• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Florida's Valencia College sued over forced vaginal exams

Anomalism

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 2, 2013
Messages
3,237
Reaction score
2,159
Location
Florida
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Left
That's absolute insanity.

Valencia College sued over forced vaginal exams - CNN.com

Two college students say they were forced to submit to transvaginal probes as part of their classroom training to learn how to perform the medical procedure. The details are outlined in a federal lawsuit filed Thursday in Orlando against Valencia College and three instructors. It alleges that medical diagnostic students at the college were forced to submit to the examination of their sexual organs under threat of having their grades reduced or of being blacklisted by future employers. The three defendants named in the lawsuit, Maureen Bugnacki, Linda Shaheen and Barbara Ball, have not responded to CNN's requests for comment. Peer physical examination is an accepted practice in the medical field, but several recent reports cited by the U.S. National Library of Medicine mention a growing need for clear policies regarding peer physical examination at medical schools.

The lawsuit claims that during orientation, the college "had a second year student ... (nicknamed the 'TransVag Queen') explained the Medical Diagnostic Sonography Program's faculty believed that students should undergo invasive transvaginal ultrasound procedures in order to become better sonography technicians." "Valencia positioned these transvaginal probes as voluntary, but its actual policy and practice was that they were not," according to the lawsuit. The suit also describes weekly probes for students in the program, saying they "endured these invasive probes without a modicum of privacy. Plaintiffs would disrobe in a restroom, drape themselves in towels, and traverse the sonography classroom in full view of instructors and other students."
 
I feel bad for them really I do, but forced? If someone tells me I have to do something I don't want to do you best believe I'm taking this up with someone higher than the asshole trying to look at my vag. And if that person doesn't want to listen there is plenty of social media these days that will.
 
The "forced" part was not a very bright on their part, only a matter of time before someone did something about it.
 
I feel bad for them really I do, but forced? If someone tells me I have to do something I don't want to do you best believe I'm taking this up with someone higher than the asshole trying to look at my vag. And if that person doesn't want to listen there is plenty of social media these days that will.

You might be less inclined to tell them to shove off when you think your future career could be at risk.
 
Should be interesting to see how this ends up. In my nursing courses I was assigned a bed bath partner several times. We were assigned to practice giving one another bed baths in class (not as easy as you might think). Since I was the only male in the course, typically, I was always paired with a female, giving and receiving. Do I have a case? :mrgreen:
 
I feel bad for them really I do, but forced? If someone tells me I have to do something I don't want to do you best believe I'm taking this up with someone higher than the asshole trying to look at my vag. And if that person doesn't want to listen there is plenty of social media these days that will.

In that case, a hands on medical career is not for you. You're also "forced" to empty bedpans and dig out bowel impactions (involves putting your finger up someone's butt and pulling out their ****).
 
In that case, a hands on medical career is not for you. You're also "forced" to empty bedpans and dig out bowel impactions (involves putting your finger up someone's butt and pulling out their ****).


Trust me I've long since realized that's not a career for me. ;)
 
medical training requires hands on experience

you inject each other

you give physicals

it is all part of the intensive grind to weed out those who arent meant for this type of work

my dad told me about a lot of the stuff they did in school as he was getting his PA degree

i dunno....maybe the school went overboard....but i think most med students go through things like this
 
You might be less inclined to tell them to shove off when you think your future career could be at risk.

Maybe but I'd still try talk to someone about it first.

I always allow medical students in whenever they ask but a whole room would be a little different.
 
Should be interesting to see how this ends up. In my nursing courses I was assigned a bed bath partner several times. We were assigned to practice giving one another bed baths in class (not as easy as you might think). Since I was the only male in the course, typically, I was always paired with a female, giving and receiving. Do I have a case? :mrgreen:


Dayum! Where do I sign up to be a "practice" patient? ;)
 
Should be interesting to see how this ends up. In my nursing courses I was assigned a bed bath partner several times. We were assigned to practice giving one another bed baths in class (not as easy as you might think). Since I was the only male in the course, typically, I was always paired with a female, giving and receiving. Do I have a case? :mrgreen:

MqJxOgJ.png
 
I am undecided whether it should be mandatory, but people who do a procedure on other people should experience what the patient experiences whenever practical. If it was up to me, I would put male med students on the table also and give them an experience akin to the feeling of vulnerability and violation that a female patient experiences.
 
I am undecided whether it should be mandatory, but people who do a procedure on other people should experience what the patient experiences whenever practical. If it was up to me, I would put male med students on the table also and give them an experience akin to the feeling of vulnerability and violation that a female patient experiences.

They should have been upfront about it being mandatory if that was going to be the case. They were told it was optional.
 
I'm not female but in general, I don't want to be my health care practitioners' guinea pig. I'd hope they, as students, would have repeatedly practiced their techniques before they got to me...and that likely means practicing on each other. In this case, it sounds as though the college could have been more sensitive to the students' privacy. But if the students don't fulfill a course requirement, they should receive a lower grade. And the college's reputation depends on turning out qualified practitioners. If one of their students isn't, they should make that known to potential employers. I don't consider either as "forcing".
 
They should have been upfront about it being mandatory if that was going to be the case. They were told it was optional.

This. There needed to be a statement such as "In order to pass this class, you must be willing to undergo this procedure."
 
They should have been upfront about it being mandatory if that was going to be the case. They were told it was optional.

I always support full disclosure.
 
In that case, a hands on medical career is not for you. You're also "forced" to empty bedpans and dig out bowel impactions (involves putting your finger up someone's butt and pulling out their ****).

Should all cops be shot before allowed to have a gun on the job?
 
That's absolute insanity.

Valencia College sued over forced vaginal exams - CNN.com

Two college students say they were forced to submit to transvaginal probes as part of their classroom training to learn how to perform the medical procedure. The details are outlined in a federal lawsuit filed Thursday in Orlando against Valencia College and three instructors. It alleges that medical diagnostic students at the college were forced to submit to the examination of their sexual organs under threat of having their grades reduced or of being blacklisted by future employers. The three defendants named in the lawsuit, Maureen Bugnacki, Linda Shaheen and Barbara Ball, have not responded to CNN's requests for comment. Peer physical examination is an accepted practice in the medical field, but several recent reports cited by the U.S. National Library of Medicine mention a growing need for clear policies regarding peer physical examination at medical schools.

The lawsuit claims that during orientation, the college "had a second year student ... (nicknamed the 'TransVag Queen') explained the Medical Diagnostic Sonography Program's faculty believed that students should undergo invasive transvaginal ultrasound procedures in order to become better sonography technicians." "Valencia positioned these transvaginal probes as voluntary, but its actual policy and practice was that they were not," according to the lawsuit. The suit also describes weekly probes for students in the program, saying they "endured these invasive probes without a modicum of privacy. Plaintiffs would disrobe in a restroom, drape themselves in towels, and traverse the sonography classroom in full view of instructors and other students."

"a second year student ... (nicknamed the 'TransVag Queen') explained the Medical Diagnostic Sonography Program's faculty believed that students should undergo invasive transvaginal ultrasound procedures in order to become better sonography technicians."


Sooooo... what was the policy for male students?
 
Sooooo... what was the policy for male students?

They lacked a key anatomical feature for this particular sonogram procedure.

I agree with the other poster, the school probably could have done the practice session with more decorum, but the concept is valid- " If you want to stick, you must be stuck...". .
 
Last edited:
Should all cops be shot before allowed to have a gun on the job?

Shot? No. I bet almost all are "tazed" and pepper sprayed though. They also practice painful compliance holds on each other.
 


I find the instructional medical community very strange. With 3 immediate family members working as professionals in medicine, I've seen the oddities first hand. These programs get ran much like fraternities/sororities, with various forms of hazing. The all have their own policies, typically that are much stricter or even contradictory to that of the parent school. Threats are constant - threats of lesser grades, expulsion from the program (irrespective of grades), etc. These programs do generally have long waiting lists for small class sizes, so I understand the desire to make sure people are serious. But all I've seen is powers trips for the most part.

The procedure in question is easily learned during clinicals. So doing it on students sounds lime hazing to me.
 
Hands on training is hands on.

If the school policy is that its optional, then its optional. If the instructor influenced the student to do it, despite it being optional, then shame on the instructor for coercion, and shame on the student for being gullible.
 
Shot? No. I bet almost all are "tazed" and pepper sprayed though. They also practice painful compliance holds on each other.


and safe take down techniques

and hand to hand combat

and practice with the baton on each other

you cant go on patrol without an idea of what to do, and how to do it in a situation

we all have/had ojt (on the job training)

it is part of every job i know of....some things you learn before, some you learn as you go
 
That's absolute insanity.

Valencia College sued over forced vaginal exams - CNN.com

Two college students say they were forced to submit to transvaginal probes as part of their classroom training to learn how to perform the medical procedure. The details are outlined in a federal lawsuit filed Thursday in Orlando against Valencia College and three instructors. It alleges that medical diagnostic students at the college were forced to submit to the examination of their sexual organs under threat of having their grades reduced or of being blacklisted by future employers. The three defendants named in the lawsuit, Maureen Bugnacki, Linda Shaheen and Barbara Ball, have not responded to CNN's requests for comment. Peer physical examination is an accepted practice in the medical field, but several recent reports cited by the U.S. National Library of Medicine mention a growing need for clear policies regarding peer physical examination at medical schools.

The lawsuit claims that during orientation, the college "had a second year student ... (nicknamed the 'TransVag Queen') explained the Medical Diagnostic Sonography Program's faculty believed that students should undergo invasive transvaginal ultrasound procedures in order to become better sonography technicians." "Valencia positioned these transvaginal probes as voluntary, but its actual policy and practice was that they were not," according to the lawsuit. The suit also describes weekly probes for students in the program, saying they "endured these invasive probes without a modicum of privacy. Plaintiffs would disrobe in a restroom, drape themselves in towels, and traverse the sonography classroom in full view of instructors and other students."

Forced transvaginal exam is rape.

Someone should be in prison but they're not.

Anomalism has posted ANOTHER disingenuous thread it would seem.
 
Back
Top Bottom