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Obama pushes broadband plan

Papa bull said:
Everyone likes freestuff. The people thumping you just knew that government handouts might be free to you but they're paid for by OTHER people. There is nothing the government can give to you that it doesn't first take from someone else. That's probably why you got the business. You basically were applauding the government taking from others and giving to you in their eyes and their perspective wasn't wrong.
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I was? What did I pay into social security for all those years?

You know, around here, my rent is equal to 1/2 of my subsistence that I receive in SS benefits, winter is especially rough too, our heating bills are nuts.

I should cancel my heating assistance appointment because now you've made me feel like I don't deserve to be warm. :(
 
Papa bull said:
Everyone likes freestuff. The people thumping you just knew that government handouts might be free to you but they're paid for by OTHER people. There is nothing the government can give to you that it doesn't first take from someone else. That's probably why you got the business. You basically were applauding the government taking from others and giving to you in their eyes and their perspective wasn't wrong.
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Out of curiosity, is there a country you can point to as a good example of the level of government you'd like to see?
 
Cardinal said:
Out of curiosity, is there a country you can point to as a good example of the level of government you'd like to see?
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No. I don't pretend to be an expert on all the different governments of the world and don't cast judgment on the governments of other countries because their government really isn't my business, generally speaking. Good question, but one that someone could really only answer if they had intimate working knowledge of a number of national governments and I don't know many people with that sort of expertise.
 
AJiveMan said:
I was? What did I pay into social security for all those years?
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We were talking about you saying that you wanted free internet. What the hell do social security payments have to do with that? Did you forget what you were talking about?
 
Papa bull said:
No. I don't pretend to be an expert on all the different governments of the world and don't cast judgment on the governments of other countries because their government really isn't my business, generally speaking. Good question, but one that someone could really only answer if they had intimate working knowledge of a number of national governments and I don't know many people with that sort of expertise.
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Thanks for your honesty, but I think you should spend some time researching which countries have most closely implemented your ideals, otherwise there's no real world precedent for discussing them. Until then these ideas in your head are just that: ideas in your head.
 
Cardinal said:
Thanks for your honesty, but I think you should spend some time researching which countries have most closely implemented your ideals, otherwise there's no real world precedent for discussing them. Until then these ideas in your head are just that: ideas in your head.
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I see. You think that anything we do must be modeled after something some other government has already done.

I remember a time when we prided ourselves on being leaders instead of followers. It's sad that those days are gone.
 
Papa bull said:
I see. You think that anything we do must be modeled after something some other government has already done.

I remember a time when we prided ourselves on being leaders instead of followers. It's sad that those days are gone.
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You haven't even bothered to research the issue so you can't skip ahead to complaining about me wanting an example. If you want any credibility for the beliefs you clearly seem to feel strongly about then you'd spend at least a day or two researching the issue. I have a model for my own ideal political system, the least you can do when entering this topic is try to do the same.
 
Papa bull said:
We were talking about you saying that you wanted free internet. What the hell do social security payments have to do with that? Did you forget what you were talking about?
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No, but it seems some people view SS and things like UE as entitlements.

Well, I'd like to have free access to the internet, and I can when I have my 700 watt power inverter installed in our van, and load up my desktop pc along with the monitor, keyboard and mouse, then all I'd have to do is park in front of McDonalds or Applebees and tap into their wifi system, I've done it before I could budget money for internet service into the apartment. My internet costs around $55 a month, for the slowest speed possible. Isn't that expensive? Now you know how much I'd like to see either better competition in my area, without broadband companies price fixing, like they do now.
 
AJiveMan said:
No, but it seems some people view SS and things like UE as entitlements.

Well, I'd like to have free access to the internet, and I can when I have my 700 watt power inverter installed in our van, and load up my desktop pc along with the monitor, keyboard and mouse, then all I'd have to do is park in front of McDonalds or Applebees and tap into their wifi system, I've done it before I could budget money for internet service into the apartment. My internet costs around $55 a month, for the slowest speed possible. Isn't that expensive? Now you know how much I'd like to see either better competition in my area, without broadband companies price fixing, like they do now.
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Sorry, you may only have access to the competing businesses that the single corporate monopoly says you may have access to. If you don't like it, you're more than free to pay millions of dollars to the state congress of your choice to change the law.
 
Cardinal said:
Sorry, you may only have access to the competing businesses that the single corporate monopoly says you may have access to. If you don't like it, you're more than free to pay millions of dollars to the state congress of your choice to change the law.
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When I win the powerball or megamillions jackpot, would that be enough to influence someone, or should I just start my own monopoly?
 
AJiveMan said:
When I win the powerball or megamillions jackpot, would that be enough to influence someone, or should I just start my own monopoly?
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Well, that's the thing about America: it's about choice. You can do both, though it should be noted that you can't do the latter until you've done the former. So I hope that powerball win was a good haul.
 
AJiveMan said:
When I win the powerball or megamillions jackpot, would that be enough to influence someone, or should I just start my own monopoly?
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Sadly, I think the only way libs like you will ever realize that buying politicians isn't nearly as common or easy as you want to believe is to win mega millions and find out for yourself. Unfortunately, there can't be enough super powerball winners to do much to change the overall meme.
 
Papa bull said:
Sadly, I think the only way libs like you will ever realize that buying politicians isn't nearly as common or easy as you want to believe is to win mega millions and find out for yourself. Unfortunately, there can't be enough super powerball winners to do much to change the overall meme.
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Yeah, the GOP is not a stooge for Big Business....
 
Papa bull said:
Sadly, I think the only way libs like you will ever realize that buying politicians isn't nearly as common or easy as you want to believe is to win mega millions and find out for yourself. Unfortunately, there can't be enough super powerball winners to do much to change the overall meme.
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I'm not sure how you come to this conclusion....do you have a lot of experience in those closed small events between big donors and politicians? It seems as if without contrary evidence that if someone is shelling out a lot of money for a politician they are getting something for that.
 
iliveonramen said:
I'm not sure how you come to this conclusion....do you have a lot of experience in those closed small events between big donors and politicians? It seems as if without contrary evidence that if someone is shelling out a lot of money for a politician they are getting something for that.
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I'll tell you how I came to that conclusion. The fact that the rich don't get whatever they want is absolute proof that they don't "buy legislation". The fact that despite all the incessant blather from liberals that it's so unfair that the rich are so rich because being rich means they make all the laws, you can't prove that such trite drivel is actually true. And that's because our system is 1 vote per person, not one vote per dollar. The really slow kids, however, are never going to figure this out. Maybe if they had money they'd see. But then again, maybe they'd just double down on stupid and think maybe the system is actually conspiring against them personally.
 
Gimmesometruth said:
Yeah, the GOP is not a stooge for Big Business....
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Well, of course it is just because you say so. Everything is however you say it is because you say so. It's just how you roll. :)
 
Papa bull said:
Sadly, I think the only way libs like you will ever realize that buying politicians isn't nearly as common or easy as you want to believe is to win mega millions and find out for yourself. Unfortunately, there can't be enough super powerball winners to do much to change the overall meme.
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Right, money is never a factor for a politician. It is ALL about conviction. LOL
 
iguanaman said:
Right, money is never a factor for a politician. It is ALL about conviction. LOL
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Never? That's an odd thing to say. Absolute statements like yours are pretty silly and make a very transparent strawman. If you want to create a ridiculous position for me, it's better to make one that's not so transparent. Transparencies make poor strawmen.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Satellite broadband is extremely asynchronous and latency is very high. The only time its a good option is when there are simply no other options at all available.
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So you think dial-up is better?

.
 
Papa bull said:
Well, of course it is just because you say so. Everything is however you say it is because you say so. It's just how you roll. :)
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Well that was your cue to say how the DEMS are actually the ones who have sold out to Big Business....just after saying how "hard" it is to buy off a politician.

I'm OK with your denial of the GOP being a stooge for Big Business.....because I know that is how you graze.
 
Papa bull said:
I'll tell you how I came to that conclusion. The fact that the rich don't get whatever they want is absolute proof that they don't "buy legislation". The fact that despite all the incessant blather from liberals that it's so unfair that the rich are so rich because being rich means they make all the laws, you can't prove that such trite drivel is actually true. And that's because our system is 1 vote per person, not one vote per dollar. The really slow kids, however, are never going to figure this out. Maybe if they had money they'd see. But then again, maybe they'd just double down on stupid and think maybe the system is actually conspiring against them personally.
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You create a straw argument (that there was an implied absolute) and conflate "votes" with influence!

Do you ever re-read your posts for content?
 
Papa bull said:
I'll tell you how I came to that conclusion. The fact that the rich don't get whatever they want is absolute proof that they don't "buy legislation". The fact that despite all the incessant blather from liberals that it's so unfair that the rich are so rich because being rich means they make all the laws, you can't prove that such trite drivel is actually true. And that's because our system is 1 vote per person, not one vote per dollar. The really slow kids, however, are never going to figure this out. Maybe if they had money they'd see. But then again, maybe they'd just double down on stupid and think maybe the system is actually conspiring against them personally.
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So you really just "liberals are big dummy heads". Gotcha. I think I'll stick with the view that large donations to political campaigns serve economic self interest.
 
Papa bull said:
I'll tell you how I came to that conclusion. The fact that the rich don't get whatever they want is absolute proof that they don't "buy legislation". The fact that despite all the incessant blather from liberals that it's so unfair that the rich are so rich because being rich means they make all the laws, you can't prove that such trite drivel is actually true. And that's because our system is 1 vote per person, not one vote per dollar. The really slow kids, however, are never going to figure this out. Maybe if they had money they'd see. But then again, maybe they'd just double down on stupid and think maybe the system is actually conspiring against them personally.
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Wait, hold on: are you suggesting that internet providers didn't lobby their state congresses to ban competing isps?
 
Gimmesometruth said:
Well that was your cue to say how the DEMS are actually the ones who have sold out to Big Business....just after saying how "hard" it is to buy off a politician.

I'm OK with your denial of the GOP being a stooge for Big Business.....because I know that is how you graze.
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I don't think either party is actually a stooge for big business. Mostly that's just small minded little partisan hacks demonizing the other party. The beauty of going through life clinging to the pseudo conspiracy-theory that the rich control everyone's lives is awesome for people that don't have the intellectual courage to acknowledge that their life is actually the sum of their decisions and actions. Much better to blame all our personal failures and shortcoming on a system where the rich hold everyone else back, control all the laws of the country and keep poor, helpless, people like yourself from being the superstars you know you would be if only the deck wasn't so stacked against you.

Losers need excuses for their failures and that has to be one of the most coveted loser excuses of all time in this country. "The rich man be keepin' me down". Seems to be the sweetheart excuse for every left wing pinko that isn't a limousine liberal.
 
iliveonramen said:
So you really just "liberals are big dummy heads". Gotcha. I think I'll stick with the view that large donations to political campaigns serve economic self interest.
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Not only do they do that, it's factual within this thread itself. It's why this thread and Obama's proposal exists. See posts 165 and 166.
 
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