can pay, so what little provider choice you had will be gone.

And that means Trump supporters, which already have among the lowest life expectancies in the US, are going to become sicker and die even younger.

But please, hold on to the fable that we're just indoctrinated and elitists.

Maybe this is a good thing. Maybe the massive human tragedy that you seem to be desperate to inflict on yourself will wake you up to the fact that the policies the people you elect don't help you... at all. In fact they hurt you. They're a large part of the reason why red state America is hurting. Your representatives don't care what happens to you. They don't care about your suffering. They don't care if you get sick or die. But tax cuts for the "job providers", well that pays the bills.
 
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Hawkeye10 said:
That is what the law stating that emergency rooms must treat is for, as well as charity care.
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You want to treat leukemia in the emergency room? Glaucoma? Chronic kidney failure?

:lamo
 
Hawkeye10 said:
I argue for nationalizing the entire health system for 20 years
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Wow, I did not expect that. Some would call you a socialist. I am not sure that nationalization is the solution. simply expanding medicate to cover everyone and keep the cost rules in place would do the trick.
 
JasperL said:
But when the "males" no longer "subsidize" the females, I guess babies get born by magic without need of doctors or something and that women have no trouble affording care for the babies the right to lifers want to force her to carry to term?

You're just focusing on who wins and ignoring entirely the losers.
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Wow, another anti GOP/Trump thread and you are here, what a surprise. You just don't get it at all and don't understand that it really is a choice to have insurance and if it is available and you don't buy it that isn't a failure on the part of Trump, that is your failure. Personal responsibility doesn't exist in the liberal world and no matter how you spin it ACA and the Obama record led to the GOP taking the Congress. whatever you want to call this bill gives people choice and it really is sad that people like you want to determine what that choice is
 
prometeus said:
Wow, I did not expect that. Some would call you a socialist. I am not sure that nationalization is the solution. simply expanding medicate to cover everyone and keep the cost rules in place would do the trick.
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I call me a socialist, a Zen Socialist to be an exact. Others call me other things:

Hawkeye10 said:
Wish I knew how to post the pics:

You are a left moderate social libertarian.
Left: 4.37, Libertarian: 2.41

Foreign Policy:
On the left side are pacifists and anti-war activists. On the right side are those who want a strong military that intervenes around the world. You scored: 0.57

Culture:
Where are you in the culture war? On the liberal side, or the conservative side? This scale may apply more to the US than other countries. You scored: -0.11

Sounds right, I am economically a lefty, socially centrist who believes it is better to not have to go to war.
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Reorganizing does not mean Medicare, it means reorganizing...taking the system completely appart and then putting it back together in some way that works to get reasonably good care for most at something like 12% GDP or less.

Everything would be changed.
 
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Greenbeard said:
It substantially raises premiums on older adults (age bands change from 3:1 today to 5:1 under AHCA), while drastically cutting financial assistance available to anyone under 400% FPL.
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You know what is really sad is that you are taking a victory lap over an ACA program that still has 33 million Americans uninsured and was voted down in the last election. The disconnect with the public is yours. If you benefited great, nothing is going to change other than you will have a choice on the plan you want. Personal responsibility seems to be foreign to the left and personal responsibility won in November as the GOP took Congress. Elections have consequences, you lost
 
Conservative said:
You know what is really sad is that you are taking a victory lap over an ACA program that still has 33 million Americans uninsured and was voted down in the last election.
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If you're concerned about the number of uninsured, guess what you don't want to pass? The AHCA!
 
Conservative said:
Wow, another anti GOP/Trump thread and you are here, what a surprise. You just don't get it at all and don't understand that it really is a choice to have insurance and if it is available and you don't buy it that isn't a failure on the part of Trump, that is your failure. Personal responsibility doesn't exist in the liberal world and no matter how you spin it ACA and the Obama record led to the GOP taking the Congress. whatever you want to call this bill gives people choice and it really is sad that people like you want to determine what that choice is
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and if you can't afford health insurance or you were sold a "really great, cheap insurance" and find that - Too Bad, it doesn't cover your problems. Yep, that personal responsibility thing works so well for those struggling to pay rent and buy food.
 
lurchadams said:
Pure right-wing blathering. "The government is forcing me to insure myself". Boo-hoo.
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Is that what you believe? Then your ignorance is staggering, you will have a choice and not forced into a program the govt. offers you. Sad that you expect so much out of a bloated Federal Govt
 
Somerville said:
Have you bothered to look into the cost of emergency care?
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Yep, I also know that Emergency Rooms can run Urgent Care Clinics off to the side and thus eliminate most of that inefficiency.
 
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