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U.S. military trainers in Ukraine may destabilize situation: Kremlin

Ironfist

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Although it is not likely, I hope that none of these people are killed.

The Kremlin said on Friday the arrival of about 300 U.S. paratroopers in Ukraine to train Kiev's National Guard could destabilize the situation in the east of the country, where pro-Russian separatists are fighting Ukrainian government forces.

Ukraine has repeatedly asked for international help to boost its defensive capabilities. Western countries have so far declined its requests to supply weapons, while offering non-lethal military aid and training.

"The participation of instructors or specialists from third countries on Ukrainian territory, where the domestic Ukrainian conflict is unresolved ... could destabilize the situation," Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters in Moscow during a conference call.

He was referring to the arrival of the U.S. paratroopers in western Ukraine this week to begin a six-month training rotation with three battalions.

Ukraine and the West have accused Russia of interfering in the year-old conflict by sending in troops and weapons. Moscow has denied those charges and warned against excessive Western influence in Ukraine.

The training mission, which was first announced in August last year, had been due to start in March but was put on hold until further progress was made in implementing a ceasefire deal, agreed in February, to end a conflict in which more than 6,100 people have been killed.

The truce remains technically in force, despite almost daily reports of casualties and ceasefire violations.

Britain has already sent military personnel to train Ukrainian troops, while Canada and Poland have pledged to send 200 and 50 instructors respectively this year.

U.S. military trainers in Ukraine may destabilize situation: Kremlin | Reuters
 
I can imagine how indignant and apoplectic the US government would be if Russian troops were training Mexican or Canadian troops. :shock:
 
Although it is not likely, I hope that none of these people are killed.



U.S. military trainers in Ukraine may destabilize situation: Kremlin | Reuters

We should have had trainers there two decades ago and Nato should have brought the country in in the 90's.
 
I can imagine how indignant and apoplectic the US government would be if Russian troops were training Mexican or Canadian troops. :shock:

You mean after the US had snatched a part of Canada?
 
We should have had trainers there two decades ago and Nato should have brought the country in in the 90's.

Do you really think that we could have done it in the 90s.
 
I can imagine how indignant and apoplectic the US government would be if Russian troops were training Mexican or Canadian troops. :shock:

If the US were to invade Mexico and Canada, then we would have that coming...
 
Do you really think that we could have done it in the 90s.

In the mid 90's it would have been easy but for objections from some member states. It would have been quite easy but for the same objectors, when Ukraine asked for entry. It was the same countries that blocked it, that helped to cause the problems Ukraine is now having.
 
There are 200 Canadian trainers now in Ukraine also. Still way behind the number of Russian specialists in DNR/LNR.

Interesting exposé about how the Russian 5th Tank Brigade participated at Debaltsevo in February. The 5th is normally stationed in Buryatskaya Oblast which borders Mongolia. The soldiers in the pics sure don't look Ukrainian.

5-я танковая бригда ВС РФ в боях за Дебальцево
 
Talk about hypocritical.
The Kremlin bitching about a few US military trainers...while Russia sends heavy artillery, surface-to-air missiles, armoured support and troops of their own.

Glass houses, Russia....glass houses.
 
Simpleχity;1064538298 said:
There are 200 Canadian trainers now in Ukraine also. Still way behind the number of Russian specialists in DNR/LNR.

Interesting exposé about how the Russian 5th Tank Brigade participated at Debaltsevo in February. The 5th is normally stationed in Buryatskaya Oblast which borders Mongolia. The soldiers in the pics sure don't look Ukrainian.

5-я танковая бригда ВС РФ в боях за Дебальцево

Putin has evidently been recruiting hard amongst ethnic minorities, who are probably more willing to sign over seas deployment contracts due to proverty.

One piece of good news is that an ethnic Siberian political figure has encouraged local officials not to cooperate with Russian mercenary recruiters and has encouraged Siberians already serving in the Russian army not to sign deployment contracts. The bad news is that it will take a long time for any ethnic "refusenik" momentum to build.
 
Putin has evidently been recruiting hard amongst ethnic minorities, who are probably more willing to sign over seas deployment contracts due to proverty.
These were Russian soldiers (120) and tanks (31) of the 5th Tank Brigade transported by train from Ulan-Ude to Rostov. They crossed the border and entered Ukraine in February. They fought at Debaltsevo. The Russian newspaper Novaya Gazeta published a rare interview with one of the 5th tankers in a Rostov hospital. Dorji Batomunkuev (military unit № 46108 / military ID 2609999) was severely injured in the battle of Debaltseve.

«Мы все знали, на что идем и что может быть»

Russian units in Donbass as of today: 15th Brigade (2nd Army), 8th Infantry Brigade, 331st Paratrooper Regiment (98th Paratroopers Division).
 
I can imagine how indignant and apoplectic the US government would be if Russian troops were training Mexican or Canadian troops. :shock:

Really? Have any of the coutries you mentioned invaded their neighbours?
Russians are paying a HUGE price for their stupidity. Russia is one of the few countries in the world where the living standard is dropping! And is dropping from a fairly low level already. OK Putin is rolling in money. He gives **** about the man in the street.
 
Simpleχity;1064540802 said:
These were Russian soldiers (120) and tanks (31) of the 5th Tank Brigade transported by train from Ulan-Ude to Rostov. They crossed the border and entered Ukraine in February. They fought at Debaltsevo. The Russian newspaper Novaya Gazeta published a rare interview with one of the 5th tankers in a Rostov hospital. Dorji Batomunkuev (military unit № 46108 / military ID 2609999) was severely injured in the battle of Debaltseve.

«Мы все знали, на что идем и что может быть»

Russian units in Donbass as of today: 15th Brigade (2nd Army), 8th Infantry Brigade, 331st Paratrooper Regiment (98th Paratroopers Division).

Russian as in slavic, or Russian as in citizen of the Russian Federation? Though there are plenty of slavic Russians in the Donbass, there are a disproportionate number of ethnic minorities as well. Russian Regular units in Ukraine seem to be two types:

- A. Those operating as full and complete professional units.
- B. Those operating as cadre units where officers and senior NCOs are proffessional, but the men are a variety of recent volunteers, "volunteers" and mercenaries.

I think most Russian regular units are "B" type.

This is probably due to many factors including a desire to preserve the small number of truly modernized / well trained Russian brigades for future use or strategic detterance, and an increasing reluctance of Russian conscripts to sign coerced deployment contracts. In addition, Fallen Angel has pointed out that Putin is does not have absolute authority in Russia. Some senior russian commanders might not be backing Putin and could well have quietly made some fully trained units "unavailable" for Donbass deployments.
 
Oh, the weeping and gnashing of teeth...:lol:
 
I can imagine how indignant and apoplectic the US government would be if Russian troops were training Mexican or Canadian troops. :shock:

Not even a close comparison. Actually quite absurd.
 
Russian as in slavic, or Russian as in citizen of the Russian Federation? Though there are plenty of slavic Russians in the Donbass, there are a disproportionate number of ethnic minorities as well. Russian Regular units in Ukraine seem to be two types:

- A. Those operating as full and complete professional units.
- B. Those operating as cadre units where officers and senior NCOs are proffessional, but the men are a variety of recent volunteers, "volunteers" and mercenaries.

I think most Russian regular units are "B" type.

This is probably due to many factors including a desire to preserve the small number of truly modernized / well trained Russian brigades for future use or strategic detterance, and an increasing reluctance of Russian conscripts to sign coerced deployment contracts. In addition, Fallen Angel has pointed out that Putin is does not have absolute authority in Russia. Some senior russian commanders might not be backing Putin and could well have quietly made some fully trained units "unavailable" for Donbass deployments.

What difference does it make? They were still Russian troops and equipment that crossed the border of a sovereign country.
 
What difference does it make? They were still Russian troops and equipment that crossed the border of a sovereign country.

There is no difference in regards to the Donbass. Rather, it is just an observation that the Russians appear to be keeping alot of their best units in reserve, for a variety of reasons.
 
Russian as in slavic, or Russian as in citizen of the Russian Federation?
Do you know where Ulan-Ude is? It is in central Siberia just above Mongolia. Buryats are not Slavic Russians. The Russian military 5th Tank Brigade is stationed there and the majority of 5th conscripts are ethnically Buryati.

They were shipped from Ulan Ude to Rostov by train. Since Russian soldiers lawfully cannot be in Ukraine, the soldiers are placed on administrative leave but are forced to sign a temporary contract which legally defines them as Kontraktniki (mercenaries). Thus they are technically (from the Russian legal perspective) contract mercenaries in Ukraine. When they cross the border back into Russia, their contract is terminated and administrative leave is cancelled and they are legally Russian conscript soldiers again and shipped back to their headquarters at Ulan-Ude. It works the same with all Russian military units sent into Ukraine.

This is one facet of Russia's hybrid warfare that is being waged in eastern Ukraine.
 
Simpleχity;1064541144 said:
Do you know where Ulan-Ude is? It is in central Siberia just above Mongolia. Buryats are not Slavic Russians. The Russian military 5th Tank Brigade is stationed there and the majority of 5th conscripts are ethnically Buryati.

They were shipped from Ulan Ude to Rostov by train. Since Russian soldiers lawfully cannot be in Ukraine, the soldiers are placed on administrative leave but are forced to sign a temporary contract which legally defines them as Kontraktniki (mercenaries). Thus they are technically (from the Russian legal perspective) contract mercenaries in Ukraine.

Putin also attempted to strong arm a slavic conscript unit (strategic SAM) from Murmansk area with a sudden conversion into an infantry unit and coerced contracts. Several hundred slavics refused. My guess is that slavic Russians have more options employment wise and are therefore more likely to "just say no". Putin then went shopping for units from impovershed areas which are moe likely to be ethnic minority. The fact that the slavics from Murmansk were not just sent anyways despite their refusal could indicate that Putin is not in absolute control of the situation.
 
Not even a close comparison. Actually quite absurd.

Must be a true comparison, as everybody is twisted up tight about the truth being spoken. We have no business in their back yard, AND it is confrontational, belligerent, provocative, whatever.

That crap about Crimea is not in touch with reality. Why in the hell should any country abandon its only good naval port? Neither will Russia, and I don't blame them.

Americans are narrow minded and bellicose, pretty much what Ike warned against. :peace
 
Must be a true comparison, as everybody is twisted up tight about the truth being spoken. We have no business in their back yard, AND it is confrontational, belligerent, provocative, whatever.

That crap about Crimea is not in touch with reality. Why in the hell should any country abandon its only good naval port? Neither will Russia, and I don't blame them.

Americans are narrow minded and bellicose, pretty much what Ike warned against. :peace

Yeah must 'cause you say so. LOL

I will agree we have no business there. With a part of the population loyal to Russia it would make dealing with the Vietcong a cakewalk.
 
Although it is not likely, I hope that none of these people are killed.



U.S. military trainers in Ukraine may destabilize situation: Kremlin | Reuters

The Kremlin said on Friday the arrival of about 300 U.S. paratroopers in Ukraine to train Kiev's National Guard could destabilize the situation in the east of the country, where pro-Russian separatists are fighting Ukrainian government forces.

Like Russia hasn't already destabilized the region. :violin
 
I can imagine how indignant and apoplectic the US government would be if Russian troops were training Mexican or Canadian troops. :shock:

Except that we are not sending our troops illegally into Mexico to destabilize the Govt. What he is worried about is Russians killing Americans in the Ukraine, and he should be.
 
Except that we are not sending our troops illegally into Mexico to destabilize the Govt. What he is worried about is Russians killing Americans in the Ukraine, and he should be.
The US and Canadian trainers will be nowhere near the strife torn Donbass region. After WWII, the Soviets constructed Red Army military bases almost exclusively in western and central Ukraine. These forward bases would act as a tripwire and a first line of defense against any Western forces approaching Russia proper. US/Canadian forces may occasionally visit Kyiv. Most will probably remain in the far western Lviv region.
 
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