• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of punishme

Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Thoughts are?
Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of punishment

Imagine you’re browsing at Bloomingdale’s when a security guard taps you on the shoulder and accuses you of shoplifting. He takes you to a private room, sits you down, and runs your name through a database to see if you have any outstanding warrants. Then he tells you that you have two options. The first involves him calling the police, who might arrest you and take you to jail. The second allows you to walk out of the store immediately, no questions asked—right after you sign an admission of guilt and agree to pay $320 to take an online course designed to make you never want to steal again.

Which would you choose?

You're not shoplifting until you walk out the door so the store is in a world of trouble in this scenario.
Fill your pockets if you want- just empty them at the cash register.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

You're not shoplifting until you walk out the door so the store is in a world of trouble in this scenario.
Fill your pockets if you want- just empty them at the cash register.

Depends upon jurisdiction from what i found on a quick look.
Person hiding goods on their person and leaving that area, while still in the store could be charged with shoplifting. Jurisdictions differ?

Know Your Rights if a Store Detains You for Shoplifting

False Arrest, Shoplifting, security consultant, Chris McGoey, shoplifting, false arrest, security expert
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

I'm guessing that, until you've left the store? You've done nothing wrong. It's not against the law to stuff a blouse under your shirt. If it is? Please point me to the statute. ;)

Maggie...please tell me you dont believe the stores dont fully understand their role and job when it comes to theft recovery.

This whole poutrage thing is just ridiculous. People get caught shoplifting all the time. They dont get caught because the store is running around looking to extort innocent people. They get caught because they have been...you know...SHOPLIFTING. Nothing has changed. The store is still responsible for their rules and for their theft protection services. All that has changed is that WHEN someone has been caught shoplifting they are given a choice. INSTEAD of automatically having the cops called, they can opt for a class. They can still fight it if they believe they are innocent.

If you were caught shoplifting...which option would you WANT to be offered?

Its just ridiculous. People trip over themselves about this whole ohimgerd...mah rights!!!
ermahgerd-gersberms-mah-fravrit-berks.jpg

Apply logic.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

I'm guessing that, until you've left the store? You've done nothing wrong. It's not against the law to stuff a blouse under your shirt. If it is? Please point me to the statute. ;)

That's true, at least in Illinois. I have first hand experience with that. I had a strange feeling, so I didn't leave the store, though.. So they couldn't do much other than ban me from the store for life - Apparently it was that store's life, as they since closed (Venture).
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Maggie...please tell me you dont believe the stores dont fully understand their role and job when it comes to theft recovery.

This whole poutrage thing is just ridiculous. People get caught shoplifting all the time. They dont get caught because the store is running around looking to extort innocent people. They get caught because they have been...you know...SHOPLIFTING. Nothing has changed. The store is still responsible for their rules and for their theft protection services. All that has changed is that WHEN someone has been caught shoplifting they are given a choice. INSTEAD of automatically having the cops called, they can opt for a class. They can still fight it if they believe they are innocent.

If you were caught shoplifting...which option would you WANT to be offered?

Its just ridiculous. People trip over themselves about this whole ohimgerd...mah rights!!!
View attachment 67181220

Apply logic.

Please, God, let me be confronted in the aisles of a store and accused of shoplifting. If you really love me, let the security drone try to detain me, inside the store. I'll own the place.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

At my store we tend to have either video evidence or multiple eyewitnesses before we accuse someone of wrongdoing. Either that or catching them in the act. Accusations of shoplifting can't come out of nowhere.

True. This is also nothing new, I knew someone from school who shoplifted from Gemco more than 30 years ago, they offered him the same deal, pay a couple hundred dollars and never step foot in one of their stores again or go to jail.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

According to a thing some guy on the internet said, they can make a citizen's arrest and detain you, but cannot search you.

They can issue a citizen's arrest, but that relies on your willingness to go with them. If you refuse, they cannot physically detain you or you can have them charged with assault. They, and that includes the mall cops and store cops who are not licensed law enforcement personnel, have virtually no legal power.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Depends upon jurisdiction from what i found on a quick look.
Person hiding goods on their person and leaving that area, while still in the store could be charged with shoplifting. Jurisdictions differ?

Know Your Rights if a Store Detains You for Shoplifting

False Arrest, Shoplifting, security consultant, Chris McGoey, shoplifting, false arrest, security expert

It's probably a bad idea for a store to go to court with only a presumption of someone's intention to support a shoplifting charge. Your second link advises store that...

You must see the shoplifter approach the merchandise
You must see the shoplifter select the merchandise
You must see the shoplifter conceal, convert or carry away the merchandise
You must maintain continuous observation of the shoplifter
You must observe the shoplifter fail to pay for the merchandise
You must apprehend the shoplifter outside the store

... and that sounds like good advice.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

But a lot less than the financial damage that would result from a conviction or even mounting a decent defense. Many states have laws only requiring proof that you removed an item from its immediarte place of display and did not pay for it. Perhaps you pick up a bag of socks (on aisle #2) and then find another that you prefer (on aislke #4) and swap them. Even though you did not intend to keep the initial item you "concealed" it by simply (re?)moving it to aisle #4.

Shoplifting - FindLaw

Which is really ridiculous because there are hundreds of "shoplifters" every day. You can't go into a store and not find product spread all over the place by idiots who pick it up and change their mind later. I don't think you could ever find a single judge that would find any of that actionable.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Maggie...please tell me you dont believe the stores dont fully understand their role and job when it comes to theft recovery.

This whole poutrage thing is just ridiculous. People get caught shoplifting all the time. They dont get caught because the store is running around looking to extort innocent people. They get caught because they have been...you know...SHOPLIFTING. Nothing has changed. The store is still responsible for their rules and for their theft protection services. All that has changed is that WHEN someone has been caught shoplifting they are given a choice. INSTEAD of automatically having the cops called, they can opt for a class. They can still fight it if they believe they are innocent.

If you were caught shoplifting...which option would you WANT to be offered?

Its just ridiculous. People trip over themselves about this whole ohimgerd...mah rights!!!
View attachment 67181220

Apply logic.

My yearbook photo!!!

No, I don't buy the outrage...and I'm not outraged. And maybe? If I were planning to run for mayor? Signing a confession to stealing might be a plus. ;)
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Historically, they wouldnt be tapping on your shoulder unless they could already clearly demonstrate you were guilty.

True. I find it funny that so many people are acting outraged because they'd never steal, when the whole point of this thread is that you have been caught stealing. If you didn't do it, clearly you wouldn't find yourself in that little room in the first place.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

I'm guessing that, until you've left the store? You've done nothing wrong. It's not against the law to stuff a blouse under your shirt. If it is? Please point me to the statute. ;)

They cannot legally stop you until you have physically removed the item from the store. Until then, you have committed no crime.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Please, God, let me be confronted in the aisles of a store and accused of shoplifting. If you really love me, let the security drone try to detain me, inside the store. I'll own the place.

There are 1.5 million documented instances of shoplifting every year. Approx 50% of those instances involve arrest by law enforcement. You and others with your committed poutrage about this as if the theft detection people don't understand the laws better than you is beyond ridiculous.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

My yearbook photo!!!

No, I don't buy the outrage...and I'm not outraged. And maybe? If I were planning to run for mayor? Signing a confession to stealing might be a plus. ;)

True enough...it could actually boost a politicians career.

Point being...this is all just silliness. The stores understand the rules. This is an option for some of the 1.5 million shoplifters to avoid law enforcement. People that believe they are innocent maintain their rights.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

They cannot legally stop you until you have physically removed the item from the store. Until then, you have committed no crime.

Yikes, even if they stuff it down their pants? Seems like there should be some charge available for that. So the woman who put the turkey under her dress between her legs and tried to smuggle it out of the store, there's an assumption she's going to stop and pay for that? We're tripping into the absurd ignoring of reality here.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

There are 1.5 million documented instances of shoplifting every year. Approx 50% of those instances involve arrest by law enforcement. You and others with your committed poutrage about this as if the theft detection people don't understand the laws better than you is beyond ridiculous.

'Way off the topic, aren't you. Got your rage all outed about something no-one has said- there, does that feel better?
Now, back to the original post- are you so meek and obedient that you'd follow the security schmuck who confronted you in the aisle of the store to an office and believe them when they said you were guilty?
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Yikes, even if they stuff it down their pants? Seems like there should be some charge available for that. So the woman who put the turkey under her dress between her legs and tried to smuggle it out of the store, there's an assumption she's going to stop and pay for that? We're tripping into the absurd ignoring of reality here.

Nope. The store could ask the customer to leave (and leave the turkey behind) for potentially damaging their merchandise, but there's still no actionable crime being committed. I don't think they could even go for vandalism.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Nope. The store could ask the customer to leave (and leave the turkey behind) for potentially damaging their merchandise, but there's still no actionable crime being committed. I don't think they could even go for vandalism.

As I recall, when they approached her she ran and led a merry chase while still carrying the [frozen] turkey between her legs. :lamo
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

As I recall, when they approached her she ran and led a merry chase while still carrying the [frozen] turkey between her legs. :lamo

At that point, they could certainly call the police because she was trespassing. They have the right to remove her from their store for any non-protected reason they wish.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Thoughts are?
Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of punishment

Imagine you’re browsing at Bloomingdale’s when a security guard taps you on the shoulder and accuses you of shoplifting. He takes you to a private room, sits you down, and runs your name through a database to see if you have any outstanding warrants. Then he tells you that you have two options. The first involves him calling the police, who might arrest you and take you to jail. The second allows you to walk out of the store immediately, no questions asked—right after you sign an admission of guilt and agree to pay $320 to take an online course designed to make you never want to steal again.

Which would you choose?

First of all I would not go anywhere with the security guard and they can call anybody they want to as I stand there having stolen nothing.

Second, I don't see anywhere in that article (though I skimmed it) where it talked about innocent people being coerced...
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

'Way off the topic, aren't you. Got your rage all outed about something no-one has said- there, does that feel better?
Now, back to the original post- are you so meek and obedient that you'd follow the security schmuck who confronted you in the aisle of the store to an office and believe them when they said you were guilty?

You are the one that has stuff all twisted, son. What is being represented in the OP is what happens when someone that is actually committing the crime of shoplifting gets caught.
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

At that point, they could certainly call the police because she was trespassing. They have the right to remove her from their store for any non-protected reason they wish.

I remember the story from back before the internet. Apparently it still happens:

 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

Actually, I've always wondered about the legality of a store's security person being able to take you to a little back room.

There is nothing legal about detaining a person against their will unless they are a cop with reasonable cause...
 
Re: Pay us or we’ll call the cops: Many U.S. stores giving shoplifters choice of puni

First of all I would not go anywhere with the security guard and they can call anybody they want to as I stand there having stolen nothing.

Second, I don't see anywhere in that article (though I skimmed it) where it talked about innocent people being coerced...
There is nothing in the article about innocent people being coerced. Its just typical ohmigerdmahrights!!!mahrights!!! bull**** overreaction to a program that actually HELPS people caught shoplifting avoid a criminal record. Sadly...Im betting there are people stupid enough to actually choose the criminal route even after they have been caught shoplifting KNOWING they have been caught shoplifting. The ironic part is there is NO coercion and people that are caught ABSOLUTELY have the right to choose door a...arrest and criminal prosecution.
 
Back
Top Bottom