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McConnell: Senate Will 'Try to Pass' House Immigration Bill

j-mac

j-mac

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HERSHEY, Pa.—After hearing a week's worth of complaints from his conservative members, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell said Thursday that the Senate will attempt to approve a House-passed bill that guts President Obama's executive actions on immigration.
Months after the president announced his executive action to protect millions of illegal immigrants within U.S. borders, Senate Republican leaders have been cagey about how they will respond, raising concerns among border hawks within the conference. But McConnell affirmed at a joint House and Senate Republican retreat in Hershey, Pa., that he will work to get the House's bill—which passed that chamber Wednesday—to the president's desk. "We're going to try to pass it," he told reporters Thursday.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/congress/senate-gop-leaders-won-t-pledge-to-follow-house-lead-on-immigration-20150115
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To those of you who thought that now that repubs have the entire congress that things would change? Not so fast....Repub leadership doesn't have the stones to fight for what the people want.
 
j-mac said:
To those of you who thought that now that repubs have the entire congress that things would change? Not so fast....Repub leadership doesn't have the stones to fight for what the people want.
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I'd say trying to pass it is having the stones. Try as they might, they can't change math and there aren't 60 Republicans in the Senate.

Also, for every person who wants this to pass, there is probably one who doesn't. Those people count too. So it's not what "the people want" it's what about half the people want.
 
j-mac said:
To those of you who thought that now that repubs have the entire congress that things would change? Not so fast....Repub leadership doesn't have the stones to fight for what the people want.
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That is because what the people want (real immigration law enforcement) costs a lot of money. Immigration law enforcement is not cheap - it requires major enforcement personnel increases as well as other system changes. How, exactly, do these "border hawks" intend to fund federal immigration law enforcement? Why do we now have 10X as many federal airport nannies than ICE agents? Serious law enforcement requires serious law enforcement personnel and systems. How long would it take, under the current law, to identify, apprehend and "process" 20 million folks - using only 5K ICE agents?
 
ttwtt78640 said:
That is because what the people want (real immigration law enforcement) costs a lot of money. Immigration law enforcement is not cheap - it requires major enforcement personnel increases as well as other system changes. How, exactly, do these "border hawks" intend to fund federal immigration law enforcement? Why do we now have 10X as many federal airport nannies than ICE agents? Serious law enforcement requires serious law enforcement personnel and systems. How long would it take, under the current law, to identify, apprehend and "process" 20 million folks - using only 5K ICE agents?
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Agreed. IMO, the appropriate, and less costly, way to deal with the millions of illegals exploiting the country is at the job level. E-Verify to prove due diligence by the employer, and catastrophic, draconian penalty's for employers found guilty of knowingly hiring them. Asset forfeiture to pay penalty's and mandatory jail time. Problem, and the draw, eventually solves itself.
 
j-mac said:
To those of you who thought that now that repubs have the entire congress that things would change? Not so fast....Repub leadership doesn't have the stones to fight for what the people want.
Click to expand...

What do 'the people' want, because you and me probably want extremely different things when it comes to immigration and for every 10 people you can find that agree with you, I can find 10 that agree with me. So it's not really what 'the people' want - it's what you, and the people who agree with you, want that you are really talking about.
 
rocket88 said:
I'd say trying to pass it is having the stones. Try as they might, they can't change math and there aren't 60 Republicans in the Senate.

Also, for every person who wants this to pass, there is probably one who doesn't. Those people count too. So it's not what "the people want" it's what about half the people want.
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Americans Oppose Obama's Unilateral Action on Immigration

You'll note that not only do a sizable portion (65%) of Americans not want Obama to single handedly dictate immigration law, but that the polls show that support for "comprehensive" **** is "diminishing".... People understand that we have to take this on piece by piece....These all inclusive piles of dung are just that....Start with step one, secure the border, THEN deal with those here.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
That is because what the people want (real immigration law enforcement) costs a lot of money. Immigration law enforcement is not cheap - it requires major enforcement personnel increases as well as other system changes. How, exactly, do these "border hawks" intend to fund federal immigration law enforcement? Why do we now have 10X as many federal airport nannies than ICE agents? Serious law enforcement requires serious law enforcement personnel and systems. How long would it take, under the current law, to identify, apprehend and "process" 20 million folks - using only 5K ICE agents?
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Far too long, that's why we focus on the border enforcement first, once that is brought under control, and not with BS numbers that we are fed today by this lying administration, but with real measures, and numbers, then, and only then can we address the ones that are here....You don't start pumping out a flooded basement, until you fix the damn leak.
 
americanwoman said:
What do 'the people' want, because you and me probably want extremely different things when it comes to immigration and for every 10 people you can find that agree with you, I can find 10 that agree with me. So it's not really what 'the people' want - it's what you, and the people who agree with you, want that you are really talking about.
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The polls are there, I even provided one...it's quite clear.
 
ocean515 said:
Agreed. IMO, the appropriate, and less costly, way to deal with the millions of illegals exploiting the country is at the job level. E-Verify to prove due diligence by the employer, and catastrophic, draconian penalty's for employers found guilty of knowingly hiring them. Asset forfeiture to pay penalty's and mandatory jail time. Problem, and the draw, eventually solves itself.
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Even that requires physically checking each and every employer (and each of their employees), many of which use (or soon will use) 1099 labor or "temp agencies" to supply the labor. Fake IDs abound so who is guilty if Joe turns out to really have been Jose? When the local mill, store, farm or factory shuts down (to pay the ICE fine) then EVERYONE is screwed simply because Joe turned out to be Jose with a fake ID. Forcing the employer to become an unpaid ICE agent will not be the magic bullet that many expect.
 
j-mac said:
Far too long, that's why we focus on the border enforcement first, once that is brought under control, and not with BS numbers that we are fed today by this lying administration, but with real measures, and numbers, then, and only then can we address the ones that are here....You don't start pumping out a flooded basement, until you fix the damn leak.
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The "leak" is only 60% (at most) at the border - many simply overstay their tourist, work or student visas. Even if we did stop all border jumpers (at considerable cost) that still means a net increase in illegals every year. If our congress critters succeed in making sealing the border (with verification) step one then there will never be a step two.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
The "leak" is only 60% (at most) at the border - many simply overstay their tourist, work or student visas. Even if we did stop all border jumpers (at considerable cost) that still means a net increase in illegals every year. If our congress critters succeed in making sealing the border (with verification) step one then there will never be a step two.
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Difficulty should never be a reason not to try.
 
j-mac said:
Difficulty should never be a reason not to try.
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Simplicity should not be the basis for any solution. Failing to 100% secure the border is not a reason (or even a good excuse) to simply accept 20 million current illegal aliens inside the country.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Simplicity should not be the basis for any solution. Failing to 100% secure the border is not a reason (or even a good excuse) to simply accept 20 million current illegal aliens inside the country.
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I agree, but, do you really trust "comprehensive" anything today? how many times do we need to be fooled before we say shame on us?
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Even that requires physically checking each and every employer (and each of their employees), many of which use (or soon will use) 1099 labor or "temp agencies" to supply the labor. Fake IDs abound so who is guilty if Joe turns out to really have been Jose? When the local mill, store, farm or factory shuts down (to pay the ICE fine) then EVERYONE is screwed simply because Joe turned out to be Jose with a fake ID. Forcing the employer to become an unpaid ICE agent will not be the magic bullet that many expect.
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I'd rather money be spent where the action is. Everything you wrote is true, however, even tax cheats eventually get caught, so the same holds true for those who try to use false docs.

The point of the E-Verify component is to protect the employers who have shown they exercised due diligence in screening employees. They don't become an unpaid ICE agent. They simply follow process and procedure and document that effort in the employees file. They way it is now, without recognizing an E-Verify type program as a national check and balance makes employers unpaid ICE agents. We are supposed to be able to identify identity theft, and forged documents. That's ridiculous. An E-Verify shows a check was made, clearance received, and papers in order.

The point about employees being harmed is true today. What happens to honest law abiding employees when some of their workers get caught? Does not the entire work force potentially suffer because other employees are no longer there? That's one of the aspects that makes illegals all the worse, their complete disregard for the harm they could bring to the other people they work around.
 
j-mac said:
I agree, but, do you really trust "comprehensive" anything today? how many times do we need to be fooled before we say shame on us?
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There is no need to include amnesty, just as there is no need to have a "secure the border first" serial plan. My point is that ANY plan must deal with those inside the US since not only is 100% border security is impossible but it only reduces the inflow by about 60%.
 
ocean515 said:
I'd rather money be spent where the action is. Everything you wrote is true, however, even tax cheats eventually get caught, so the same holds true for those who try to use false docs.

The point of the E-Verify component is to protect the employers who have shown they exercised due diligence in screening employees. They don't become an unpaid ICE agent. They simply follow process and procedure and document that effort in the employees file. They way it is now, without recognizing an E-Verify type program as a national check and balance makes employers unpaid ICE agents. We are supposed to be able to identify identity theft, and forged documents. That's ridiculous. An E-Verify shows a check was made, clearance received, and papers in order.

The point about employees being harmed is true today. What happens to honest law abiding employees when some of their workers get caught? Does not the entire work force potentially suffer because other employees are no longer there? That's one of the aspects that makes illegals all the worse, their complete disregard for the harm they could bring to the other people they work around.
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Show me ANY E-verify law that applies to every worker. Most of these feel good schemes apply only to large employers and, even then, apply only to new hires. We won't even check the IDs of those that send their kids to schools, get pulled over by the police or use the ER so why pretend that those working for "big" companies are the problem?

Short off a biometric based, national ID system E-verify is next to useless. It can be part of a plan but it cannot be the plan.

https://www.numbersusa.com/content/learn/illegal-immigration/map-states-mandatory-e-verify-laws.html
 
ttwtt78640 said:
There is no need to include amnesty, just as there is no need to have a "secure the border first" serial plan. My point is that ANY plan must deal with those inside the US since not only is 100% border security is impossible but it only reduces the inflow by about 60%.
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It just seems so defeatist to me to say, and dismiss out of hand attacking these issues one by one....Those inside the US aren't going anywhere, so if we get off the mindset of 'oh, it won't work anyway' and just get to doing it we might just find that surprisingly it does work...Like I said doing nothing is not a plan...But, if we start to put real measures in place, that word will spread that we are serious about tightening up border security, and that 60% number may just turn into 80% because of decreased flow....I see "comprehensive" as Washington speak these days for loading up bills with everything under the kitchen sink that have NOTHING to do with addressing this problem.
 
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