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U.S. Police Have Shot Dead 385 People In Five Months

MathewSmith said:
WASHINGTON, May 30 (Reuters) - U.S. police have shot and killed 385 people during the first five months of this year, a rate of more than two a day, the Washington Post reported on Saturday.
The victims ranged in age from 16 to 83. More than 80 percent were armed with potentially lethal objects, mostly guns. Ninety-two victims were identified as mentally ill.
The Post's analysis also indicates the daily death toll for 2015 is close to 2.6 as of Friday. At that pace, police will have shot and killed nearly 1,000 people by the end of the year, the paper said.

U.S. Police Have Shot Dead 385 People In Five Months: REPORT

I'm scared as hell. How did it get this bad? When have they turned into bad characters? And why?! Do the police ever evaluate whether any of those killings are avoidable? or preventable? And what can we do to change the situation? Because the situation is really horrible!
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Apparently you missed the part where 80% of the subjects were armed with lethal objects, mostly guns.
 
RDS said:
If you make a projection for 10 years then the police will kill more people than the number of soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan combined. 4,486 U.S. soldiers died in Iraq and 2,345 U.S. soldiers died in Afghanistan.
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So.... they should just let the 80+% of those who they shot who were armed with a lethal object kill them or other innocent people instead?

Did any of you actually read the freaking OP?
 
CMPancake said:
When in doubt, let's blame the victims of the problem instead of the actual problem.
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If you are assaulting cops you are not a victim and you are the problem.

If you are assaulting cops I wonder what other crimes you have done to hurt innocent people. **** criminals. Cop lives matter, criminal lives dont.
 
Paschendale said:
It's interesting to note that most posters who are defending police here are applying their own circumstances to the problem. Middle class white people are imagining a lone encounter with police going south, and saying that you just go along with the arrest and argue in court. Instead, most of these victims are poor black kids who are harassed constantly by police and aren't often arrested. They're being subject to extrajudicial punishment from police and have no recourse in the courts to fight it, especially since they can't afford lawyers. Does anyone really think that an overworked public defender is going to explore constitutional issues of police conduct for them? Of course not. There's going to be a quick plea deal. NONE of the recourses and suggestions offered by comfortable middle class white people will help poor blacks escape constant harassment and abuse from police. And no one should have to simply obey in such a situation.
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Dang, you just made up a whole bunch of unsupported claims in this post while criticizing others for viewing the scenario without bias.
 
WCH said:
Interesting that 92% were 'mentally ill'. Perhaps we can trace this back to the patient rights (PC) movement advocates that put many of the mentally ill out on the streets several decades ago?
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Not 92%... just the number 92....
 
roguenuke said:
You have no authority to kill someone who resists a citizens arrest, even if you think they are a threat.

And NC does not allow citizens arrests. Shoplifters cannot be detained by store owners/workers here, not even security people.
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That isn't true actually.

I responded to many shoplifters detained by Asset Protection employees at Wal-Mart, Harris Teeter, Lowe's Foods, etc (especially during my short tenure on 2nd shift). It is perfectly legal to detain someone.
 
rocket88 said:
And what about the other 20%? Don't you think that the government killing 20% of the citizenry is a problem?

I find it nothing but amusing that the same people who claim to have been afraid of "Obama's death panels" are totally ok with the police killing hundreds of people. Is it ok as long as they're potentially Democratic voters?
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You mean 20% of those who happened to be killed (Not of the total population...*doh*) who were not armed. As far as I know, the OP doesn't state what those 20% were doing at the time of their deaths, and what was or was not considered a "lethal object". For example.... If I am bat**** crazy and trying to drive you down in my pickup... one would say that the vehicle is not a lethal object.... but did the OP's article consider that?

I, for one, am willing to believe that there is a portion of that 20% who were otherwise a lethal threat to Officers. I am also willing to concede that there may be a portion of that 20% whose death at the hands of Officers is questionable.

And who the **** said anything about Democratic voters? Quit being a partisan tool.

I am okay with law enforcement killing hundreds of people who were armed with lethal weapons intent on doing law enforcement harm... yes.. I am completely okay with it.

I would rather 200 violent offenders be killed than 1 officer's life risked.
 
Caine said:
That isn't true actually.

I responded to many shoplifters detained by Asset Protection employees at Wal-Mart, Harris Teeter, Lowe's Foods, etc (especially during my short tenure on 2nd shift). It is perfectly legal to detain someone.
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If they agree to be detained. You cannot force them to stay. An asset protection employee has power only because many don't realize that they cannot be forced to stay there if they don't want to. They can walk out and there absolutely no level of violence (beyond that needed to disengage) the Loss prevention person can do about it. While they can't get in trouble for keeping them, they don't have power of force to back up their authoritative commands for the person to stay. Most stores, including WalMart, have policies that specify that if a suspected shoplifter becomes in any way violent, the protection specialists and all other employees are supposed to disengage and contact law enforcement.

Hell, Loss Prevention has killed people at WalMarts for suspected shoplifting.

It's Time for Wal-Mart Employees to Stop Killing Shoplifters!*|*Al Norman

These guys really are untrained. Does anyone know if any of them were charged? I can't find any information that they were. It's called being overzealous in your job.
 
JANFU said:
Why have so many Police Depts been investigated by DOJ and found to be severely lacking with following the laws on the books? Officers flagrantly ignoring the law, until it instills a culture within the Dept itself.

How many investigations by DOJ does it take before Police Depts and their leadership to get the message, you follow the law, you enforce the law, you do not make Law.
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Care to provide any evidence of all that crap you just said?

SPECIFICALLY, something to the effect that police departments are making law...
 
ThePlayDrive said:
When did the burden of proof stop being on the people who make definitive statements?
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Well, then, let me re phrase. None of the murdered were killed by police as far as I know. If any significant number (any number greater than zero, most likely) had been killed by cops and not by gangs that fact would certainly have made the national news.
 
Gaius46 said:
I used the example, in another post, of a man who killed his wife's lover in a jealous rage, or perhaps someone who killed someone who harmed their child. In both of those examples the killer is not likely to pose a threat to anyone, especially if they are unarmed. It's not really all that hard to imagine people who kill someone out of passion or stupidity and don't pose a threat to the rest of us.

My only point is that just because the crime is a murder it doesn't automatically mean the cop can shoot the person if they feel. They still need to pass the Garner test.
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You're right--the mere fact the crime the police suspect an apparently unarmed escaping felon has committed is murder or manslaughter does not by itself give them the probable cause to believe he poses the substantial threat of serious harm or death they need to use deadly force to prevent his escape.

Conversely, police might have the probable cause they needed to use deadly force to prevent an apparently unarmed suspected felon from escaping, even if they had no reason to believe he had committed murder or manslaughter. Police who see a suspected burglar fleeing the scene, as in Garner, know burglars sometimes commit violent felonies once inside. If they have no way to stop his escape other than to use deadly force, they can hardly be required to let him escape while they first check to see if he has committed a violent felony during the burglary.
 
roguenuke said:
The odds of being killed without provocation by a cop are much lower than be killed by some terrorist action, even lower than the odds of being killed by a disgruntled coworker or in some random shooting incident. Very few police killings, even shootings are innocent civilians and an overzealous cop, compared to the total number.
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...and your objective support/data for this statement is?????
 
Dittohead not! said:
Well, then, let me re phrase. None of the murdered were killed by police as far as I know. If any significant number (any number greater than zero, most likely) had been killed by cops and not by gangs that fact would certainly have made the national news.
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"As far as I know". At least you finally got around to admitting that you don't know for sure if any officers were directly involved. Also, the 105 number was given for deaths in the last five months so deaths before Freddie Gray would not have necessarily made it to the national news. Shootings directly involving police aside, I suppose we shouldn't even mention how a proven corrupt police department could be indirectly involved in civilian-on-civilian shootings.
 
CMPancake said:
When in doubt, let's blame the victims of the problem instead of the actual problem.
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The statistic is meaningless. Would you be "scared as hell" if 99% of those shootings were caused by a suspect trying to kill a police officer? Would you call them "victims"?
 
Caine said:
You mean 20% of those who happened to be killed (Not of the total population...*doh*) who were not armed. As far as I know, the OP doesn't state what those 20% were doing at the time of their deaths, and what was or was not considered a "lethal object". For example.... If I am bat**** crazy and trying to drive you down in my pickup... one would say that the vehicle is not a lethal object.... but did the OP's article consider that?

I, for one, am willing to believe that there is a portion of that 20% who were otherwise a lethal threat to Officers. I am also willing to concede that there may be a portion of that 20% whose death at the hands of Officers is questionable.

And who the **** said anything about Democratic voters? Quit being a partisan tool.

I am okay with law enforcement killing hundreds of people who were armed with lethal weapons intent on doing law enforcement harm... yes.. I am completely okay with it.

I would rather 200 violent offenders be killed than 1 officer's life risked.
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The HuPo article DID cite several of the remaining 20%. Many of the unarmed were drug dealers that attacked the cops while resisting arrest. Mike Brown was one of the 20%. One of them was a woman that resisted arrested and tried to escape and ran over a cops foot in the process.
 
MathewSmith said:
I'm scared as hell. How did it get this bad? When have they turned into bad characters? And why?! Do the police ever evaluate whether any of those killings are avoidable? or preventable? And what can we do to change the situation? Because the situation is really horrible!
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Over 300 of these people were armed and as of today 0bama is encouraging Black people to kill cops so the number is a little low.

Libertie76 said:
Resist arrest or the like, as in maybe making a sarcastic joke or ignoring an unlawful request, that tends to be the grounds for a police execution as well...

We have a right to life if we shut up and obey
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So you like the situation in Baltimore? That is what we get when the cops stand down and let people kill each other for making a sarcastic joke or just because. Force the cops to step back and innocent people are victimized in much greater numbers than the number of criminal punks that have been killed by cops.

CMPancake said:
When in doubt, let's blame the victims of the problem instead of the actual problem.
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The victims of the 300+ people that were armed when the cops killed them are the public at large. Do you want to let people who would confront cops with weapons remain on the streets and confront your family with those weapons??

RDS said:
If you make a projection for 10 years then the police will kill more people than the number of soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan combined. 4,486 U.S. soldiers died in Iraq and 2,345 U.S. soldiers died in Afghanistan.
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That tells you something about the hand ringing about the number of troops being killed when it was less than the number of people who are killed from falls during the same period.
 
upsideguy said:
Since you are all about the odds, the odds of being killed by a cop are still much, much greater than being killed by a terrorist.

So, if you are saying we are over-stating the problem of cops killing citizens are you not also saying, by extension of logic, that we are WAY overstating the problems with terrorism?
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Do you realize that a significant factor in your comparison is the number of terrorists you've crossed paths with versus the number of terrorists you've come across?
 
MathewSmith said:
WASHINGTON, May 30 (Reuters) - U.S. police have shot and killed 385 people during the first five months of this year, a rate of more than two a day, the Washington Post reported on Saturday.
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Awesome. I'll bet the recidivism rate for people who are shot dead is low as crap.
 
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