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Michigan lesbian couple says pediatrician denied baby care due to sexual orientation

Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

She should worry more about the actual health of the baby, rather than passing judgement on who is raising the baby. Her concern should be the baby's health, not the parents' relationship, unless that relationship can actually be shown to be harmful to the child.
Many people feel that a gay upbringing is harmful.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

What if my parents hadn't had sex that night? I wouldn't have been born.

"What if" is a hypothetical. There is a real story here, and not a hypothetical. This was a group practice, and another doctor saw the baby.

These are actual related hypotheticals though. And there is a reason that such questions are asked. There is not always another doctor available. What would have happened if the other doctors refused to see the baby as well or because of this doctor's refusal? She had agreed to see the baby to begin with, which was why they had an appointment with her.

But she didn't even have the guts to tell them herself why she was refusing to see them, but rather placed it on that other doctor to deal with until she started getting negative attention from it. And she deserves the negative attention.

Many laws are not about what happens, but protecting people from what could happen. Plus, it is humiliating for someone to be told that they are being discriminated against, don't want to be dealt with by someone who is supposed to be a professional or business person because of something like their race, religion, sex, sexuality, the way they look, the way they talk, a disability they have, who they are in a relationship with, or other things that do not have anything to do with their doing business with that person.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

Catholic run hospitals should make people recite the Nicene Creed prior to entering. If they can't, no service. That would be ok...right?

Cut the crap analogies
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

Many people feel that a gay upbringing is harmful.

And those people are wrong from an objective standpoint. There is plenty of evidence to support that they are wrong.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

I didn't know there were lines being drawn?
You drew one by stating that it was not an emergency. So asking a follow up question is normal, but you seem desperate to avoid answering it. Why is that? If you find nothing objectionable with this type of discrimination and bigotry say so. Others have.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

These are actual related hypotheticals though. And there is a reason that such questions are asked. There is not always another doctor available. What would have happened if the other doctors refused to see the baby as well or because of this doctor's refusal? She had agreed to see the baby to begin with, which was why they had an appointment with her.

But she didn't even have the guts to tell them herself why she was refusing to see them, but rather placed it on that other doctor to deal with until she started getting negative attention from it. And she deserves the negative attention.

Many laws are not about what happens, but protecting people from what could happen. Plus, it is humiliating for someone to be told that they are being discriminated against, don't want to be dealt with by someone who is supposed to be a professional or business person because of something like their race, religion, sex, sexuality, the way they look, the way they talk, a disability they have, who they are in a relationship with, or other things that do not have anything to do with their doing business with that person.

"Related hypotheticals"? No, there are no "related hypotheticals". I don't deal in hypotheticals. It's cowardly.

The baby was seen by another doctor in the practice. The baby got medical care. All of our doctors are part of a group practice. My life wouldn't end because the doctor I had an appointment with that day didn't end up seeing me, and another perfectly qualified doctor did see me. And I really don't care about the doctor not having the "guts" to tell them herself. This thread isn't supposed to be about that.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

Have you ever taken the oath or have you at least seen anyone do so? Of course not. How would you feel if you were denied treatment? Where would you draw the line?

There are many version of the oath, I referenced a translation of the original. Irrelevant to my response.

I draw the line at emergency treatment. A physician should not deny emergency treatment to anyone. If a physician didn't want to treat me because they don't feel comfortable around men, that is their business, but if they don't treat me in an emergency, I would be pissed at that.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

Many people feel that a gay upbringing is harmful.
Yes, because they are ignorant morons, especially in light of ample evidence to the contrary.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

I didn't know there were lines being drawn?

This wasn't an emergency. It wasn't a hospital. It was a group practice and someone else saw the baby.

In this case. But there is no reason that one doctor/practice should be treated differently and allowed to get away with such discriminatory practices while others, who might not have the same options would be held to them (at least in other places).

In the case here, there is no law that protects them from this type of discrimination, which is why their course of action is definitely appropriate. Inform the rest of the public of how this doctor is doing business. Many people, especially young people who are having babies (considering my generation supports same sex couples getting married and adopting in very large percentages, and I'm just about at that high risk due to age when it comes to pregnancies), support same sex couples getting married and raising/adopting/having children, and don't approve of this type of discrimination.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

You drew on by stating that it was not an emergency. So asking a follow up question is normal, but you seem desperate to avoid answering it. Why is that? If you find nothing objectionable with this type of discrimination and bigotry say so. Others have.

I'm not posting about discrimination and bigotry. That's you people. I'm posting about this story, and while I don't care who is gay and who isn't, I also don't care who has objections to someone who is gay and who isn't. This isn't a story about a man being killed because he was gay, or a couple being ejected from their home because they're gay, or a child committing suicide because the kids in school tease her because she's a lesbian. It's about one doctor in a group practice seeing a baby instead of another doctor.

This is a non-story.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

In this case. But there is no reason that one doctor/practice should be treated differently and allowed to get away with such discriminatory practices while others, who might not have the same options would be held to them (at least in other places).

In the case here, there is no law that protects them from this type of discrimination, which is why their course of action is definitely appropriate. Inform the rest of the public of how this doctor is doing business. Many people, especially young people who are having babies (considering my generation supports same sex couples getting married and adopting in very large percentages, and I'm just about at that high risk due to age when it comes to pregnancies), support same sex couples getting married and raising/adopting/having children, and don't approve of this type of discrimination.

We aren't talking about people getting married. We're talking about a baby being seen by another doctor in a group practice. This isn't a big deal. And I don't care what the doctor thinks about gay people any more than I care about what the doctor thinks about lamb kabobs, American Idol or the weather. The reason you take a baby to a doctor, as you well know, is to get the baby care. This baby got care.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

"Related hypotheticals"? No, there are no "related hypotheticals". I don't deal in hypotheticals. It's cowardly.

The baby was seen by another doctor in the practice. The baby got medical care. All of our doctors are part of a group practice. My life wouldn't end because the doctor I had an appointment with that day didn't end up seeing me, and another perfectly qualified doctor did see me. And I really don't care about the doctor not having the "guts" to tell them herself. This thread isn't supposed to be about that.

This thread is about this incident.

The reason for laws that protect people from discriminatory practices is for many reasons, including the possibility that one person not serving/seeing another based on something like their race, sex, religion, or sexuality, could lead to that person having medical or health issues, even if it doesn't do so in most cases. The reason for sharing this type of case with others is to help others know what kind of person this doctor is, who would refuse to see a baby due to the child having two mothers. Why would anyone against such bigotry want to go to such a business, even a medical practice? Push for laws that protect against such treatment happen because people shouldn't be treated like that.

And yes, the cowardice that she demonstrated in not telling the mothers is part of the story and therefore can easily be part of the discussion.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

Should have her license revoked... there is only one rule for doctors.. the Hippocratic oath

The Hippocratic oath says first do no harm.

If someone stated they felt that they could not adequately do a job, especially if it concerned my family, I would take them at their word and move on.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

We aren't talking about people getting married. We're talking about a baby being seen by another doctor in a group practice. This isn't a big deal. And I don't care what the doctor thinks about gay people any more than I care about what the doctor thinks about lamb kabobs, American Idol or the weather. The reason you take a baby to a doctor, as you well know, is to get the baby care. This baby got care.

The baby got care because another doctor had compassion. That other doctor could just as easily have been booked for the day and not able to see the baby. Luck basically worked to ensure the child was seen on the day of her appointment. Luck that should not have come into play because the doctor the baby was scheduled to see only refused based on the relationship of the parents and her disapproval of that relationship.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

We aren't talking about people getting married. We're talking about a baby being seen by another doctor in a group practice. This isn't a big deal. And I don't care what the doctor thinks about gay people any more than I care about what the doctor thinks about lamb kabobs, American Idol or the weather. The reason you take a baby to a doctor, as you well know, is to get the baby care. This baby got care.

I think the point is though, what gives this doctor the authority to decide what is and isn't OK for other people? Can a Jewish or Muslim doctor refuse to treat someone because they ate bad pork? Does this mean that an atheist doctor can refuse to care for someone if their parents believe in God? Can a Democrat doctor refuse a Republican patient?

Regardless of this doctor's legal rights, what kind of a POS says "I don't approve of your parents' lifestyle, therefore no medicine for you?"
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

The baby got care because another doctor had compassion. That other doctor could just as easily have been booked for the day and not able to see the baby. Luck basically worked to ensure the child was seen on the day of her appointment. Luck that should not have come into play because the doctor the baby was scheduled to see only refused based on the relationship of the parents and her disapproval of that relationship.

Again, that's a hypothetical. Irrelevant. The baby was seen by another doctor. The baby is fine. The doctor who didn't see the baby will be judged by her clients and potential clients. I stopped seeing my obstetrician in 1999 because he was at the center of an abortion controversy. That was my choice. Her patients have a choice, and the other doctors in her practice have a choice to stay or go. People who want to boycott her will boycott her. And nobody got hurt by her personal beliefs on gay couples.
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

Fair enough, if you alienate many patients or customers there won't be many left to keep you in business.

I just don't really understand what an innocent baby that has nothing to do or no say in their parents situation has to suffer, not in this case but more a general statement.

How, exactly, did this infant suffer?
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

I think the point is though, what gives this doctor the authority to decide what is and isn't OK for other people? Can a Jewish or Muslim doctor refuse to treat someone because they ate bad pork? Does this mean that an atheist doctor can refuse to care for someone if their parents believe in God? Can a Democrat doctor refuse a Republican patient?

Regardless of this doctor's legal rights, what kind of a POS says "I don't approve of your parents' lifestyle, therefore no medicine for you?"

What gives anyone the right to think anything, rocket? What gives you the right to think boys shouldn't wear pink, and old people shouldn't have big dogs? Nothing, really.

As far as a Jewish doctor refusing to see someone because he ate bad pork...sure, why not, if another doctor can see the person and the patient gets the care he needs? As far as a Democratic doctor refusing to treat a uber right wing conservative politician he abhors, sure, why not, as long as there is another doctor who can see the patient and he gets the care he needs? Do we pick doctors based on their personal lifestyle choices, or do we pick them to take care of us?
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

There are many version of the oath, I referenced a translation of the original. Irrelevant to my response.
Actually it is relevant because you included something that is not part of the oath.

I draw the line at emergency treatment. A physician should not deny emergency treatment to anyone.
Ok. Why? If we are to endorse religion as a basis for discrimination, why discriminate against emergency physicians? They are entitled to their freedom to believe as much as any other man? On the other side of the spectrum I bet that there are people who would not want to be treated by doctors who are not of the same faith, so there is a need for doctors of faith.

If a physician didn't want to treat me because they don't feel comfortable around men, that is their business, but if they don't treat me in an emergency, I would be pissed at that.
I will give you a better one. Lets assume that your take on emergency doctors is OK, although I clearly do not agree and now you are in a situation, say an accident and I wish you no harm, and you need an emergency tracheotomy, something just about any doctor can do and often enough patients die without it. Now a general practitioner happens to pass by, asses the situation and then suddenly decides that you are not to his or her liking...
 
Re: Bigotry is well and alive even among doctors.

I'm not posting about discrimination and bigotry.
Of course you are. The story in as much as you deny it IS about bigotry and discrimination and you seem to be an apologist for it.
At least show enough integrity to own it.
 
Re: Michigan lesbian couple says pediatrician denied baby care due to sexual orientat

To be quite honest this did surprise me. For some reason I thought that educated people can and would rise above such blatant bigotry, but I guess that low life imbeciles exist in every walk of life.
This doctor refused to treat an infant because the parents are gay.
Lesbian couple says Michigan pediatrician denied baby care due to sexual orientation | 7online.com

Personally, I believe this is wrong on the part of the doctor - equally as wrong as doctors in the 80s who initially refused to see or treat HIV/AIDS patients due to prejudice. I would hope that the governing body that disciplines medical practitioners in this jurisdiction will remind this doctor of his oath and responsibilities.

That said, I do find this comment from the article, attributed to one of the mom's, to be interesting:

"As far as we know, Bay doesn't have a sexual orientation yet so I'm not really sure what that
matters," Jami Contreras said.


From my limited knowledge of the subject matter, it is now scientifically believed that we are all born with a sexual orientation and it's not something that is "acquired" environmentally. This lesbian woman, inadvertently, is giving ammunition to those who believe that two gay parents can "turn" a child gay.
 
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