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Univ. of Oklahoma severs ties with frat after racist chant

tres borrachos said:
It's clear that the university knew that they had students who were racists?
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Given how nonchalantly the students were singing their racist song? Of course they f'n knew. Again, this was ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR for the members. To pretend that at no point the school administration knew of it is like saying Penn State didn't know about Sandusky.
 
tres borrachos said:
Oh, so you're back to your "the national organization promotes racism" slanderous posts again. Okay, carry on making accusations against large national groups with no evidence if it floats your boat.
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It's been pointed out to you that this isn't the first incident with this organization. Hell, it's the latest incident in a list that spans various states, decades, and universities. You want to pretend it isn't because it doesn't suit your happy days styled memories. That's your problem.
 
The IRS was caught up irresponsible spending $50 million in taxpayer money at 300 different conferences between 2010 and 2012. It's obvious the Obama administration was promoting this.
 
Hatuey said:
Given how nonchalantly the students were singing their racist song? Of course they f'n knew. Again, this was ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR for the members. To pretend that at no point the school administration knew of it is like saying Penn State didn't know about Sandusky.
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Oh, so the University of Oklahoma accepted racist and other inappropriate behavior from students who were making the atmosphere "hostile" for thousands of people, and the evidence of this was the students nonchalantly sung a sung. Of course! They're lying now when they say they don't accept this behavior. Is that about right?
 
Hatuey said:
Reading through the thread would help your contribution to this thread seem less asinine.
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:lol: nothing i can say could be more asinine that the premise of this thread.

it's enough to utterly condemn such racist behaviors... to condemn the whole fraternity as racist is flat out stupid,

FFS man, we're talking about 220+ chapters, 10s of thousands of idiots kids...errr.. college age adult men... that's a wide ass net to cast
 
tres borrachos said:
The IRS was caught up irresponsible spending $50 million in taxpayer money at 300 different conferences between 2010 and 2012. It's obvious the Obama administration was promoting this.
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Your descent into absurd comparisons is clear. These are not entirely unrelated people acting out of their own volition and it being blamed on a single factor. It is the members of an organization, engaging in what is acceptable behavior within the group as long as cameras aren't looking. It is people engaging in similar activities sanctioned by different chapters OF THE SAME ORGANIZATION. The difference couldn't be bigger and your comparison remains absurd.
 
Hatuey said:
Your descent into absurd comparisons is clear. These are not entirely unrelated people acting out of their own volition and it being blamed on a single factor. It is the members of an organization, engaging in what is acceptable behavior within the group as long as cameras aren't looking. It is people engaging in similar activities sanctioned by different chapters OF THE SAME ORGANIZATION. The difference couldn't be bigger and your comparison remains absurd.
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Nope, sorry. You said that incidents among local affiliations is clear evidence that the national leadership promotes it. So it's obvious the Obama administration promoted the thievery of the IRS employees spending $50 million in 300 separate instances in a 2 year period. The Obama administration is in charge of the IRS employees. They are hardly "entirely unrelated".
 
tres borrachos said:
Oh, so the University of Oklahoma accepted racist and other inappropriate behavior from students who were making the atmosphere "hostile" for thousands of people, and the evidence of this was the students nonchalantly sung a sung. Of course! They're lying now when they say they don't accept this behavior. Is that about right?
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They didn't accept it. They did what every single business (and let's not kid ourselves, universities are businesses these days) would do and they ignored it. They ignored it because it wasn't out in the open. When universities stop ignoring it is when these activities present a threat to signing black athletes who rake in millions for the universities. What? You thought this was the first time they sang this song? No. This was the first time they got caught doing it.
 
JasperL said:
I'm a liberal and do not support the expulsion of the idiot racists for being idiot racists (I'm fine with the fraternity being disbanded). ACLU is generally considered liberal and they're already on record defending free speech rights of idiot racists in cases like this. Boren was a democrat in office, but hardly a liberal, and he's the one who decided to expel the students. Maybe you should engage with liberals on this thread who have supported them being expelled instead of swinging at straw men.
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I will engage with anyone I please, and I stand by everything I said about the so-called liberals I have seen. Nothing I wrote addressed you in particular. Maybe you should stop trying to tell other posters what they should say.
 
Hatuey said:
They didn't accept it. They did what every single business (and let's not kid ourselves, universities are businesses these days) would do and they ignored it. They ignored it because it wasn't out in the open. When universities stop ignoring it is when these activities present a threat to signing black athletes who rake in millions for the universities. What? You thought this was the first time they sang this song? No. This was the first time they got caught doing it.
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You said before:

Hatuey said:
Given how nonchalantly the students were singing their racist song? Of course they f'n knew. Again, this was ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR for the members. To pretend that at no point the school administration knew of it is like saying Penn State didn't know about Sandusky.
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You say there that it was considered "ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR". Now all of a sudden it wasn't acceptable behavior? Make up your mind.

By the way, when did the university start referring to the students as "the members"?
 
tres borrachos said:
Nope, sorry. You said that incidents among local affiliations is clear evidence that the national leadership promotes it. So it's obvious the Obama administration promoted the thievery of the IRS employees spending $50 million in 300 separate instances in a 2 year period. The Obama administration is in charge of the IRS employees. They are hardly "entirely unrelated".
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Lmao, your absurd arguments really are getting to incredible heights. You went from irresponsible spending to thievery in 2 posts. The reality however is that in neither case are the situations comparable because we're discussing various branches within a single organization. We're not discussing individual employees/members within a larger group.
 
Hatuey said:
Lmao, your absurd arguments really are getting to incredible heights. You went from irresponsible spending to thievery in 2 posts. The reality however is that in neither case are the situations comparable because we're discussing various branches within a single organization. We're not discussing individual employees/members within a larger group.
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Okay, let's call it irresponsible spending. It's obvious that the Obama administration promotes irresponsible spending. Better?
 
tres borrachos said:
You said before:



You say there that it was considered "ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR". Now all of a sudden it wasn't acceptable behavior? Make up your mind.

By the way, when did the university start referring to the students as "the members"?
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It was acceptable behavior FOR THE MEMBERS. That does not conflict with the fact that it remained unacceptable OUTSIDE the group. You're just looking to nitpick now.
 
Hatuey said:
It was acceptable behavior FOR THE MEMBERS. That does not conflict with the fact that it remained unacceptable OUTSIDE the group. You're just looking to nitpick now.
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Members of what? University students aren't "members".
 
tres borrachos said:
Okay, let's call it irresponsible spending. It's obvious that the Obama administration promotes irresponsible spending. Better?
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Lmao, no it isn't better because irresponsible spending can be anything from some executive spending too much on office supplies to buying expensive toilet paper. Again, this discussion centers around entire chapters in different states engaging in activities with the purpose of promoting their racism. That you fail to see the difference really is amazing.
 
Hatuey said:
Members of the fraternity. Sweet baby jesus. Are you looking for anything to fight about?
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His post that you quoted:

EMNofSeattle said:
I guarantee Univ officials knew about this stuff for years and did nothing about it, second as a taxpayer funded entity if they allow frats to be affiliated they need to allow all points of view without bias amongst them
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Univ officials. Do you understand what the "Univ" is? It's the "University". And the "fraternity" isn't a taxpayer funded entity.

You didn't even read his post, you just went off agreeing with it. The two of you weren't talking about the same thing.
 
matchlight said:
I will engage with anyone I please, and I stand by everything I said about the so-called liberals I have seen. Nothing I wrote addressed you in particular. Maybe you should stop trying to tell other posters what they should say.
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The point was you didn't engage with anyone. You invented the position of unnamed "liberals" and then stridently attacked "liberals" for positions you invented and attributed to them, but that no one that I can find on this thread actually expressed. If a person did express it, it's still nonsense to attribute what are the opinions of ONE person to this apparently homogeneous group of "liberals" who apparently in your view ALL have the same opinion of when and where the 1st Amendment applies or not.

Maybe it makes you feel better to trash "liberals", but it's intellectually lazy BS. Sorry you got called out for it.
 
tres borrachos said:
His post that you quoted:

Univ officials. Do you understand what the "Univ" is? It's the "University". And the "fraternity" isn't a taxpayer funded entity.
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Good grief, reading comprehension would REALLY help you out here. I said that they, university officials, knew. I then added that this acceptable behavior for the members. At this point in time, I shouldn't have to explain that the members refers to the frat members. Again, your nitpicking and looking for something to desperately grasp on to. Face it 3b, your comparisons were weak and your defence of this organization is based on nothing more than some meaningless bond. The reality is that this organization has various chapters in states hundreds of miles apart, that engage in the same activities. How is this possible? One answer is that they live in racist places. It's plausible, but simplistic. The other is that these chapters and the organization were always embracing of racist views and now there's video evidence. That is perfectly in line with my claim that they embrace these views through channels not visible to the public. :shrug:
 
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Hatuey said:
Good grief, reading comprehension would REALLY help you out here. I said that they, university officials, knew. I then added that this acceptable behavior for the members. At this point in time, I shouldn't have to explain that the members refers to the frat members. Again, your nitpicking and looking for something to desperately grasp on to. Face it 3b, your comparisons were weak and your defence of this organization is based on nothing more than some meaningless bond. The reality is that this organization has various chapters in states hundreds of miles apart, that engage in the same activities. How is this possible? One answer is that they live in racist places. It's plausible, but simplistic. The other is that these chapters and the organization were always embracing of racist views and now there's video evidence. That is perfectly in line with my claim that they embrace these views through channels not visible to the public. :shrug:
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What is a "member" of the university"exactly? And why did you just say you were talking about the fraternity and not the university?

The university and the national fraternity are NOT the same entity. Do you seriously not know this?

He wasn't talking about the national fraternity. He was talking about the university.
 
tres borrachos said:
What is a "member of the university" exactly? And why did you just say you were talking about the fraternity and not the university?
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Good grief, it is again, I bolded it and underlined it so you wouldn't miss it:

I said that they, university officials, knew. I then added that this acceptable behavior for the members. At this point in time, I shouldn't have to explain that the members refers to the frat members.
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Hatuey said:
Good grief, it is again, I bolded it and underlined it so you wouldn't miss it:
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So what you're saying now is that the university deemed racist behavior acceptable for SAE fraternity members. Your proof of this is....what?
 
matchlight said:
What if the members of a non-white fraternity had thrown a party at which they played rap music containing obscene slurs against whites, along with the wholesome and delightful calls for killing police and raping women that are common in that music? Should the university discipline them too? I know how much soi-disant liberals detest the First Amendment, but some of us had imagined that people did not waive their freedom of speech by enrolling in a state university.

It's ironic what "liberal" has come to mean--nasty, intolerant, little prigs. Forty years ago, Jewish lawyers who were real liberals fought hard for the right of a bunch of Nazi goofballs to parade, in full regalia, through a town they picked exactly because many of its residents were Jewish survivors of Nazi concentration camps.
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You've been reduced to making up fictional scenarios to rationalize your bigotries
 
What is Oklahoma's eavesdropping laws? The phone owner who recorded this -- if applicable -- should be charged.

Is this not a private organization? Are they not allowed the freedom of expression and don't its members (of a fraternal organization known for its secrecy) have a certain expectation to privacy?

Or have people lost their marbles again and decided to sacrifice rights and laws on the alter of political correctness?
 
tres borrachos said:
So what you're saying now is that the university deemed racist behavior acceptable for SAE fraternity members. Your proof of this is....what?
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No, that's you trying out your 2nd strawman argument. What I have stated is that the university ignored it even though they without a doubt knew about it. This didn't start in a vacuum. There had to have been rumors, water cooler conversations, late night coffee and cigarette discussions where the school officials touched on the topic in some manner. However, they ignored it as long as it wasn't out in the open and they had no concrete evidence. That is entirely separate from the obvious fact that this was acceptable behavior amongst the fraternity's members. Have you even watched the video?
 
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