Re: Iraqi forces losing 'will to fight' against ISIS
Nope, I was pointing out that in your accusation of exaggeration on my part you actually exaggerated.
Al-anfal: 182,000 (from your source)
Systemic starvation under Oil-for-Food abuses: 400,000-500,000
Repression of 1991 uprising: up to 280,000
Total: 962,000
The only gross overstatement was made by you.
Thank you for FINALLY defending your number. As weak as the defense was, the effort is duly noted.
the Kurds reported 182,000 deaths in the Al-Anfal campaign. Most third party sources say the number is 50-100,000. So, just taking the Kurd report is erring on the side of exaggeration.
The 1991 crackdown resulted in 80 to 230,000 deaths. You declaring this 280,000 is also airing on the side of exaggeration.
Finally, and most egregious, you are calling the estimated 500,000 that died as a result of sanctions an act of overt brutality by Sadaam. That is a ridiculous stretch. The sanctions were put on Iraq by the US and others, designed to squeeze the economy. While he certainly is responsible, its not the same thing as overt brutality. Saddam did not KILL or order the deaths of the 500,000. Instead, his policies merely allowed that to happen. Frankly, the coalition nations are also culpable in these deaths.
If you want to hold a leader responsible for deaths under their watch and call it an autrocity, then we could make a laundry list of deaths that resulted in negligence of US policy and declare every US president an oppressive tyrant, but that is a bit absurd, just like calling the deaths if Iraqi citizens under the period of sanction a murder by Saddam. Sorry, you don't get to add that to the ledger....
So, all in, you have at least showed us you were not pulling numbers out of your A, you are just working with numbers that smell as if they were from the A.....
So, lets get back to your original statement that I objected to....
We can cope with ISIS, we just choose not to. Don't mistake the barbarism you see in our absence with how things would be if US troops were still in Iraq.
Saddam murdered an estimate of 1 million people in his 25 years in power. ISIS is small time compared to Saddam.
Net, net.... telling us Saddam
MURDERED 1 million of his people is indeed an exaggeration.... It appears that is off by somewhere between 2.5 and 5 fold (it looks like the number of 130,000 to 380,000 is much closer to the real number). If you said he was responsible for 1 million deaths, you might be on more solid ground.
No question he was a tyrant and a bad guy. The discussion of whether his removal was worth between $2 and $6, the lives of 4,500 US soldiers (not to mention the forever altered lives of those that served, but did not die) and the lives of 100-200,000 Iraq citizens (nothing like killing 200,000 Iraq citizens to overthrow a guy that killed 200,000 Iraqi citizens), but that is another discussion...