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Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

Bodhisattva said:
Why doesn't the parent deserve responsibility for bringing their unvaccinated child into contact with people knowing that some choose to not vaccinate in today's day and age?

It is nature people... it is a big scary world with lots of bad **** going on in it. If I send my kid to school with peanuts and they share with your kid that is allergic who's fault is it?

**** happens...
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"**** happens."

Compelling argument in favor of starting epidemics.
 
Lursa said:
Why not if they can be adequately protected with vaccination programs? Those that CAN be vaccinated should be so that those that CANNOT be vaccinated have less exposure to the disease.
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Nobody has a right to force anything on people... especially the government. If your child cannot get vaccinated then that is like a kid born that has to walk gingerly with crutches their entire life. Are other children not allowed to run in that kids vicinity? What if they do and knock the kid down and he has that Osteogenesis imperfect (brittle bones) or something else terrible? Life is not fair.
 
mac said:
Eugenics is an extreme, but giving the govt authority to proscribe medical treatment ends where?
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Same place it does when it restricts things like the First Amendment. When it determines that the dangers outweigh public safety. Looks at risk/reward and makes a decision.
 
Lursa said:
That has zero to do with the situation today.
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But why is there a situation, today? If the disease was all but eradicated before 1963, what has prompted the disease to rear its ugly head today where medicine is 10 times better than it ever could have been in 1963? Is it a real epidemic, or a made up one?
 
mac said:
That not getting vaccinated threatens society is an assumption. One may not get vaccinated and never contract or spread any disease. The idea that the govt is allowed to proscribe any medical treatment, or force anyone to receive any medication or chemical in their body is a dangerous idea.
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That's not an assumption. During an epidemic the economic repercussions alone could threaten infrastructure and security in seriously dangerous ways.
 
bicycleman said:
But why is there a situation, today? If the disease was all but eradicated before 1963, what has prompted the disease to rear its ugly head today where medicine is 10 times better than it ever could have been in 1963? Is it a real epidemic, or a made up one?
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Uhhhh people not using the medicine....?
 
mac said:
Why wouldn't it be applicable to vaccinations? Either one has personal sovereignty over their own body, or they don't.
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They dont. Suicide is illegal in many states.

The govt can send you to war and dictate just about everything about your body.

And there are laws governing seat belts and safety helmets.
 
BmanMcfly said:
The ebola thing was not that long ago, and the people that argued that closing borders would make the outbreak worse, that quarantines are pointless, and has a 50+% casualty rate of those infected.

They are the same people getting all fluffy when 90+% of people are already vaccinated, they are "protected", from a disease that has a 99.993% survival and recovery rate.
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The same people???

Certainly not me. That blanket statement is completely off the mark.
 
Lursa said:
They dont. Suicide is illegal in many states.

The govt can send you to war and dictate just about everything about your body.

And there are laws governing seat belts and safety helmets.
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So, ultimately you support a medical "martial law"?
 
Bodhisattva said:
Education is a Right of the People... sorry.
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Public schools 'uninvite' students all the time for many reasons. It's not a 'right' in the US.

Interestingly, the law still requires the child get a certain amount of education and when 'uninvited,' the parents are then obligated to provide that education, i.e. homeschooling, private school.
 
BmanMcfly said:
So, ultimately you support a medical "martial law"?
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More of the black and white universe from the antivaxxer crowd. Typical.

You support smaller government, right? So, ultimately you support dissolution of the United States?

Or maybe "you have unlimited rights" and "the government controls literally everything about you" aren't the only two options?
 
Deuce said:
The early vaccine? What about the later ones?
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He's basing his entire arguments on 50+ yrs ago and seems to think that 500 child deaths per year from a disease are 'negligible.'
 
Bodhisattva said:
Yeah, like the right to NOT drive a car just like the right to NOT take a shot.
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What about the risks from someone without a license (didnt get driver training or learn the laws)? Should you have to give up your right to drive to improve your chances at safety?
 
Deuce said:
"**** happens."

Compelling argument in favor of starting epidemics.
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Damn... I KNEW I should not have put in those last two words because that is all that you would focus on. Seriously... :roll:

What about the previous two sentences?
 
Lursa said:
What about the risks from someone without a license (didnt get driver training or learn the laws)? Should you have to give up your right to drive to improve your chances at safety?
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I fail to see how driving a car without a license is analogous to not getting a vaccination in any way, shape or form. I think you misunderstood my point...
 
roguenuke said:
True, but chicken pox is rarely deadly and even has very few longlasting complications.
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Except shingles which suck and no one should be casually exposed to it and have to deal with that later.

I know people that get shingles and it makes them really sick and uncomfortable. I really need to get that shot now.
 
Deuce said:
More of the black and white universe from the antivaxxer crowd. Typical.

You support smaller government, right? So, ultimately you support dissolution of the United States?

Or maybe "you have unlimited rights" and "the government controls literally everything about you" aren't the only two options?
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Again with that ridiculous "You support smaller government so ultimately you support dissolution of the United States" rubbish?

If I support a smaller government then I support a smaller government. There is still a government so there is still a United States...
 
Tettsuo said:


Does a pretty good job of detailing the main concerns of anti-vaccine parents.
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My mother's a nurse and thinks this woman is an idiot. (Well, her thoughts anyway)

There's nothing wrong with having your kids tested for possible allergic reactions to vaccines and their preservatives or being assessed because of other medical conditions. Doctors do support that :doh
 
Lursa said:
Except shingles which suck and no one should be casually exposed to it and have to deal with that later.

I know people that get shingles and it makes them really sick and uncomfortable. I really need to get that shot now.
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Go ahead and get it... there is no way I would give my kids a vaccination for something that is not basically deadly or deadly serious...
 
Lursa said:
Same place it does when it restricts things like the First Amendment. When it determines that the dangers outweigh public safety. Looks at risk/reward and makes a decision.
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There is no way to limit the first amendment that violates personal sovereignty.
 
Lursa said:
That's not an assumption. During an epidemic the economic repercussions alone could threaten infrastructure and security in seriously dangerous ways.
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It's not likely to cause an epidemic, and even if it does...not much of anything that it is prevented by vaccinations these days is likely to kill many anyway.
 
Lursa said:
Public schools 'uninvite' students all the time for many reasons. It's not a 'right' in the US.

Interestingly, the law still requires the child get a certain amount of education and when 'uninvited,' the parents are then obligated to provide that education, i.e. homeschooling, private school.
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They uninvited them because they are trouble makers. Drugs. Fights. Etc. Please don't start telling a teacher that the reasons kids are expelled is in any way similar to not getting vaccinated.
 
Lursa said:
They dont. Suicide is illegal in many states.
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Suicide is homicide.

The govt can send you to war and dictate just about everything about your body.
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No, it can't. One volunteers to go to war.

And there are laws governing seat belts and safety helmets.
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I disagree with them too.
 
Tettsuo said:
Wouldn't it be the fault of the parent to bring their infant around other people?
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Children can bring measles home to their infant siblings. From contact with unvaccinated people or objects they touch.

They said it again on the news last nite. Measles is very very transmissable.

But sure, blame the people that 'cant' vaccinate their infants.
 
mac said:
Suicide is homicide.



No, it can't. One volunteers to go to war.



I disagree with them too.
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So, it's still the law so you can disagree. And we've had the draft in the past and may again in the future.

And we restrict the 1st Amendment to protect public safety as well, so again, basing your personal opinion on precedent isnt going to get you anywhere.

(LOL, 'homicide' of one's own personal sovereignty. Nice try tho.)
 
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