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State depts entire senior management team has just resigned

Aristaeus

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This is a massive snub to Trump and it will be very difficult to find people with the knowledge and experience to replace them.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...nt-team-just-resigned/?utm_term=.885fd61774fd

Department expertise in security, management, administrative and consular positions in particular are very difficult to replicate and particularly difficult to find in the private sector.

As I understand it, and anybody is free to correct where I'm wrong, is that career officials normally hand in their resignations as a gesture in not assuming that they have a lifetime job. Of course they are needed because they know how everything operates and the next President refuses their resignations. At least, that's the tradition. Only, Trump isn't big into tradition, because he rather brusquely demanded their resignations, perhaps not knowing about the traditions at all, and when the time came around that Trump's staff learned that nobody knew how to work anything...too late. The entire staff was gone.

So yeah, there's no functioning State Department in the White House.
 
This is a massive snub to Trump and it will be very difficult to find people with the knowledge and experience to replace them.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...nt-team-just-resigned/?utm_term=.885fd61774fd

Department expertise in security, management, administrative and consular positions in particular are very difficult to replicate and particularly difficult to find in the private sector.

Too bad, so sad. :boohoo:

Fortunately there are a ready pool of Americans seeking good jobs in this economy, and certainly significant numbers of lower level officials who've been there long enough (and who the top guys depended on all this time) who deserve a chance to shine. :yes:

Maybe this is another opportunity to "drain the swamp?" (Especially of Clinton/Obama cronies.) :coffeepap:
 
Too bad, so sad. :boohoo:

Fortunately there are a ready pool of Americans seeking good jobs in this economy, and certainly significant numbers of lower level officials who've been there long enough (and who the top guys depended on all this time) who deserve a chance to shine. :yes:

Maybe this is another opportunity to "drain the swamp?" (Especially of Clinton/Obama cronies.) :coffeepap:

The staff have worked there under numerous administrations.
 
As I understand it, and anybody is free to correct where I'm wrong, is that career officials normally hand in their resignations as a gesture in not assuming that they have a lifetime job. Of course they are needed because they know how everything operates and the next President refuses their resignations. At least, that's the tradition. Only, Trump isn't big into tradition, because he rather brusquely demanded their resignations, perhaps not knowing about the traditions at all, and when the time came around that Trump's staff learned that nobody knew how to work anything...too late. The entire staff was gone.

So yeah, there's no functioning State Department in the White House.

I am pretty sure that accepting the resignations is not outside the realm of normal. Does not happen every time, but it does happen. In this case, they where told to tender their resignations(along with a whole ****load of others). U.S. State Dept cites standard practice in resignations | Reuters

he U.S. State Department said on Thursday that the outgoing administration in coordination with the incoming one had requested "all politically appointed officers submit letters of resignation" as is standard practice.

"Of the officers whose resignations were accepted, some will continue in the Foreign Service in other positions and others will retire by choice or because they have exceeded the time limits of their grade in service," a statement by acting State Department spokesman, Mark Toner, said.

There are lots of things to criticize Trump over(oh lord, lots and lots and lots), but this really is not it.
 
I am pretty sure that accepting the resignations is not outside the realm of normal. Does not happen every time, but it does happen. In this case, they where told to tender their resignations(along with a whole ****load of others). U.S. State Dept cites standard practice in resignations | Reuters



There are lots of things to criticize Trump over(oh lord, lots and lots and lots), but this really is not it.

What makes it unusual is the sheer number of departing veterans and the vacuum of talent it leaves.
 
As I understand it, and anybody is free to correct where I'm wrong, is that career officials normally hand in their resignations as a gesture in not assuming that they have a lifetime job. Of course they are needed because they know how everything operates and the next President refuses their resignations. At least, that's the tradition. Only, Trump isn't big into tradition, because he rather brusquely demanded their resignations, perhaps not knowing about the traditions at all, and when the time came around that Trump's staff learned that nobody knew how to work anything...too late. The entire staff was gone.

So yeah, there's no functioning State Department in the White House.

I'm sure that will help greatly with the NAFTA and asia-pacific trade negotiations

He probably wants them gone so to not meddle in his deal with Putin to have the US become a Russian territory
 
Too bad, so sad. :boohoo:

Fortunately there are a ready pool of Americans seeking good jobs in this economy, and certainly significant numbers of lower level officials who've been there long enough (and who the top guys depended on all this time) who deserve a chance to shine. :yes:

Maybe this is another opportunity to "drain the swamp?" (Especially of Clinton/Obama cronies.) :coffeepap:

Undersecretary for Management Patrick Kennedy was part of the Bush cabinet, and has been in public service since 1973. That is a ****load of experience. This Clinton/Obama crony once barred state department employees in Europe from attending an Obama speech during the 2008 election to avoid even the appearance of partisanship.

Assistant Secretary of State for Administration Joyce Anne Barr entered public service 1979. She was Bush's ambassador to Namibia. She has also held assignments in Stockholm (1980), Budapest (1982), Nairobi (1985), Khartoum (1989), Ashgabat (1998), and Kuala Lumpur. That is a whole ****load of important experience. I can't find a single negative comment about her.

Assistant Secretary of State for Consular Affairs Michele Bond joined the foreign service in 1977. Spent a large chunk of her career in Eastern Europe. Another I can find no single negative word about.

Director of the Office of Foreign Missions, Ambassador Gentry O. Smith started out as a police officer in North Carolina. He joined the state department after that, has spent time in Cairo and Tokyo, both places where an experienced, knowledgeable hand would be handy. Like the last 2, I fond a major lack of criticism about him.

"Draining the swamp" does not mean randomly letting all the experienced people go. That leaves the swamp, and adds a quagmire that all of State will have to wade through, as response times and experience is significantly lower. At least with Kennedy there was allegations of some level of "swamp". The other three, not so much. Trump is within his rights to keep or let go as he pleases. I don't really think this is a big deal. However, to portray it as a victory in the fight to "drain the swamp" is naive and sad.
 
What makes it unusual is the sheer number of departing veterans and the vacuum of talent it leaves.

I don't have numbers, but I think it is simply a matter of degree. It is a potential problem, but not a critical one. And elections do have consequences. Trump does get to pick who works for the executive branch. While I think it is a mistake, I am much more concerned with his economic stupidity(publicly stating you are considering a 20 % punitive tariff is insane!) and his constantly being triggered by any one who does not kiss his ass.
 
I don't have numbers, but I think it is simply a matter of degree. It is a potential problem, but not a critical one. And elections do have consequences. Trump does get to pick who works for the executive branch. While I think it is a mistake, I am much more concerned with his economic stupidity(publicly stating you are considering a 20 % punitive tariff is insane!) and his constantly being triggered by any one who does not kiss his ass.

It's meaningful, but yeah, compared to the eight hundred other really important things that came out today, it's boring as hell.

Christopher Hayes: "Every day feels like ten days."
 
Undersecretary for Management Patrick Kennedy was part of the Bush cabinet, and has been in public service since 1973. That is a ****load of experience. This Clinton/Obama crony once barred state department employees in Europe from attending an Obama speech during the 2008 election to avoid even the appearance of partisanship.

Assistant Secretary of State for Administration Joyce Anne Barr entered public service 1979. She was Bush's ambassador to Namibia. She has also held assignments in Stockholm (1980), Budapest (1982), Nairobi (1985), Khartoum (1989), Ashgabat (1998), and Kuala Lumpur. That is a whole ****load of important experience. I can't find a single negative comment about her.

Assistant Secretary of State for Consular Affairs Michele Bond joined the foreign service in 1977. Spent a large chunk of her career in Eastern Europe. Another I can find no single negative word about.

Director of the Office of Foreign Missions, Ambassador Gentry O. Smith started out as a police officer in North Carolina. He joined the state department after that, has spent time in Cairo and Tokyo, both places where an experienced, knowledgeable hand would be handy. Like the last 2, I fond a major lack of criticism about him.

"Draining the swamp" does not mean randomly letting all the experienced people go. That leaves the swamp, and adds a quagmire that all of State will have to wade through, as response times and experience is significantly lower. At least with Kennedy there was allegations of some level of "swamp". The other three, not so much. Trump is within his rights to keep or let go as he pleases. I don't really think this is a big deal. However, to portray it as a victory in the fight to "drain the swamp" is naive and sad.

Did you miss the part about the need to stop doing what we have been doing?

Global management has failed.

It gets replaced now.

WITH NEW
 
Did you miss the part about the need to stop doing what we have been doing?

Global management has failed.

It gets replaced now.

WITH NEW

What have those people done wrong? Come on, explain what they have done that is not the right thing, other than work for people you do not like.

Maybe you did not notice this, but we are the top world power militarily, politically and economically. Apparently those people who have gone before have done something right.
 
What have those people done wrong? Come on, explain what they have done that is not the right thing, other than work for people you do not like.

Maybe you did not notice this, but we are the top world power militarily, politically and economically. Apparently those people who have gone before have done something right.

The delusion is strong with you.

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The delusion is strong with you.

129fs238648.gif

Why can't you answer simple questions? Why do you have to resort to insults when challenged? If you don't know the answer, it would probably be best to admit it instead of trying to avoid answering....
 
Why can't you answer simple questions? Why do you have to resort to insults when challenged? If you don't know the answer, it would probably be best to admit it instead of trying to avoid answering....

The answer is that the elite have made a hash of things, and increasingly peoples around the world are saying ENOUGH!

I dont feel the need to care about the details of what went wrong where, there is more important stuff to do, shove the old aside if it looks shabby and do something new.

If Trump thinks that we should strip the State Department and start fresh then that is all I need to know.
 
It appears to me the outgoing administration has sabotaged the incoming.
 
The staff have worked there under numerous administrations.

See below.

Undersecretary for Management Patrick Kennedy was part of the Bush cabinet, and has been in public service since 1973. That is a ****load of experience.

Assistant Secretary of State for Administration Joyce Anne Barr entered public service 1979. She was Bush's ambassador to Namibia.

Assistant Secretary of State for Consular Affairs Michele Bond joined the foreign service in 1977. Spent a large chunk of her career in Eastern Europe.

Director of the Office of Foreign Missions, Ambassador Gentry O. Smith started out as a police officer in North Carolina.

"Draining the swamp" does not mean randomly letting all the experienced people go. That leaves the swamp, and adds a quagmire that all of State will have to wade through, as response times and experience is significantly lower...

To both of you, whoever said drain the swamp ONLY applied to Clinton/Obama cronies? I believe the term I used was "Especially," not "Specifically:"

...Maybe this is another opportunity to "drain the swamp?" (Especially of Clinton/Obama cronies.)

Ah yes, one can clearly see that I did. :yes:

Now, while your arguments appear to be in support of "old boy" networks being important if not necessary to the smooth running of a ship of State; I beg to differ.

Yes, it can be helpful to have people of vast experience in positions of advice.

However, it can also be problematic in that old ideas and ways of thinking may no longer be suitable in an ever changing political climate.

Old boys advised President's to ignore the entreaties of popular revolutionaries like Ho Chi Minh and Fidel Castro, who both came to us first for aid against colonial and corrupt governments. But we turned them away, leaving them to the Commies and decades of problems including the Vietnam War, the Bay of Pigs, the Cuban Blockade, etc.

Old boys advised President's to prop up dictator's like the Shah of Iran and Saddam Hussein. That led us to the ongoing political difficulties with Iran and the wars and problems with Iraq and ISIS.

Meanwhile, what new President who faced open ridicule and dissention not only from rival political organizations, but from members of his own political Party (i.e. all those "open letters") would not want to ensure that only those who were loyal to his goals and willing to work actively to achieve them replaced untrustworthy "old guard" bureaucrats if the opportunity came?

I see nothing wrong with his accepting all the resignations and cleaning house. He did run on a "Change" platform, and unlike his predecessors it looks like he fully intends to act on that policy. :shrug:

It is too early for all you chicken littles with your "sky is falling" rhetoric.

Of course this may very well entail some confusion and upset...but like any major change things well eventually sort themselves out again. :coffeepap:
 
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The top four officials here were basically fired. Those particular positions are political appointments, and not career State Dept. positions.
 
What have those people done wrong? Come on, explain what they have done that is not the right thing, other than work for people you do like?

I think they were fired

Liberals are trying to skin as a disaster for presid not trump but I bet every new president wished he could do the same thing

There may be many more government employees following them out the door
 
The staff have worked there under numerous administrations.

If I were a new manager, I would see that as a problem. Why would I want a bunch of people that know how to do things the same old way they have always been done?

If I were just elected on the premise that I was going to change direction, then yes, I would replace the old Captains with new ones that will steer the ship in another direction.

I just don't see the value in doing something just because it is the way it has always been done before.
 
If I were a new manager, I would see that as a problem. Why would I want a bunch of people that know how to do things the same old way they have always been done?

If I were just elected on the premise that I was going to change direction, then yes, I would replace the old Captains with new ones that will steer the ship in another direction.

I just don't see the value in doing something just because it is the way it has always been done before.

That's why when I want my car looked at I bring it to my dry cleaner rather than the certified Toyota repairpeople. Why would I want my car looked at by people who have been repairing Toyotas their whole lives? Obviously it's just silly.
 
If I were a new manager, I would see that as a problem. Why would I want a bunch of people that know how to do things the same old way they have always been done?

If I were just elected on the premise that I was going to change direction, then yes, I would replace the old Captains with new ones that will steer the ship in another direction.

I just don't see the value in doing something just because it is the way it has always been done before.

Liberals thought trump did not actually mean the things he said and now they are in shock to realize that he really does
 
That's why when I want my car looked at I bring it to my dry cleaner rather than the certified Toyota repairpeople. Why would I want my car looked at by people who have been repairing Toyotas their whole lives? Obviously it's just silly.

Nonsense

Every service mananger has an assistant and no doubt be is irreplaceable
 
Every service mananger has an assistant and no one is irreplaceable
 
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