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Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply false'

Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Deuce said:
National Review said there may have been. Even they straight-up admitted it was speculative.

If I linked Huffington Post and some other liberal blogger who both made the same claim about Trump, would you call that "evidence?"
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An FBI source appears to have made a more definitive statement:
The original FISA request which specifically named and broadly targeted Donald Trump was denied, a second request was redrafted months later which narrowed down on equipment in Trump Tower. The second request is said to have been granted, despite the fact that FBI sources did not believe these servers to be of actual national security or possess any illegal ties to Russia. The notion that this second FISA warrant was granted is highly significant as they exist to investigate cases when Foreign Intelligence is suspected of operations in the US.
REPORT: FBI Said to Have ‘Granted FISA Warrant’ To Wiretap TRUMP Tower… MSM Claims Trump “Provided No Evidence”
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Or is it your position that the FBI didn't wiretap on Trump?
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Deuce said:
You know this, what, because Donnie said so?
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No I know this because I spent a whole 15 minutes researching the issue.

We now know prior to July 2016, Obama's DOJ and the FBI did a preliminary investigtion into Trumps ties to Russia.
Nothing was found but that didnt stop Obama and his DOJ from seeking approval from FISA to tap and monitor Trump and his some of his associates.
FISA turned it down and it should of stopped there, but Obama's DOJ came back with a limited request for covert surveillance and FISA approved it

The DOJ has to stay within the strict guidlines of the FISA approval, but if Obama's DOJ wire tapped a opposition candidate and his associates during a Presidential campaign then this is a extraordinary abuse of Presidential power and yeal it rises to a level of corruption we havent seen since Watergate

There would be reason to doubt Trumps claims if not for Obama's history of illegal and unethical surveillance, including Eric Holders decision to charge a Journalist, James Rosen as a criminal co-conspirator under the 1922 Espionge Act so they could hack into his Emails, phone records and those of his parents.

And wow !...did this ever blow up in the Democrats faces
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

code1211 said:
This an interesting piece of Americana in what is shaping up to be the interference by a sitting president into the campaign of an opponent from the other party.

Mark Levin to GOP: Investigate Obama's 'Silent Coup' vs. Trump

<snip>
In summary: the Obama administration sought, and eventually obtained, authorization to eavesdrop on the Trump campaign;

continued monitoring the Trump team even when no evidence of wrongdoing was found;

then relaxed the NSA rules to allow evidence to be shared widely within the government, virtually ensuring that the information,

including the conversations of private citizens, would be leaked to the media.
<snip>
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It is simply another conspiracy theory from President Drama Llama Ding Dong. :dramallama:

Y'all are following a man who lives in another reality.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

eohrnberger said:
Unknown.

It could be that Obama ordered Lynch to get the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump.
It could be that Obama ordered Lynch, who ordered Comey to get the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump.
It could be that Lynch ordered Comey to get the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump.
It could be that Comey went and got the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump on his own.
It could be that someone else in the FBI got the FISA warrant and wiretapped Trump on his own.

Obama can't order a wiretap on his own. Given statements from Rhodes and an ex-admin spox, Obama never ordered any wiretaps, at least not formally, so there'll probably be no records of that, on purpose.
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Remember that there is a FISA provision where warrants can be sought after the fact, and was extended through 2017 in 2012. So anyone looking to snoop on a political opponent, and who has the power to order or conduct wiretaps, could conduct a wiretap without prior approval from FISA. I think it is an important step to find out whether the initial FISA filing was after the fact.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Napoleon said:
But it's probably just conspiracy theory bs that Trump found in the depths of the online conservative insane asylum. Actually there is no probably. Trump got it from Breitbart.
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It doesn't matter where Trump got it from, the real question is whether it happened or not, and on that count, there are multiple independent sources who are reporting that it did, and they go all the way back the first failed FISA warrant request by the administration back in June of 2016.

Taken together, that's going to carry far more credibility, and should, than all the partisans on one side denying that it happened.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Risky Thicket said:
It is simply another conspiracy theory from President Drama Llama Ding Dong. :dramallama:

Y'all are following a man who lives in another reality.
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Conspiracy theory? You mean like accusing Trump and his aides of colluding with Russia with no evidence whatsoever?
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

jmotivator said:
Remember that there is a FISA provision where warrants can be sought after the fact, and was extended through 2017 in 2012. So anyone looking to snoop on a political opponent, and who has the power to order or conduct wiretaps, could conduct a wiretap without prior approval from FISA. I think it is an important step to find out whether the initial FISA filing was after the fact.
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A good point, and I agree with you on that.

I wasn't aware that FISA warrants could be issued after the fact. To me, that really kinda sucks.
I think it needs to be the other way around. Warrant first, then wiretap. But that's just me.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Erod said:
Watergate Part II?
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Nope. Just another weak diversionary topic.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Napoleon said:
But it's probably just conspiracy theory bs that Trump found in the depths of the online conservative insane asylum. Actually there is no probably. Trump got it from Breitbart.
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LOL. Yeah, as President he wouldn't have access to such information. :roll:
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Higgins86 said:
Oh people are actually taking what he said seriously? .................:shock:
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This is America, you lived here, you married an American. You know how it is here now. We have a TV president who has major issues with realty. The American TV watching voters pretty much view it as another poorly written television program. TV President Trump is crazier than a road lizard and the American public can't wait for the next episode.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Fenton said:
Lol...this is SO bad.
Well, now we know who wire tapped Flynn, AND who's the source of the leaks. Obama and his thuggish corrupt cronies.
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Flynn was wiretapped?
No, the Russian ambassador was wiretapped. It's routine. Flynn knew about it.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

eohrnberger said:
A good point, and I agree with you on that.

I wasn't aware that FISA warrants could be issued after the fact. To me, that really kinda sucks.
I think it needs to be the other way around. Warrant first, then wiretap. But that's just me.
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It was that way before the Patriot act. The argument for Warrantless Wiretapping was that the NSA and DHS need to be able to wiretap in real time to thwart terrorist attacks, and argument that was supported by enough politicians and regular citizens that it has persisted to this day. The weakness in that argument is that a refusal of wiretap after the fact only makes the data collected inadmissible in court, but what really does that matter if you never intended to use it in court anyway?

I once supported warrantless wiretapping, but this story coming to light finally made be see this glaring weakness in my thinking on the subject. We can't trust anyone with such power.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Higgins86 said:
Oh people are actually taking what he said seriously? .................:shock:
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Let's see.

A sitting president and his administration use the nation's intelligence resources to surveil and wiretap a presidential candidate of the opposing political party.

And your opinion is 'what could possibly go wrong' ?

This sure sounds like the makings of a police state to me, and that's something that I really wish to avoid.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

jmotivator said:
It was that way before the Patriot act. The argument for Warrantless Wiretapping was that the NSA and DHS need to be able to wiretap in real time to thwart terrorist attacks, and argument that was supported by enough politicians and regular citizens that it has persisted to this day. The weakness in that argument is that a refusal of wiretap after the fact only makes the data collected inadmissible in court, but what really does that matter if you never intended to use it in court anyway?

I once supported warrantless wiretapping, but this story coming to light finally made be see this glaring weakness in my thinking on the subject. We can't trust anyone with such power.
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Agreed. Absolute power (such as this is an example of) corrupts absolutely.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Risky Thicket said:
It is simply another conspiracy theory from President Drama Llama Ding Dong. :dramallama:

Y'all are following a man who lives in another reality.
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No, not conspiracy theory, there was a active FISA investigation being done by Obama's DOJ which gave them limited permision to do covert surveillance on some of Trumps associates.

If the DOJ did surviellance outside of that FISA approval, like tapping Trump Tower and Jeff Sessions then this is a extraordinary abuse of Presidential power and its consitent with the kind of illegal and unethical crap the Obama administration is known for.

Also illegally leaking of information uncovered in FISA investigations to the press for Political purposes is right up Obama's alley

Funny considering that the actual conspiracy theory of Trumps collusion with Russia led to the exposure of real corruption on the part of the Obama administration.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

eohrnberger said:
Let's see.

A sitting president and his administration use the nation's intelligence resources to surveil and wiretap a presidential candidate of the opposing political party.

And your opinion is 'what could possibly go wrong' ?

This sure sounds like the makings of a police state to me, and that's something that I really wish to avoid.
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Man I love how this is blowing up in the Lefts faces. Couldnt have happened to a nicer group of people too
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Top Cat said:
Nope. Just another weak diversionary topic.
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Looking more and more like this happened. Obama won't deny the wiretaps occurred, just that he ordered them. His laundry list of lies doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Moderate Right said:
Conspiracy theory? You mean like accusing Trump and his aides of colluding with Russia with no evidence whatsoever?
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Trump has a sordid personal and professional history with less than honorable Russia oligarchs. Prior to his campaign Trump was part of investigations that included Russian crime figures. He reportedly remains under investigation today. There has been justification to investigate Trump for a number of things that began before his campaign. From the American mafia to the Russian crime lords, many of Trumps business partners have been/were soon to become convicted felons. Not nice people by any definition. Follow the money, as they say.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

jmotivator said:
LOL. Yeah, as President he wouldn't have access to such information. :roll:
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He doesn't because it isn't real so no such information exists. His source is Brietbart.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Risky Thicket said:
It is simply another conspiracy theory from President Drama Llama Ding Dong. :dramallama:

Y'all are following a man who lives in another reality.
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Ignoring what happened in the real world to support a current bias is an interesting approach to living.

What does this say about your residency in a particular version of reality.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Fenton said:
No, not conspiracy theory, there was a active FISA investigation being done by Obama's DOJ which gave them limited permision to do covert surveillance on some of Trumps associates.

If the DOJ did surviellance outside of that FISA approval, like tapping Trump Tower and Jeff Sessions then this is a extraordinary abuse of Presidential power and its consitent with the kind of illegal and unethical crap the Obama administration is known for.
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When? What was the time frame? What were the reasons for the FISA approval? What judge signed the FISA request? What were the results?

Also illegally leaking of information uncovered in FISA investigations to the press for Political purposes is right up Obama's alley
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Really? Why is that?

Funny considering that the actual conspiracy theory of Trumps collusion with Russia led to the exposure of real corruption on the part of the Obama administration.
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What is the "exposure of the real corruption? Sources please.


BEFORE YOU OR ANYONE ELSE RESPONDS, I AM NOT A DEMOCRAT. I DID NOT VOTE FOR OBAMA NOR DID I VOTE FOR HILLARY.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

code1211 said:
Ignoring what happened in the real world to support a current bias is an interesting approach to living.

What does this say about your residency in a particular version of reality.
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What did I ignore that happened in the real world?
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

Erod said:
Looking more and more like this happened. Obama won't deny the wiretaps occurred, just that he ordered them. His laundry list of lies doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt.
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Obama said that he ordered the wiretaps? Source that factoid for me.
 
Re: Trump cites no evidence in wiretapping claim; Obama spokesman calls it 'simply fa

eohrnberger said:
Unknown.

It could be that Obama ordered Lynch to get the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump.
It could be that Obama ordered Lynch, who ordered Comey to get the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump.
It could be that Lynch ordered Comey to get the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump.
It could be that Comey went and got the FISA warrant and wiretap Trump on his own.
It could be that someone else in the FBI got the FISA warrant and wiretapped Trump on his own.

Obama can't order a wiretap on his own. Given statements from Rhodes and an ex-admin spox, Obama never ordered any wiretaps, at least not formally, so there'll probably be no records of that, on purpose.
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Even if Obama was directly involved, I would highly doubt that he literally "ordered" someone else to order it. Plausible deniability in high circles, and all.
 
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