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Michigan recount reveals error, but not the one Jill Stein wanted

Grim17 said:
I understood it perfectly.
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No you don't. There are several facts you obviously don't know.

Grim17 said:
In 37% of the precincts in Detroit (10% of the state's total precincts), the number of votes they reported as cast exceeded the actual number of people who voted.
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The 10% stated in your second link is of the whole state and not just Detroit. And there was about 22% of Detroit's precincts that didn't have enough ballots.

Did you bother to read the article linked to in your first link? A hell of a lot more information than what was in those two pitifully short articles you linked to.

Records: Too many votes in 37% of Detroit’s precincts

Grim17 said:
I also understand they are investigating the issue, but when the state finds that 248 precincts reported more votes were cast than people who voted, and every single one of the 248 precincts were in Detroit, which is run almost exclusively by democrats and dominated by democratic voters, I find that to be one hell of a coincidence. Whether it ends up being voter fraud or not, the stench of it is pretty thick, whether you choose to admit it or not.
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It wasn't just in Detroit. There was similar problems is counties outside of Detroit. From that article I just linked to:

Overall, state records show 10.6 percent of the precincts in the 22 counties that began the retabulation process couldn’t be recounted because of state law that bars recounts for unbalanced precincts or ones with broken seals.
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In Washtenaw County, 23 of 150 precincts, about 15 percent, could not be recounted. Other counties with high percentages of unrecountable precincts include Branch (27 percent); Cass (24 percent); Wayne (24 percent) and Ionia (24 percent).
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Branch, Cass, and Ionia counties all went for Trump.(scroll down for individual counties) So.... No. These problems didn't only happen in democrat controlled precincts in Detroit.

Grim17 said:
Since I'm not a reporter, journalist or TV news anchor, your "fake news" comment is as bogus and dishonest as the Clinton Foundation and Hillary Clinton herself. I posted the actual headline from the story, excerpts from the actual story itself, then expressed my opinion based on that story. Last time I checked, that was the purpose of a political discussion forum... except in my case, I didn't dishonestly label someone's opinion as "fake news" because I disagreed with it.
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Yeah... well this is how a lot of fake news gets started. People like you get your facts wrong and base your opinions on bad or incomplete information and then you post it on media like this forum. Next thing you know all the right wingers are crying about voter fraud as if it has been proven. And then even if the investigations don't show any fraud, many of those right wingers will go on believing there was fraud.
 
Buzz said:
It wasn't just in Detroit. There was similar problems is counties outside of Detroit. From that article I just linked to:
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You are correct. Let me restate things...

The state is only auditing the 20 precincts that had MAJOR discrepancies, all of which are in Detroit where a) every Mayor for the last 54 years has been a democrat, b) there hasn't been a republican on the city council for 22 years, and c) they voted for Clinton over Trump 95% to 3%. So you'll excuse me if that still doesn't change my opinion that stench of voter fraud is in the air.

.






Yeah... well this is how a lot of fake news gets started. People like you get your facts wrong and base your opinions on bad or incomplete information and then you post it on media like this forum. Next thing you know all the right wingers are crying about voter fraud as if it has been proven. And then even if the investigations don't show any fraud, many of those right wingers will go on believing there was fraud.[/QUOTE]
 
Grim17 said:
You are correct. Let me restate things...

The state is only auditing the 20 precincts that had MAJOR discrepancies, all of which are in Detroit where a) every Mayor for the last 54 years has been a democrat, b) there hasn't been a republican on the city council for 22 years, and c) they voted for Clinton over Trump 95% to 3%. So you'll excuse me if that still doesn't change my opinion that stench of voter fraud is in the air.

.






Yeah... well this is how a lot of fake news gets started. People like you get your facts wrong and base your opinions on bad or incomplete information and then you post it on media like this forum. Next thing you know all the right wingers are crying about voter fraud as if it has been proven. And then even if the investigations don't show any fraud, many of those right wingers will go on believing there was fraud.
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[/QUOTE]


It may be possible to have more votes than ballots in that voting machine box, if someone were able to open the box storing the ballots on that machine, and re-run the ballots through the machine. Maybe just the ballots that were for the desired candidate, then lock the box back up. Maybe after the polls closed, but in the time period before the machines were tabulated.

A crooked poll worker could also obtain extra ballots, run them through the voting machine, without opening the ballot box. Then there would be more ballots than people who voted.

Just guessing.


WATCH: Computer Programmer Testifies He Helped Rig Voting Machines

//
 


It may be possible to have more votes than ballots in that voting machine box, if someone were able to open the box storing the ballots on that machine, and re-run the ballots through the machine. Maybe just the ballots that were for the desired candidate, then lock the box back up. Maybe after the polls closed, but in the time period before the machines were tabulated.

A crooked poll worker could also obtain extra ballots, run them through the voting machine, without opening the ballot box. Then there would be more ballots than people who voted.

Just guessing.


WATCH: Computer Programmer Testifies He Helped Rig Voting Machines

//[/QUOTE]

the votes are audited before becoming official. this is to stop those exact things from happening.
that is why there is such a small margin of votes like this. districts in which this happen the canvasing board catches and
tells them to fix it.
 
apdst said:
The proof has been revealed. The Libbos tried to steal the election.
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there is little or no evidence of this yet.

so far the consensus is that machines had issues in reading ballots and some where read twice when they tried to
be rescanned.
 
Deuce said:
My reaction is the opposite of knee jerk. I am, in fact, awaiting further investigations.

Because last time these exact allegations arose, they turned out to be erroneous. I am capable of learning from history. Others, it seems, are not.
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Perpetuality...waiting further investigations.
 
ludin said:
there is little or no evidence of this yet.

so far the consensus is that machines had issues in reading ballots and some where read twice when they tried to
be rescanned.
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The machines were rigged by the Libbos.
 
AlbqOwl said:
It has happened more than once in New Mexico--not so much at the national level but at the local level. It is amazing in elections with razor thin margins how often a 'forgotten' ballot box is magically located with just enough ballots to tip the election in favor of a certain party. Always the same party.

But yes, let's investigate this for sure to be fair to Hillary.

But no need to investigate anything that makes Trump look bad. Of course all that is automatically true, just like the Russians helped get him elected, etc. even though the CIA isn't willing to say who among them thinks that and the FBI says there is no evidence.

Sometimes I could just spit.
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I have a feeling that this has more to do with your personal selection bias and that you are extrapolating out alot more meaning to the very few instances you've seen than should be. I mean, these extra ballots have already been counted during the actual count, so no ones arguing that they are new ballots or something.

Also "no need to investigate anything that makes Trump look bad", but that's exactly what people are requesting. People are requesting an investigation to get all the facts. The evidence apparently is pretty strong by what I've heard, but like I said, I support looking into it. Just as you would support looking in to it if all this had happened in Hillary's favor. And I'm not suggesting that it should be used to get rid of Trump, but just so we have the info and can be prepared for these attempts next election.

I don't know why that upsets you so much. The republicans control all of congress and the presidency, along with majority of governors and state governments. If you're still spending your entire day bitching about the other side then you need to see a doctor and get on medication. Seriously.
 
No wonder Hillary Clinton and the Democrats didn't want to initiate recounts - they knew they'd fixed the vote and would be caught.
 
roughdraft274 said:
I have a feeling that this has more to do with your personal selection bias and that you are extrapolating out alot more meaning to the very few instances you've seen than should be. I mean, these extra ballots have already been counted during the actual count, so no ones arguing that they are new ballots or something.

Also "no need to investigate anything that makes Trump look bad", but that's exactly what people are requesting. People are requesting an investigation to get all the facts. The evidence apparently is pretty strong by what I've heard, but like I said, I support looking into it. Just as you would support looking in to it if all this had happened in Hillary's favor. And I'm not suggesting that it should be used to get rid of Trump, but just so we have the info and can be prepared for these attempts next election.

So your response was unnecessarily insulting and completely non sequitur to the post that you failed to rebut in any way.

I don't know why that upsets you so much. The republicans control all of congress and the presidency, along with majority of governors and state governments. If you're still spending your entire day bitching about the other side then you need to see a doctor and get on medication. Seriously.
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As I was not commenting on the Republican control of Congress or anything else related to the federal government in that particular post re New Mexico, I have no reason why you are so concerned about my bias or what I am bitching about or whether I need to see a doctor. I was commenting on the blatant bias that everything Trump does 'merits investigation' but nothing Hillary does seems to merit much investigation.

Is it something in the water some of you folks drink that makes you attack the opponent and incapable of discussing a topic?
 
apdst said:
Perpetuality...waiting further investigations.
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Yes, because every time you guys allege mass numbers of "potential" voter fraud instances, like the "dead vote" situations, you don't bother to wait for that. And every single time it turns out to not be thousands of dead votes. Same with these overvote totals.

And because you only read your right-wing blogs, you never hear the followup. You never hear the allegations turning out to be false. So in your memory, you believe them all to be true.

This time, I expect, it will turn out like every other time. And you'll never learn.

Here's a link with some examples. We both know you'll never read it all, I'm just proving my point about you.
https://www.brennancenter.org/publication/truth-about-voter-fraud
 
AlbqOwl said:
As I was not commenting on the Republican control of Congress or anything else related to the federal government in that particular post re New Mexico, I have no reason why you are so concerned about my bias or what I am bitching about or whether I need to see a doctor. I was commenting on the blatant bias that everything Trump does 'merits investigation' but nothing Hillary does seems to merit much investigation.

Is it something in the water some of you folks drink that makes you attack the opponent and incapable of discussing a topic?
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Because Clinton hasn't been investigated?

Seriously, I can't listen to your tripe any more. Have fun with that.
 
roughdraft274 said:
Because Clinton hasn't been investigated?

Seriously, I can't listen to your tripe any more. Have fun with that.
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Oh good. I am so happy to hear that. I won't have to respond to any more of your posts telling me how terrible I am. Have a great day though.
 
AlbqOwl said:
Oh good. I am so happy to hear that. I won't have to respond to any more of your posts telling me how terrible I am. Have a great day though.
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Well, I'll happily criticize the absurd insinuation that Clinton didn't undergo scrutiny.
 
Deuce said:
Well, I'll happily criticize the absurd insinuation that Clinton didn't undergo scrutiny.
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Of course she did. By Congress. By the 'underground' press. On message boards. In social media. And to some extent by Fox News. But many of the issues that called for congressional hearings were mostly non existent in the remainder of the MSM. For every Trump 'scandal' they devote long minutes to discuss and dissect it, while emerging Hillary 'scandals' merited at most a few seconds if they were mentioned at all. The media simply sat on a lot of Hillary stuff but on NONE of Trump stuff unless it was something favorable for Trump.

The media bias was glaring, shameful, and intolerable.

Here it is admitted Trump received far more negative coverage than Hillary in the general election cycle. They don't admit how openly hostile the press was to Trump while much less so than Hillary. But it is reported accurately for what it is. And then the source just can't resist expending several more paragraphs justifying the bias. :)
 
Grim17 said:
You are correct. Let me restate things...

The state is only auditing the 20 precincts that had MAJOR discrepancies, all of which are in Detroit where a) every Mayor for the last 54 years has been a democrat, b) there hasn't been a republican on the city council for 22 years, and c) they voted for Clinton over Trump 95% to 3%. So you'll excuse me if that still doesn't change my opinion that stench of voter fraud is in the air.
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When over 300 people vote and only 50 ballots are in the box ...it means missing ballots.

Michigan's elections bureau ordered an investigation Monday into substantial ballot discrepancies in a small portion of Detroit's voting precincts, after the discovery of a polling place where 300 people voted but only 50 ballots were properly sealed in a container.
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Precincts mark off the names of each person voted when they go through the line to receive their voting ballots. That means the missing votes were not counted.

From the article:

Detroit elections officials told the state that in the one precinct, the 250 missing ballots were left in the tabulator bin, "but we want to verify this," Woodhams said. It was not immediately clear what caused the inconsistencies in other precincts.
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There were less votes counted than were cast.

The attorney who represented Stein in her failed recount bid, Mark Brewer, said the mechanical troubles led to an undercount of votes. He estimated nearly 2,000 votes were added as a result before the recount was ordered halted "and we probably would have picked up several thousand more had the recount been allowed to continue."

Detroit has been cash-strapped so maintenance may have been a bigger issue there than elsewhere.

"These machines should have been replaced years ago across the state," Brewer said.
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Michigan to Audit 'Significant' Mismatches in Detroit Vote - ABC News
 
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