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Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

Indeed. If a woman's privacy is important in terms of her abortion rights then why is it not important in term of vaccines? Because, like I said, selective reasoning. They set out something like "we have a right to privacy" and then start marking down where it applies and where it doesn't as if that logically flows at all. It's really all old hat that many peoples politics are shaped around.

A woman getting an abortion isn't spreading infections to those around her and causing THEM to spontaneously abort.

If a kid can get measles and not give it to anyone else, it wouldn't be our business. But that isn't the case.
 
In answer to your slippery slope, I think we can safely say that mandatory vaccinations are not blazing a trail for the practice of eugenics.

Seriously, what are people thinking? Might as well say drivers' licenses are a slippery slope to govts coming to our houses and taking away our cars.

People on this site (not you) have some strange logic.
 
I am against mandatory vaccinations. IF schools want to ban those children then they need to supply teachers to come to the houses of banned children so that they can teach them.

In what country? That isnt the case in the US. They have already done so and SCOTUS ruled on it. However there are new challenges but now the schools can do so.
 
IT was ten years ago and I can't remember if it was that week or two weeks... the timing was close enough that it was not coincidental.

That sucks but you cant get it from the shots.

There are some reactions that people can get tho and they mimic minor flu symptoms. I think they just dont last as long.

I rarely get the flu, like once in the last 15 yrs. Sometimes I get the shot, sometimes I dont. I got it this yr and the next day felt like crap and had muscle aches. But still better than missing work for the flu.
 
In what country? That isnt the case in the US. They have already done so and SCOTUS ruled on it. However there are new challenges but now the schools can do so.

In any country that makes that kind of decision...
 
So besides insults is there anything you have to say to defend your argument?

I didnt make an argument. You said you didnt understand the word 'balance' so there is no point in my arguing my point further.
 
That doesn't open up Pandora's Box or anything... mandatory sterilization of anybody with an IQ under 90 and half of the people living in the South is best for our nation too, does that work for you?

I note that you didnt respond to my post where I supported my claim that medical privacy rights can be overcome by appropriate state's interests, in this case public welfare/health. I compared it to how the state does so for any rights and used the First Amendment as an example where it can and does override that right in some cases for the public good.
 
Huh?

This really has no relevance to the original point that was made, which was that there's no reason to be fearful that your infant grandchild might die, or that they are at any real greater risk of dying, due to a tiny outbreak of measles. Its nonsense, as are all these news stories that aim to scare people about this "deadly disease" by trying to pass off third world statistics as being somehow relevant to care here in the US.

Fifty years ago, before there was a vaccine, we had millions of people infected with measles, and something like 65 infant deaths per year. Now we should worry, because 200 people got measles at Disneyland?

Give me a break.

Got any stats on that? 65 infant deaths/yr to measles 50 yrs ago?
 
You can't vaccinate infants.

No, but you can protect them better if everyone else is vaccinated and the disease pretty much disappears from the country.

Which is what had happened.
 
That sucks but you cant get it from the shots.

There are some reactions that people can get tho and they mimic minor flu symptoms. I think they just dont last as long.

I rarely get the flu, like once in the last 15 yrs. Sometimes I get the shot, sometimes I dont. I got it this yr and the next day felt like crap and had muscle aches. But still better than missing work for the flu.

I don't even bother with the flu shot, Blue doesn't kill you, pneumonia after getting the flu does

Just get the pneumococcal vaccine. Get that once every 10 years, and it should work just fine
 
I note that you didnt respond to my post where I supported my claim that medical privacy rights can be overcome by appropriate state's interests, in this case public welfare/health. I compared it to how the state does so for any rights and used the First Amendment as an example where it can and does override that right in some cases for the public good.

Pretty sure I answered it and I said that the State can do anything immoral, illegal and hypocritical that it wants. You are arguing about the greater good. That is a Pandora's box. A much better argument about the greater good for society would be to sterilize all the degenerate idiots out there taking welfare, living as crack addicts or that have IQ's under 90. Within one generation the USA would be a flourishing beacon of greatness. No, instead let's focus on a small minority of people that don't want to vaccinate and apply government force onto them. The reason your 1st Amendment argument fails is because the government is not forcing anything on you. You say "bomb" in a theatre and you have broken a law. They are not forcing you say something. In vaccinations the government is forcing their will on you. Big difference.
 
Well they can and do here. So your statement does not apply to the US.

In the USA and if your kid is not vaccinated... they will not admit you to school and they send a teacher to your house to teach the kid on a daily basis... ummm... what?
 
Pretty sure I answered it and I said that the State can do anything immoral, illegal and hypocritical that it wants. You are arguing about the greater good. That is a Pandora's box. A much better argument about the greater good for society would be to sterilize all the degenerate idiots out there taking welfare, living as crack addicts or that have IQ's under 90. Within one generation the USA would be a flourishing beacon of greatness. No, instead let's focus on a small minority of people that don't want to vaccinate and apply government force onto them. The reason your 1st Amendment argument fails is because the government is not forcing anything on you. You say "bomb" in a theatre and you have broken a law. They are not forcing you say something. In vaccinations the government is forcing their will on you. Big difference.

LOL this argument hold no more weight and is just as much a straw man as the one where you were accused of wanting no govt.

And the use of force doesnt work either. You can be deprived of your right to liberty, by force, when the govt decides you have broken a law.
 
In the USA and if your kid is not vaccinated... they will not admit you to school and they send a teacher to your house to teach the kid on a daily basis... ummm... what?

They do? Where?

Is that the case for children who are unable to tolerate the vaccines? It's not for those that refuse the vaccines without medical basis....do you have some proof of that?
 
I don't even bother with the flu shot, Blue doesn't kill you, pneumonia after getting the flu does

Just get the pneumococcal vaccine. Get that once every 10 years, and it should work just fine

Have any links that support that?
 
LOL this argument hold no more weight and is just as much a straw man as the one where you were accused of wanting no govt.

And the use of force doesnt work either. You can be deprived of your right to liberty, by force, when the govt decides you have broken a law.

Being vaccinated is not a law and you are the second person to claim I said I wanted no government. I never ever once uttered anything close to that in my life.

I can't waste time debating people who are literally delusional.

They do? Where?

Is that the case for children who are unable to tolerate the vaccines? It's not for those that refuse the vaccines without medical basis....do you have some proof of that?

Are you drunk? I said that they should if they will deny kids to a school. You said that they do in the USA. I just asked... "ummm what?" as a result.
 
Yes. Exactly.

:lol: What?

Originally Posted by Bodhisattva
I never said that I wanted no government. Sorry. The rest is some bizarre Straw Man.

Exactly I never said that I wanted no government or exactly the rest is some bizarre Straw Man or exactly to both, meaning I am 100% correct on all accounts? :lol:
 
Being vaccinated is not a law and you are the second person to claim I said I wanted no government. I never ever once uttered anything close to that in my life.

I can't waste time debating people who are literally delusional.

Are you drunk? I said that they should if they will deny kids to a school. You said that they do in the USA. I just asked... "ummm what?" as a result.

I never said you didnt want any govt. I said your silliness comparing a slippery slope from vaccination to eugenics was no different than your claims of unfairness re: no govt from others.

And it was miscommunication...you said to Gina that if they forbade unvaccinated kids from schools then the schools had to send teachers to the homes. I was saying that was not the case here in the US. That SCOTUS ruled years ago that they could and that schools do so here....dont allow unvaccinated kids. Depends on the state and district. And that there are currently challenges to that but so far they still could and there was no obligation to send any teachers to individual homes.
 
:lol: What?

You never said you wanted no government.

And nobody in this thread ever said they wanted eugenics or to ban the unvaccinated from all public spaces. Those were a result of folks like yourself extrapolating arguments to extremes. Just like "no government" was extrapolating your arguments to extremes.

Neither was valid. Agree?
 
You can't vaccinate infants.

Actually, you can. An infant in my family was born 3 months premature and before he left the hospital, he was given a raft of vaccinations, including one for the flu and RSV. It was also strongly suggested his parents and all immediate family members who would be around him with any regularity get their flu shots as well and to severely limit his exposure to public spaces and strangers for a year. Further he received an RSV shot every 28 days for his first year.

I don't believe the MMR was part of that infant's immunizations when he left the hospital, based on the CDC recommendation to give the first MMR vaccination at 12 months. That left him and leaves any infant under a year old at risk of contracting measles, which is highly contagious.


http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedules/hcp/imz/child-adolescent-shell.html#f9
 
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