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The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has virtually unequivocal evidence[W:577]

Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Aethism is still a belief in the unknown.
A faith that God doesn't exist based on opinion and not proof.

Wrong. Show me proof of the existence of a god and I will believe that a god exists.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Prove there is no God.

Prove that Krishna does not exist and then I will use the same method to prove that Jehovah does not exist.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

...and that lead to the Hundreds Years Wars, the Crusades, The Inquisition, Forced Conversion of tens of millions, the Spanish Armada, acceptance of slavery, the Lord's Resistance Army, all those fun years of the Balkan Wars, abortion bombing, the IRA, etc. etc. ETC. While I admit Islam has some massive ****ing problems... discounting the problems of Christianity is naive.

You look at the founder of the religion to see the truth. Jesus taught to Love others.

A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another.
- John 13:34
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven.
-Matthew 5:43
He taught to turn the other cheek, go the extra mile in helping others, denying yourself to be willing to sacrifice for others.
Those people who commit acts of violence are not following Jesus nor have the love of God in them. Therefor how can one blame the faith that teaches the complete opposite of such things. Instead blame the men who do them.
And thus if we look at the founder of Islam Muhammad, we do find someone who actually unlike Jesus, endorsed such violence. So we look to the founders to see if it's the faith that's at fault, or men who claim to follower something they obviously do not.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

You look at the founder of the religion to see the truth. Jesus taught to Love others.

A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another.
- John 13:34
“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven.
-Matthew 5:43
He taught to turn the other cheek, go the extra mile in helping others, denying yourself to be willing to sacrifice for others.
Those people who commit acts of violence are not following Jesus nor have the love of God in them. Therefor how can one blame the faith that teaches the complete opposite of such things. Instead blame the men who do them.
And thus if we look at the founder of Islam Muhammad, we do find someone who actually unlike Jesus, endorsed such violence. So we look to the founders to see if it's the faith that's at fault, or men who claim to follower something they obviously do not.

These things were written by men centuries after his death (if he ever really existed) so its all just a load of superstitious claptrap
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Wrong. Show me proof of the existence of a god and I will believe that a god exists.

Indeed. I could claim little green men live on Pluto and just because you could'nt prove otherwise would'nt automatically mean that they do !

Do you see how that analogy works for the 'believers' ? :lol:
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Stalin and Mao did not kill in the name of Atheism. They killed in order to maintain and solidate power. It was about politics, not Atheism. They weren't the Pope condoning a Holy War. They were just assholes.

First, several atheists contended that you cannot really compare the crimes of Christian regimes of the past to those of atheist regimes of the twentieth century.

The best estimates are that between 5,000 and 10,000 were killed in the Spanish Inquisition. That’s compared with 100 million who were killed in the atheist purges of the twentieth century. The 100 million is actually a low figure, since it uses very modest estimates for how many people Stalin and Mao killed, and it leaves out a host of lesser atheist tyrants such as Pol Pot and Enver Hoxha. Even so, using this conservative estimate, a quick calculation reveals that atheist regimes killed ten thousand times more people in the space of a few decades than the Spanish Inquisition managed to kill over a period of more than two centuries.

Second, several atheist writers argued that Stalin and Mao’s crimes could not be blamed on atheism since atheism is not really a belief, it is really an absence of belief.

As one writer put it, “Leaders such as Stalin and Mao persecuted religious groups, not in a bid to expand atheism, but as a way of focusing people’s hatred on those groups to consolidate their own power.” Of course I agree that murderous regimes, whether Christian or atheist, are generally seeking to strengthen their position.

But if Christian regimes are held responsible for their crimes committed in the name of Christianity, then atheist regimes should be held accountable for their crimes committed in the name of atheism. And who can deny that Stalin and Mao, not to mention Pol Pot and a host of others, all committed atrocities in the name of a Communist ideology that was explicitly atheistic? Who can dispute that they did their bloody deeds by claiming to be establishing a “new man” and a religion-free utopia? These were mass murders performed with atheism as a central part of their ideological inspiration, they were not mass murders done by people who simply happened to be atheist.

Third, many atheists angrily insisted that Hitler was not an atheist, indeed he was a lifelong Christian! (You learn something new every day.)

The poverty of the atheist argument becomes clear with a bit of examination. What does it prove to say that Hitler was raised Catholic? Stalin was raised in the Orthodox Church. Mao was raised as a Buddhist. Lots of people repudiate their religious upbringing. Hitler vehemently rejected the traditional Christianity in which he was raised. Hitler still at times envoked religion.

This rhetoric, it should be noted, is a commonplace rhetorical device among atheist writers. Nietzsche, for instance, regularly compared himself to Jesus, even titling one of his books Ecce Homo (“behold the man,” a biblical reference to Christ). But no intelligent reader of Nietzsche can doubt that he was a rabid atheist, as was Hitler.

Once Hitler and the Nazis came to power, however, they denounced Christianity and launched a ruthless drive to subdue and weaken traditional Christianity.

Since 1937 the policies of Hitler’s government became openly and increasingly anti-religious. In particular, they repudiated what they perceived as the Christian values of equality, compassion and weakness and extolled the atheist notions of the Nietzschean superman and a new society based on the “will to power.”

Hitler’s leading advisers, such as Goebbels, Heydrich and Bormann, were atheists who were savagely hostile to religion. Several of his associates reported that the Fuhrer’s personal views were deeply anti-Christian. Again, Hitler’s hostility to religion in general, and Christianity in particular, were not incidental to the violence that characterized his regime.

They were part of the Nazi ideology — a secular ideology that deified race over creed — and they helped to justify the horrors of extermination and holocaust. Like Stalin and Mao, Hitler illustrates the point made by both Dostoyevsky and earlier John Locke: when God is excluded, then it is not surprising when morality itself is sacrificed in the process and chaos and horror is unleashed on the world. So it has been in our time, and all the elaborate evasions produced by today’s atheists cannot change what their anti-religious kinsmen did, cannot change the grim facts of history.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Indeed. I could claim little green men live on Pluto and just because you could'nt prove otherwise would'nt automatically mean that they do !

Do you see how that analogy works for the 'believers' ? :lol:

The beginning of the universe, fine tuning of the laws of physics, etc...
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Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

... is retarded. He is deflecting in an attempt to make religion (Chrisianity) sound better and more important to justify his faith in God (religion).

No need to justify my beliefs I have :) though the same can be said of those who don't want there to be a God as they'd rather not be held accountable for there life. So they look at life and the evidence for God or Jesus or otherwise, through the filter of atheism.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

The beginning of the universe, fine tuning of the laws of physics, etc...

My little green men analogy stands ....
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

My little green men analogy stands ....

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
Winston Churchill

Humanism or atheism is a wonderful philosophy of life as long as you are big, strong, and between the ages of eighteen and thirty-five. But watch out if you are in a lifeboat and there are others who are younger, bigger, or smarter.
William Murray
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Nonsense. Religious faith is an uneccessary and often intolerant medieval anachronism in the modern age

To quote Richard Dawkins." Man has invented and discarded hundreds of gods over the millenia. I've just gone one god further"

Prove that God doesn't exist, otherwise you rely on faith just as believers rely on it

The truth is you have no proof to back up your beliefs, so its a bit hypocritical to talk down to the faithful.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Prove that God doesn't exist, otherwise you rely on faith just as believers rely on it

The truth is you have no proof to back up your beliefs, so its a bit hypocritical to talk down to the faithful.

Prove santa doesn't exist, prove zeus doesn't exist, prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist. It is not faith if one side literally has no evidence and IS THE SIDE MAKING THE CLAIM.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Prove that Krishna does not exist and then I will use the same method to prove that Jehovah does not exist.

Aethist believe God doesn't exist.

You believe in something you cannot prove.

Stop being hypocritical and admit you too rely on faith to back your assertions.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Prove santa doesn't exist, prove zeus doesn't exist, prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist. It is not faith if one side literally has no evidence and IS THE SIDE MAKING THE CLAIM.

Wrong, Aethist are MAKING THE CLAIM God DOESN'T EXIST.

PROVE your claim and stop being such a glaring hypocrite.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Aethist believe God doesn't exist.

You believe in something you cannot prove.

Stop being hypocritical and admit you too rely on faith to back your assertions.

Atheists simply reject a claim which has no evidence, much like people reject astrology..
Atheists don't "believe" in anything, it is up to the one making the claim of a god existing to provide evidence for it.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Wrong, Aethist are MAKING THE CLAIM God DOESN'T EXIST.

PROVE your claim and stop being such a glaring hypocrite.

Prove your claim that he does, if that's what you're claiming. Demanding someone prove a negative is not sound debating.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Wrong, Aethist are MAKING THE CLAIM God DOESN'T EXIST.

PROVE your claim and stop being such a glaring hypocrite.

Fenton, for the love of... Atheists are simply stating that those who claim a god exists don't have any evidence, and therefore, they don't believe in the god, ever heard of the burden of proof? Quit being such a A-toothfairyist, you're making the claim the tooth fairy doesn't exist, hypocrite.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Prove santa doesn't exist, prove zeus doesn't exist, prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist. It is not faith if one side literally has no evidence and IS THE SIDE MAKING THE CLAIM.

Believing in God is the same as believing in the Tooth Fairy, Santa Clause, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

What I love about this well-worn atheist ‘argument’ is that it actually serves to demonstrate how vastly different a belief in God is to these myths and imaginations. When one honestly assesses the Judeo-Christian doctrine of God he will find multiple thousands of years of human testimony and religious development; he will find martyrs enduring the most horrific trauma in defense of the faith; he will find accounts in religious texts with historical and geographical corroboration; etc (these fact are of course not ‘proofs,’ but rather ‘evidences’ that elicit strong consideration). Pit this against tales of the Tooth Fairy, Santa, and Spaghetti Monsters and one finds the exact opposite: no testimony or religious refinement, no martyrs, no historical and geographical corroboration, etc. Instead, one finds myths created intentionally for children, for point making, or for whatever. It’s strawman argumentation at its worst.

Again, just to be clear, testimony, martyrs, geography, etc., are not “proof” that God exists, but rather proof that comparing faith in God to faith in fairies and Santa is totally different.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Believing in God is the same as believing in the Tooth Fairy, Santa Clause, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

What I love about this well-worn atheist ‘argument’ is that it actually serves to demonstrate how vastly different a belief in God is to these myths and imaginations. When one honestly assesses the Judeo-Christian doctrine of God he will find multiple thousands of years of human testimony and religious development; he will find martyrs enduring the most horrific trauma in defense of the faith; he will find accounts in religious texts with historical and geographical corroboration; etc (these fact are of course not ‘proofs,’ but rather ‘evidences’ that elicit strong consideration). Pit this against tales of the Tooth Fairy, Santa, and Spaghetti Monsters and one finds the exact opposite: no testimony or religious refinement, no martyrs, no historical and geographical corroboration, etc. Instead, one finds myths created intentionally for children, for point making, or for whatever. It’s strawman argumentation at its worst.

Again, just to be clear, testimony, martyrs, geography, etc., are not “proof” that God exists, but rather proof that comparing faith in God to faith in fairies and Santa is totally different.

It is the same, yes, all have no evidence.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Atheists simply reject a claim which has no evidence, much like people reject astrology..
Atheists don't "believe" in anything, it is up to the one making the claim of a god existing to provide evidence for it.

Aethist : A person who disBELIEVES in the existence of God.

Stop being a raging hypocrite and stop trying to dishonestly redefine terms to suit your assertions.

If you BELIEVE God doesn't exist then PROVE IT
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Aethist : A person who disBELIEVES in the existence of God.

Stop being a raging hypocrite and stop trying to dishonestly redefine terms to suit your assertions.

If you BELIEVE God doesn't exist then PROVE IT

If you believe god does exist, prove it. Theists are the ones making the claim, and refuse to provide evidence.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

If you believe god does exist, prove it. Theists are the ones making the claim, and refuse to provide evidence.

Huh ?

Lol !! I guess I'm not going to get a honest answer out of someone who celebrates Marx.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Huh ?

Lol !! I guess I'm not going to get a honest answer out of someone who celebrates Marx.

Fenton, you fail to understand the burden of proof, you can't disprove a negative.
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

It is the same, yes, all have no evidence.

There is no evidence for God’s existence?
There is at least one major problem with this line as it is typically presented.
One often hears, “there is no evidence for God, therefore Christians believe in fairytales,” (or something to that effect) when what is actually meant is more like, “there is no physical proof of God’s being in the physical world, therefore Christians believe in fairytales (since all ‘real’ things are physical).”

The fact that Christians have never claimed to believe in a physical God – as merely one more physical being among all other physical beings in the universe – does not stop these sorts of atheists from thinking they have laid waste to 40 centuries of religious thought, experience, and refinement with the mere mention of this evidentiary boogieman. It rarely occurs to them that such physical proof would actually run 100% counter to Judeo-Christian theistic claims. Their argument against a physical God is actually applauded and defended by Christians.

However, if what you mean is something more like, “There is no logical evidence of God’s existence…” then the straw man suddenly becomes a brick wall. The logical arguments for God are vast and time tested against some of the greatest minds of all time working tirelessly against them. They are well-known arguments and can be easily found online or in print, but let me give one quick example.
The fine tuning of the laws of physics...
The degree of fine-tuning is difficult to imagine. Dr. Hugh Ross gives an example of the least fine-tuned of the above four examples in his book, The Creator and the Cosmos, which is reproduced here:
Such as the fine tuned ratio of electrons and protons (1:10 to 37 power)
One part in 1037 is such an incredibly sensitive balance that it is hard to visualize. The following analogy might help: Cover the entire North American continent in dimes all the way up to the moon, a height of about 239,000 miles (In comparison, the money to pay for the U.S. federal government debt would cover one square mile less than two feet deep with dimes.). Next, pile dimes from here to the moon on a billion other continents the same size as North America. Paint one dime red and mix it into the billions of piles of dimes. Blindfold a friend and ask him to pick out one dime. The odds that he will pick the red dime are one in 1037. (p. 115)

And there are a lot more just like it, fine tuned to perfection to make the universe, and us living in it
 
Re: The lost tomb of Jesus? Scientist claims he has 'virtually unequivocal evidence'

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
Winston Churchill

Humanism or atheism is a wonderful philosophy of life as long as you are big, strong, and between the ages of eighteen and thirty-five. But watch out if you are in a lifeboat and there are others who are younger, bigger, or smarter.
William Murray

Still waiting for that proof .....
 
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