• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Putin warns Israel against selling arms to Ukraine

Nicci said:
No, you gave me a date that this referendum happened and there isn't a single article anywhere that talks about it on that date. If this referendum did happened it'd have been all over the news at the time. As the UK was in heated debates with Iran at the time over the oil issues.
Click to expand...

Your own ****ing link referenced the referendum. Way to ****ing fail:


Aug. 4, 1953
• Mossadegh, suspecting that British and American governments were plotting against him, holds a referendum calling for the Iranian parliament to be dissolved......

Timeline of Iranian Coup

And from the NYT's article contained in that link:


August 21, 1953

Mossadegh Quits Teheran Hideout; Is Held for Trial


Dr. Mossadegh, who had eliminated all means of an orderly change in government and achieved dictatorial powers before his overthrow......


Mossadegh Quits Teheran Hideout; Is Held for Trial


That's your own god damn source:

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...t-selling-arms-ukraine-13.html#post1064550334

The referendum occurred it is a historical fact it is not open for debate, you have been given half a dozen sources citing the fraudulent referendum including your own link, you are doing nothing but covering your eyes, the facts are not on your side so you deny deny deny despite the fact that anyone who is not a brainwashed idiot can see you're either intentionally lying or don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Instead what you have is revisionist propaganda
Click to expand...

You mean your own ****ing citation? You have not contested a single fact presented with any contradictory evidence whatsoever, talking to you is like talking to a brick wall so from now on when ever you reply with a non-rebuttal that amounts to nothing more than "nuh uh" I will throw your own ****ing citation which made my case in your face:



Aug. 4, 1953
• Mossadegh, suspecting that British and American governments were plotting against him, holds a referendum calling for the Iranian parliament to be dissolved......

Timeline of Iranian Coup

And from the NYT's article contained in that link:


August 21, 1953

Mossadegh Quits Teheran Hideout; Is Held for Trial


Dr. Mossadegh, who had eliminated all means of an orderly change in government and achieved dictatorial powers before his overthrow......


Mossadegh Quits Teheran Hideout; Is Held for Trial

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...t-selling-arms-ukraine-13.html#post1064550334

trying to paint someone as a bad guy because they wished to deal with the USSR instead of the USA. We did this to a lot of other nations around the same time frame, Cuba being another prime example.

In addition, I also have eye witness accounts of what happened in Iran during the 50's.
Click to expand...

Irrelevant clap trap that does nothing to change the incontrovertible fact that Mossadeq was not ousted until after he held a fraudulent referendum to dissolve parliament in which he garnered a laughable 99% yay vote then proceeded to grant himself dictatorial "emergency powers" indefinitely. You have not only failed to provide one iota of a valid rebuttal you actually posted a link backing up every single point that I made.
 
Apocalypse said:
It's the third time that I'm pointing out that what you're talking about is not terrorism, you don't seem to be familiar with the English word 'terror'.

As to "my opinion", it isn't my opinion that Iran is the number one sponsor of terrorism in the world - it's a based fact. Read the Wiki article I've linked to that documents the countless acts of terror Iran is responsible for. If you wished to prove Iran wasn't the number one sponsor of terrorism you'd refer to an entity that is supporting and directing more terrorism than Iran has. There is no such entity however and your denial is pathetic, akin to a person who insists that the world is flat and that it isn't merely "his opinion".

US: Iran Remains Leading State Sponsor of Terrorism

Regarding Odom, his opinion is not a fact. No person's opinion is "a fact", the very assertion is amazingly stupid.
Click to expand...

Actually terrorisms definition hasn't been universally agreed upon. And bombings were conducted by CIA operatives, then blamed on communists, some would consider that terrorism. When it happens to western interests, it's always classified as such. You need an education, and I'm not being paid to help you.
 
Montecresto said:
Actually terrorisms definition hasn't been universally agreed upon. And bombings were conducted by CIA operatives, then blamed on communists, some would consider that terrorism. When it happens to western interests, it's always classified as such. You need an education, and I'm not being paid to help you.
Click to expand...

Evidence that the CIA directed bombings against civilian targets? Bombing military and governmental targets is not terrorism, it's war.
 
Montecresto said:
Actually terrorisms definition hasn't been universally agreed upon. And bombings were conducted by CIA operatives, then blamed on communists, some would consider that terrorism.
Click to expand...

Unless you refer to what bombings conducted by the CIA you are talking about I wouldn't know how to tell you that the assertion you've made is an idiotic one. And terror is a word that may not be well defined, but it is still an existing word and as such you cannot simply assign any meaning that you wish to assign to it. Intervening in the matters of foreign countries is in no way "terrorism".

You need an education, and I'm not being paid to help you.
Click to expand...

You are neither knowledgeable nor charismatic. You couldn't and shouldn't teach anyone anything, with payment or without it.
 
And still, the government propaganda rocks on. The Shah was a good guy, and Lt. Calley was a hero. :lol: Pat Tillman was killed by enemy fire and humans are alone in the universe.
 
Apocalypse said:
You are neither knowledgeable nor charismatic. You couldn't and shouldn't teach anyone anything, with payment or without it.
Click to expand...
Indeed. Extremely selective memory and totally useless if logic and/or critical thinking is required.
 
Henry David said:
And still, the government propaganda rocks on. The Shah was a good guy, and Lt. Calley was a hero. :lol: Pat Tillman was killed by enemy fire and humans are alone in the universe.
Click to expand...

Wonderful strawman, another in a long list of Islamo Fascist propagandists debunked by facts which they can not dispute.
 
Very humorous Face, thanks. :lol:
 
Apocalypse said:
Unless you refer to what bombings conducted by the CIA you are talking about I wouldn't know how to tell you that the assertion you've made is an idiotic one. And terror is a word that may not be well defined, but it is still an existing word and as such you cannot simply assign any meaning that you wish to assign to it. Intervening in the matters of foreign countries is in no way "terrorism".



You are neither knowledgeable nor charismatic. You couldn't and shouldn't teach anyone anything, with payment or without it.
Click to expand...

If there's ever been a valid definition of terrorism, planting bombs to explode and kill people in an effort to conduct regime change most certainly is. I see that you're unaware that the CIA planted bombs in Iran and blamed them on communists.

Classic terrorism.

Iranians working for the C.I.A. and posing as Communists harassed religious leaders and staged the bombing of one cleric's home in a campaign to turn the country's Islamic religious community against Mossadegh's government.

http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/mideast/041600iran-cia-index.html
 
Last edited:
Montecresto said:
If there's ever been a valid definition of terrorism, planting bombs to explode and kill people in an effort to conduct regime change most certainly is. I see that you're unaware that the CIA planted bombs in Iran and blamed them on communists.
Click to expand...

Again, refer with links to what bombings you're referring to.
The CIA conducted a regime change in Iran in 1953 by staging riots.
That's not terrorism.
 
Montecresto said:
New York Times Special Report: The C.I.A. in Iran
Click to expand...

Thanks for a very revealing article that goes a long way to explaining the anti American sentiment later

It's amazing how quickly "Terrorism" becomes "Freedom Fighting" depending only on who's doing the killing & torturing.

SAVAK
SAVAK - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
EXCERPTS “SAVAK has been described as Iran's "most hated and feared institution" prior to the revolution of 1979 because of its practice of torturing and executing opponents of the Pahlavi regime.[2][3]...
SAVAK had the power to censor the media, screen applicants for government jobs, "and according to reliable Western source,[11] use all means necessary, including torture, to hunt down dissidents".[12]

In March 1955, the Army colonel was "replaced with a more permanent team of five career CIA officers, including specialists in covert operations, intelligence analysis, and counterintelligence, including Major General Herbert Norman Schwarzkopf who "trained virtually all of the first generation of SAVAK personnel." CONTINUED


In other words, the C.I.A. trained & worked with: " Iran's "most hated and feared institution" which doesn't seem like "War"


Thanks
 
B'smith said:
Thanks for a very revealing article that goes a long way to explaining the anti American sentiment later

It's amazing how quickly "Terrorism" becomes "Freedom Fighting" depending only on who's doing the killing & torturing.

SAVAK
SAVAK - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
EXCERPTS “SAVAK has been described as Iran's "most hated and feared institution" prior to the revolution of 1979 because of its practice of torturing and executing opponents of the Pahlavi regime.[2][3]...
SAVAK had the power to censor the media, screen applicants for government jobs, "and according to reliable Western source,[11] use all means necessary, including torture, to hunt down dissidents".[12]

In March 1955, the Army colonel was "replaced with a more permanent team of five career CIA officers, including specialists in covert operations, intelligence analysis, and counterintelligence, including Major General Herbert Norman Schwarzkopf who "trained virtually all of the first generation of SAVAK personnel." CONTINUED


In other words, the C.I.A. trained & worked with: " Iran's "most hated and feared institution" which doesn't seem like "War"


Thanks
Click to expand...

That's interesting too! Essentially, USFP has been harmful to Iran since about the 1930's. And if those youngsters in Iran (the pop is mostly under 40) knew it all, they wouldn't be as pro-American as they are.
 
Montecresto said:
That's interesting too! Essentially, USFP has been harmful to Iran since about the 1930's. And if those youngsters in Iran (the pop is mostly under 40) knew it all, they wouldn't be as pro-American as they are.
Click to expand...

_______________
Pick up a copy at your local bookstore:

"Uniting Iran & Russia Made Easy"

"Israeli and US military instructors train Ukrainian special forces"
Israeli and US military instructors train Ukrainian special forces - watch on - uatoday.tv

EXCERPT "Military instructors from the US, Israel, and Georgia have been training Ukrainian troops who will form part of a Special Forces battalion.CONTINUED

AND

“SEVEN THINGS YOU DIDN’T KNOW THE U.S. AND ITS ALLIES DID TO IRAN”
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/04/07/10-things-didnt-know-weve-done-iran/

EXCERPTS:
"1. The founder of Reuters purchased Iran in 1872

2. The BBC lent a hand to the CIA’s 1953 overthrow of Iran’s Prime Minister*Mohammad Mosaddegh

3. We had extensive plans to use nuclear weapons in Iran

4. We were cool*with Saudi Arabia giving Saddam $5 billion to build nukes during the Iran-Iraq war

5. U.S. leaders have repeatedly threatened to outright destroy Iran

It’s not just John McCain singing “bomb bomb bomb Iran.”

- Admiral William Fallon, who retired as head of CENTCOM in 2008, said about Iran: “These guys are ants. When the time comes, you crush them.”

- Admiral James Lyons Jr., commander of the U.S. Pacific Fleet in the 1980s, has said*we were prepared to “drill them back to the fourth century.”

- Richard Armitage, then assistant secretary of defense, explained that we*considered whether to “completely obliterate Iran.”*

- Billionaire and GOP kingmaker Sheldon Adelson*advocates an unprovoked nuclear attack on*Iran — “in the middle of the desert”*at first, then possibly moving on to places with more people.


6. We shot down a civilian Iranian airliner — killing 290 people, including 66 children


7. We worry about Iranian nukes because they would deter our own military strikes

---------------
Russia's exchange of "Goods-for-Oil" includes grain, building equipment & supplies in addition to defensive S 300s. Meanwhile, it's unlikely that they have forgotten U.S. & Israeli aid to Georgia in 2008.


"S-300 in Iran ‘no threat to Israel’: Putin briefs Netanyahu on defensive weapons concept"
S-300 in Iran ?no threat to Israel?: Putin briefs Netanyahu on defensive weapons concept ? RT News

EXCERPT "Russia has also started supplying grain, equipment and construction materials to Iran in exchange for crude oil under the so-called “oil-for-goods” barter deal, which had earlier sparked dissatisfaction in the West.

The US officials also seemed displeased with Russia’s latest “non-constructive” moves, with State Department spokesperson Marie Harf however admitting that it did not violate any international norms. "CONTINUED



Thanks
 
Apocalypse said:
Again, refer with links to what bombings you're referring to.
The CIA conducted a regime change in Iran in 1953 by staging riots.
That's not terrorism.
Click to expand...

It went flawlessly, not even Mossadeq was killed.
 
Deal or no deal, America’s problems with Iran are just beginning

After an American show of force off the coast of Yemen, a convoy of Iranian military cargo ships yesterday turned back from a suspected mission to resupply Houthi rebels who ousted the Yemeni president last month. Meanwhile, in Vienna, American and Iranian diplomats gathered in a historic palace-turned-hotel for the latest round of negotiations aimed at constraining Iran’s nuclear program.

This week’s developments underscore the fundamental dilemma for the Obama administration in dealing with Iran: solving one aspect of the problem – even one as potentially menacing as an Iranian nuclear weapons capability would be – will not offer any immediate remedy to the myriad other threats posed by Iran’s foreign and domestic policies.
Click to expand...
 
Simpleχity;1064567873 said:
That's what happens when Iran hides nuclear facilities like Fordow.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but I'm going back much farther than that. Since the 1930's, there's been no end to US interference in their internal affairs. Iran doesn't need your acknowledgment of that reality though.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom