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Taxi Medallion Prices Are Plummeting, Endanger

Renae

Renae

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There's a good reason your cab driver is so cranky: His livelihood might be teetering on the edge of default. According to a recent presentation prepared for Capital One Financial Corp. investors, some 81 percent of its $690 million in loans for taxi medallions are at risk of default.
Medallions, the small metal shields affixed to the hoods of taxi cabs, are issued by the local taxi authority and effectively allow the cabs to operate legally. Owning one used to be akin to owning a gas-guzzling, money-printing machine. Medallions in New York City traded at more than $1 million in 2014, but today's prices are about half of that.
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...llion-prices-are-plummeting-endangering-loans

Oh, look... competition reduces the over inflated values protected by government and unions... The real threat to their power is the free market enterprise system that enables more people to have a bite of the economic pie... not just those that the elite allow to partake for their own needs.
 
Renae said:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...llion-prices-are-plummeting-endangering-loans

Oh, look... competition reduces the over inflated values protected by government and unions... The real threat to their power is the free market enterprise system that enables more people to have a bite of the economic pie... not just those that the elite allow to partake for their own needs.
Click to expand...

Right you are. The monopoly the City of Chicago has on the taxi business is just short of criminal. A suburban cab called to pick up in the city can lose his cab to the impound lot and have a $500 or more ticket to pay for not having one of those Medallions on his windshield.

And how badly do you think cabbies are cheating customers to pay for those things? At O'Hare, which is in the suburbs, but annexed as an island to the city of Chicago in a political fiasco years ago, suburban cabs are ostracized and can't work the cab stands. The Chicago taxi fares are double the meter out of downtown Chicago and out of O'Hare. I took a taxi from Navy Pier to my home... by law, I couldn't use a suburban taxi... the fare was double the meter by law. Distance 26 miles. Fare without tip $90.

Time for that to stop!
 
MaggieD said:
Right you are. The monopoly the City of Chicago has on the taxi business is just short of criminal. A suburban cab called to pick up in the city can lose his cab to the impound lot and have a $500 or more ticket to pay for not having one of those Medallions on his windshield.

And how badly do you think cabbies are cheating customers to pay for those things? At O'Hare, which is in the suburbs, but annexed as an island to the city of Chicago in a political fiasco years ago, suburban cabs are ostracized and can't work the cab stands. The Chicago taxi fares are double the meter out of downtown Chicago and out of O'Hare. I took a taxi from Navy Pier to my home... by law, I couldn't use a suburban taxi... the fare was double the meter by law. Distance 26 miles. Fare without tip $90.

Time for that to stop!
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Yep, there is a lot of money and political power in those "medallions" and I applaud any move to shatter that system.
 
Renae said:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...llion-prices-are-plummeting-endangering-loans

Oh, look... competition reduces the over inflated values protected by government and unions... The real threat to their power is the free market enterprise system that enables more people to have a bite of the economic pie... not just those that the elite allow to partake for their own needs.
Click to expand...

This is because of Uber though, right? I guess I don't necessarily understand the situation. Why do taxis require a medallion, but Uber doesn't? If it's government enforced, why don't they also require Uber to have a medallion?

Not that I'm against Uber or proper competition, free market is what I desire. I just don't get why if a taxi must have a medallion and it's enforceable by law, how Uber skirts that.
 
MaggieD said:
Right you are. The monopoly the City of Chicago has on the taxi business is just short of criminal. A suburban cab called to pick up in the city can lose his cab to the impound lot and have a $500 or more ticket to pay for not having one of those Medallions on his windshield.

And how badly do you think cabbies are cheating customers to pay for those things? At O'Hare, which is in the suburbs, but annexed as an island to the city of Chicago in a political fiasco years ago, suburban cabs are ostracized and can't work the cab stands. The Chicago taxi fares are double the meter out of downtown Chicago and out of O'Hare. I took a taxi from Navy Pier to my home... by law, I couldn't use a suburban taxi... the fare was double the meter by law. Distance 26 miles. Fare without tip $90.

Time for that to stop!
Click to expand...
You really should consider Uber or Lyft, Maggie. Both are extremely active in Chicagoland. Try it, and you'll be hooked!
 
Ikari said:
This is because of Uber though, right? I guess I don't necessarily understand the situation. Why do taxis require a medallion, but Uber doesn't? If it's government enforced, why don't they also require Uber to have a medallion?

Not that I'm against Uber or proper competition, free market is what I desire. I just don't get why if a taxi must have a medallion and it's enforceable by law, how Uber skirts that.
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What happened was: Due to the inability to regulate an internet app, and the extremely fast explosive growth of ridesharing, the local governments couldn't hit a moving target. It got past them, so now the local governments have to deal with the TNPs (rideshare orgs) on their terms, more or less.

Basically, the TNPs blew right past the local governments before they could react, and now on any given night in Chicago you've got 10's of thousands, if not 100's of thousands of individuals in private cars giving each other lifts in non-descript private vehicles, sometimes driving and sometimes acting as a passenger. And no cash physically changing hands. How do you physically identify & regulate these moving targets?
 
Chomsky said:
You really should consider Uber or Lyft, Maggie. Both are extremely active in Chicagoland. Try it, and you'll be hooked!
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I'll never use Uber. Getting in a strangers car is lunacy. I'll always choose to support cab drivers. It's an old school profession and they get me where I want to go without needing to follow an app on their IPhone.
 
HenryChinaski said:
I'll never use Uber. Getting in a strangers car is lunacy. I'll always choose to support cab drivers. It's an old school profession and they get me where I want to go without needing to follow an app on their IPhone.
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Not only will I use Uber, but I'm eager to see the expansion of even newer services like Bridj.com
 
MaggieD said:
Right you are. The monopoly the City of Chicago has on the taxi business is just short of criminal. A suburban cab called to pick up in the city can lose his cab to the impound lot and have a $500 or more ticket to pay for not having one of those Medallions on his windshield.

And how badly do you think cabbies are cheating customers to pay for those things? At O'Hare, which is in the suburbs, but annexed as an island to the city of Chicago in a political fiasco years ago, suburban cabs are ostracized and can't work the cab stands. The Chicago taxi fares are double the meter out of downtown Chicago and out of O'Hare. I took a taxi from Navy Pier to my home... by law, I couldn't use a suburban taxi... the fare was double the meter by law. Distance 26 miles. Fare without tip $90.

Time for that to stop!
Click to expand...

Of course you could use a suburban taxi - you just have to call and arrange the ride in advance. What is not allowed is a suburban taxi to do a Chicago to Chicago ride - it must begin or end in a suburb. Or you could use Uber, like everyone else.

The taxi situation in Chicago is stupid, but its what happens when you have a legacy system that gets disrupted by a new system, like Uber and Lyft. The monopoly on taxis in Chicago is not criminal at all - its a way to allow people who spent a lot of money on the old medallion system to not lose everything, while still maintaining driver and cab standards and legal metered rates.

At O'Hare, suburban cabs need to be called - and given that I am in O'Hare multiple times per month and know both the taxi lines and the suburban system - I find calling for an American Taxi takes as much time or less than waiting in the cab line at OHare.
 
HenryChinaski said:
I'll never use Uber. Getting in a strangers car is lunacy. I'll always choose to support cab drivers. It's an old school profession and they get me where I want to go without needing to follow an app on their IPhone.
Click to expand...

How is a random cab driver less of a stranger than a rated Uber driver?
 
Ikari said:
This is because of Uber though, right? I guess I don't necessarily understand the situation. Why do taxis require a medallion, but Uber doesn't? If it's government enforced, why don't they also require Uber to have a medallion?

Not that I'm against Uber or proper competition, free market is what I desire. I just don't get why if a taxi must have a medallion and it's enforceable by law, how Uber skirts that.
Click to expand...

Because it works like a private livery service - limos or black cars. They dont need medallions because they dont pick up on the street. But the new tech allows you to basically 'hail' an Uber via smartphone, which is even more convenient than waving your hand at passing taxis , but its still like a private car service.

The disruption is great for consumers, but terrible for taxi drivers, much like Air Bnb is great for consumers but bad for hotels.
 
Threegoofs said:
Of course you could use a suburban taxi - you just have to call and arrange the ride in advance. What is not allowed is a suburban taxi to do a Chicago to Chicago ride - it must begin or end in a suburb. Or you could use Uber, like everyone else.

The taxi situation in Chicago is stupid, but its what happens when you have a legacy system that gets disrupted by a new system, like Uber and Lyft. The monopoly on taxis in Chicago is not criminal at all - its a way to allow people who spent a lot of money on the old medallion system to not lose everything, while still maintaining driver and cab standards and legal metered rates.

At O'Hare, suburban cabs need to be called - and given that I am in O'Hare multiple times per month and know both the taxi lines and the suburban system - I find calling for an American Taxi takes as much time or less than waiting in the cab line at OHare.
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Well, maybe you know something Tom doesn't know. He just quit driving his own taxi after 15 years. Did you drive? He could not pick up in the city period. Chicago to suburbs or not. Calling a suburban taxi from the airport takes usually about 15 minutes. I've never known the taxi line to be that long since the line of taxis is almost endless. Next...next...next... Plus unless you live here, you would have no idea the fare difference or who to call.

Ok, so I asked Tom to confirm what I thought I knew. He said that, depending on what cop stopped you, you might get away with it. But if the cop wanted to stick it to the driver, or if they were turning up the heat on drivers, they could ask for your Public Chauffeur's License. Few suburban drivers have one, and they are required in the city. Cab towed and impounded. Large fine.
 
Renae said:
Oh, look... competition reduces the over inflated values protected by government and unions... The real threat to their power is the free market enterprise system that enables more people to have a bite of the economic pie... not just those that the elite allow to partake for their own needs.
Click to expand...

I regularly use ridesharing over taxis but let's not kid ourselves as to why Uber is so much cheaper.
As shown in Exhibit 2, for the year ending September 2015, Uber had GAAP losses of $2 billion on revenue of $1.4 billion, a negative 143% profit margin. Thus Uber’s current operations depend on $2 billion in subsidies, funded out of the $13 billion in cash its investors have provided.

Uber passengers were paying only 41% of the actual cost of their trips; Uber was using these massive subsidies to undercut the fares and provide more capacity than the competitors who had to cover 100% of their costs out of passenger fares.
Click to expand...
 
HenryChinaski said:
I'll never use Uber. Getting in a strangers car is lunacy. I'll always choose to support cab drivers. It's an old school profession and they get me where I want to go without needing to follow an app on their IPhone.
Click to expand...

If you enjoy getting price-gouged, go for it. I'll never take another taxi again when I can take Uber for less than half the price.
 
MaggieD said:
Well, maybe you know something Tom doesn't know. He just quit driving his own taxi after 15 years. Did you drive? He could not pick up in the city period. Chicago to suburbs or not. Calling a suburban taxi from the airport takes usually about 15 minutes. I've never known the taxi line to be that long since the line of taxis is almost endless. Next...next...next... Plus unless you live here, you would have no idea the fare difference or who to call.

Ok, so I asked Tom to confirm what I thought I knew. He said that, depending on what cop stopped you, you might get away with it. But if the cop wanted to stick it to the driver, or if they were turning up the heat on drivers, they could ask for your Public Chauffeur's License. Few suburban drivers have one, and they are required in the city. Cab towed and impounded. Large fine.
Click to expand...

I have no idea about some guy named Tom, but I can tell you that I have called for a taxi in the city from a suburban cab company in the city - from downtown, Wrigley Field, etc, and they never have a problem picking me up and bringing me home to the suburbs. If you look at the American Taxi website, its quite clear that the only thing they cant do it Chicago to Chicago rides. I supposed cops could pull anyone over and make up stuff and impound cars....

Im not sure how often you are in a taxi line to go to the city when you live in the suburbs... but Ive done both, and standing indoors waiting fora taxi is much more preferable than a long line outside.

However, Uber is much better. These days, I use them almost exclusively for non- airport related rides. I havent switched for airport transit because taxis have been amazingly reliable and always arrive much earlier than scheduled (plus... I"m not paying if its for work!).
 
Spartacus FPV said:
How is a random cab driver less of a stranger than a rated Uber driver?
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The taxicab driver is backed by their company. That's what they do for a living. I get people want to make a few bucks on the side. But I'm gonna choose to hire a professional and help put money in their pocket. I also wouldn't go get a haircut from a plumber who's trying to make a few bucks on the side cutting hair just so I can save a few dollars.
 
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HenryChinaski said:
The taxicab driver is back by their company. That's what they do for a living. I get people want to make a few bucks on the side. But I'm gonna choose to hire a professional and help put money in their pocket. I also wouldn't go get a haircut from a plumber who's trying to make a few bucks on the side cutting hair just so I can save a few dollars.
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A professional? :lamo

What a terrible comparison, most anyone can get you from A to B, even a plumber. Giving a good haircut takes skill.

Spend your money as you like, but in my book a professional offers a BETTER service than any rank amateur. I haven't been in a cab in years, since the worst Uber driver I've had has been better than the best cabs I saw in the 90's & 00's.
 
Groogrux said:
If you enjoy getting price-gouged, go for it. I'll never take another taxi again when I can take Uber for less than half the price.
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Eh, when I get in a cab I'm paying for peace of mind. Majority of the people that use Uber don't even tip. My best friend has been driving for them for a while and he rarely ever gets a tip, yet people are raving about how much cheaper it is. The yuppies can have Uber.
 
HenryChinaski said:
I'll never use Uber. Getting in a strangers car is lunacy. I'll always choose to support cab drivers. It's an old school profession and they get me where I want to go without needing to follow an app on their IPhone.
Click to expand...
To each their own, Henry.

But in Chicago the drivers are background-checked, the cars get annual safety inspection, the drivers must carry personal insurance, and Uber carries 1M liability insurance on the driver and the vehicle. No money ever physically changes hands, and most riders much prefer the rideshare experience to taxicabs. If you're in the busier downtown, near south, or lakefront areas of the city, the response times are usually only a minute or two for most of the day and night.
 
Ikari said:
This is because of Uber though, right? I guess I don't necessarily understand the situation. Why do taxis require a medallion, but Uber doesn't? If it's government enforced, why don't they also require Uber to have a medallion?

Not that I'm against Uber or proper competition, free market is what I desire. I just don't get why if a taxi must have a medallion and it's enforceable by law, how Uber skirts that.
Click to expand...

Because the medallion was a way to limit competition written by their laws, to ensure their pay stayed very high and that better competition could not beat them.

Uber is a different system, it bypasses alot of taxi laws which were written decades ago, and I think politicians still do not know how to control it without backlash.
 
Another industry which thought it would last forever therefore failed to evolve.

Let them all starve.
 
Threegoofs said:
Of course you could use a suburban taxi - you just have to call and arrange the ride in advance. What is not allowed is a suburban taxi to do a Chicago to Chicago ride - it must begin or end in a suburb. Or you could use Uber, like everyone else.

The taxi situation in Chicago is stupid, but its what happens when you have a legacy system that gets disrupted by a new system, like Uber and Lyft. The monopoly on taxis in Chicago is not criminal at all - its a way to allow people who spent a lot of money on the old medallion system to not lose everything, while still maintaining driver and cab standards and legal metered rates.

At O'Hare, suburban cabs need to be called - and given that I am in O'Hare multiple times per month and know both the taxi lines and the suburban system - I find calling for an American Taxi takes as much time or less than waiting in the cab line at OHare.
Click to expand...
You know Uber & Lyft are now licensed at MDW & ORD, right?

They are in a rideshare lot at the southeast edge of the airport, and total response time to get to the rideshare pick-up areas is under 5 mins.
 
Chomsky said:
To each their own, Henry.

But in Chicago the drivers are background-checked, the cars get annual safety inspection, the drivers must carry personal insurance, and Uber carries 1M liability insurance on the driver and the vehicle. No money ever physically changes hands, and most riders much prefer the rideshare experience to taxicabs. If you're in the busier downtown, near south, or lakefront areas of the city, the response times are usually only a minute or two for most of the day and night.
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Thats cool but I'm a traditionalist and I'd only use Uber if it was an emergency situation and I couldn't get a cab. To me there's just something wrong about getting in somebody's personal vehicle that you do not know.
 
Chomsky said:
You know Uber & Lyft are now licensed at MDW & ORD, right?

They are in a rideshare lot at the southeast edge of the airport, and total response time to get to the rideshare pick-up areas is under 5 mins.
Click to expand...

I've heard, but I haven't used it from the airport yet. Maybe next week...
 
HenryChinaski said:
Eh, when I get in a cab I'm paying for peace of mind. Majority of the people that use Uber don't even tip. My best friend has been driving for them for a while and he rarely ever gets a tip, yet people are raving about how much cheaper it is. The yuppies can have Uber.
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That's true about tipping, my DH occasionally drives for Uber. About 25% of his passengers tip. In the suburbs, Uber is king. It's faster, cheaper and more reliable.
 
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