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2 Albuquerque Officers Charged With Murder

Tettsuo said:
For the 4th time now - What would an autopsy say that'll change that?

'That' being the fact he was killed by gunshots as the title of the video says.
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Go back and read again. I cant be bothered rewriting what I've already answered.
 
Tettsuo said:
Intent isn't a stretch at all. They came out with way more hardware than needed for a vagrancy charge. Then, when the man was clearly giving up, they shot a flash-bang at him. They were clearly looking to escalate the situation.
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The guy was accused of robbing people, and had broken the nose of a female deputy.
They knew he could be violent.
Boyd, who police said may have been a paranoid schizophrenic, has a long criminal history.
In the past, he allegedly attacked people with knives, box cutters, and
his hands, and in 2010 broke a female officer's nose, according to
KOAT.
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LiveLeak.com - Police Shoot Homeless Man During Camping Arrest - **KILL HIM DEAD****
 
OrphanSlug said:
Does that mean the use of lethal force is the first and only option? (Because that is what happened.) If what you are saying is true then the defense for these officers just became more challenging.
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No, early in the day we did not know the guy had been shot,
it looked like they used the non lethal bean bag shells.
But they were not going up to arrest him for only vagrancy, there was more involved.
As to how much equipment to take, always bring more than you will need,
everyone hates to find out you need more than you have.
The fact that some of the group choose to use lethal force,
when they clearly had other options, will go hard for the police.
 
Tettsuo said:
What he did previously cannot validate their actions on that day.
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Of course someones previous actions could justify using lethal force.
or at least being prepared to do so.
it just depends on what those previous actions were.
When the police go to arrest a suspect, who has a history of violence,
and has shown little regard for the lives of others, it is safe for them to assume
the person may be violent.
In this case it went overboard, and some of the police used unwarranted lethal force.
I think the primary officer was already fired, and now may face criminal charges.
They appear to be valid charges in this case.
We do not need cowboy cops, but we also need to understand, we ask the police
to do an ugly job, and we need to allow them some flexibility in doing it.
 
longview said:
Of course someones previous actions could justify using lethal force.
or at least being prepared to do so.
it just depends on what those previous actions were.
When the police go to arrest a suspect, who has a history of violence,
and has shown little regard for the lives of others, it is safe for them to assume
the person may be violent.
In this case it went overboard, and some of the police used unwarranted lethal force.
I think the primary officer was already fired, and now may face criminal charges.
They appear to be valid charges in this case.
We do not need cowboy cops, but we also need to understand, we ask the police
to do an ugly job, and we need to allow them some flexibility in doing it.
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Going in prepared to confront a known violent individual is one thing. Going in with assault rifles, a dog, flash-bangs, beanbag rounds, riot gear and whatever else they were carrying is another.

Unless having a firearm, tazer and pepper-spray is no longer sufficient in subduing individuals.
 
Tettsuo said:
Going in prepared to confront a known violent individual is one thing. Going in with assault rifles, a dog, flash-bangs, beanbag rounds, riot gear and whatever else they were carrying is another.

Unless having a firearm, tazer and pepper-spray is no longer sufficient in subduing individuals.
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So they knew explicitly what weapons this guy had with him, when they walked up the hill.
I do not buy it. just because it got out of control, has no relation to how much equipment
they brought. They did not know what was waiting, and assumed the worst.
 
longview said:
So they knew explicitly what weapons this guy had with him, when they walked up the hill.
I do not buy it. just because it got out of control, has no relation to how much equipment
they brought. They did not know what was waiting, and assumed the worst.
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Your comment doesn't make any sense, unless you're suggesting that all cops should only come out battle armor, because they don't know who has what on them.

They're not responding to a guy wielding knives stabbing people at random, they're responding to a vagrancy charge.
 
Tettsuo said:
Going in prepared to confront a known violent individual is one thing. Going in with assault rifles, a dog, flash-bangs, beanbag rounds, riot gear and whatever else they were carrying is another.

Unless having a firearm, tazer and pepper-spray is no longer sufficient in subduing individuals.
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Well they are down on the border where they deal with entire secret camps of illegals and drug runners. That's probably the norm when they check things out...they dont know what they are going to find.
 
Tettsuo said:
They're not responding to a guy wielding knives stabbing people at random, they're responding to a vagrancy charge.
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Many vagrants are homeless because of mental illness. Naked crazy people have killed armed officers.

So they need to be prepared. I agree that it's a very difficult situation...to read and respond to. It's acknowleged that this is a really difficult area for cops and many depts are working on better education to read the signs better. But sometimes, lethal threat is a lethal threat, mentally ill or not.

In a similar case here a few yrs ago, after investigation, the officer was fired but they (considered but) ended up not bringing criminal charges.

I am not saying that lethal force was required, IMO, in the OP incident however.
 
FreedomFromAll said:
Dont be such a alarmist, That wasnt camping that place is a party spot where a bunch of people from El paso and Albuquerque show up and get into fights. At certain times of the year it has a bunch of wannabe spring break kids running around.

But yea this is a scary place be sure not to come here. lol
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Yeah, some people in New Mexico are definitely trigger happy and out of control.

New Mexico undercover cop shoots fellow officer in drug bust - NY Daily News
 
I hope they go down on this one. Happened not far from my house. Seems like every week there is another cop shooting here. APD needs to get their s*** together.
 
Tettsuo said:
Your comment doesn't make any sense, unless you're suggesting that all cops should only come out battle armor, because they don't know who has what on them.

They're not responding to a guy wielding knives stabbing people at random, they're responding to a vagrancy charge.
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If you read or watch the video (the most inditing portion of the comments before they went up the hill),
They knew they were not dealing with a nice guy.
The Police overreacted in this case, but you cannot fault their preparation,
They had no way of knowing how this guy was armed.
He could build a shotgun, for about $10 from parts at Home Depot,
not safe to shoot, but still very deadly.
 
longview said:
If you read or watch the video (the most inditing portion of the comments before they went up the hill),
They knew they were not dealing with a nice guy.
The Police overreacted in this case, but you cannot fault their preparation,
They had no way of knowing how this guy was armed.
He could build a shotgun, for about $10 from parts at Home Depot,
not safe to shoot, but still very deadly.
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That doesn't mean that cops get to shoot people willy-nilly. Murder may be a hard charge to prove. Less there is video of them talking about wanting to shoot and kill suspects, it would be difficult to prove intent. But then again, an average citizen who did the same would be charged with murder, so maybe the charges are inline.

Regardless, this sort of overreaction and trigger happy behavior is not acceptable from a supposedly civilian police force (though they are rather mitarized by this point), and we have to start punishing these acts. The days of brushing police crime under the rug needs to end. Protect the good cops, but the bad ones need to go to jail.
 
tres borrachos said:
Hmmm

The criminal charges were the first Brandenburg has brought against officers in a shooting. She is in her fourth term as district attorney and is waging a fight with the Albuquerque Police Department over allegations that she committed bribery while intervening on behalf of her son in a burglary case.

Police believe she should be charged with bribery because, they say, she offered to pay a victim not to press charges.

That's a bit of a wrinkle.
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I can see how the District Attorney can iron it out though. Bribery may be a difficult charge to press as the recepient od the money had no duty to press charges.

There is also the "out" of: "Hush money?- never! I just uhmm.... generously offered to reimburse the victims for the stolen property. Heck,who is to say how much that jewelery was worth- they said it was pretty expensive. Thankfully, they are also forgiving burglary victims..... "
 
505 said:
I hope they go down on this one. Happened not far from my house. Seems like every week there is another cop shooting here. APD needs to get their s*** together.
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I am sure any cop in jail is a good thing for you.
Notice the DA, a democrat, did an end around and didn't present to a grand jury. Mistake.
 
CRUE CAB said:
I am sure any cop in jail is a good thing for you.
Notice the DA, a democrat, did an end around and didn't present to a grand jury. Mistake.
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Bad cops in jail are a good thing for us all.
 
CRUE CAB said:
I am sure any cop in jail is a good thing for you.
Notice the DA, a democrat, did an end around and didn't present to a grand jury. Mistake.
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The DA doesnt have to go to a grand jury if they have a good case to start with. At anyrate a judge still has to decide if the case is good enough for the charges of murder. I think that it will be tried as manslaughter because it would be difficult to try murder. But we havent seen the evidence the DA has other than the video and the limited statements by the police.

I do know that if the DA's case is criticized as being unwarranted it will probably be the end of her career. So she is going to fight hard on this one.
 
FreedomFromAll said:
Yea I saw that on the local news, its one of those things that make you ask: WTF? And last night the albuquerque cops shot someone else. Though this one sounds very justified. APD fatally shoots man during chase | Albuquerque Journal News

But its probably from all that blue meth lol
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Oh man, my city is about the same with the WTF?

I believe it was last summer in my city, cops shot some guy 45 times because he wouldn't drop a knife, and before that, they shot some man 30 times, one of the family's members settled for $1.75 million dollars (out of court)

Instead of pepper spray, instead of stun gun, instead of nightstick, they seem always having to shoot first.
Then that cop in Milwaukee they fired for not following PPP, who shot Dontre Hamilton multiple times, even after two cops did a welfare check on Hamilton, and let him go.

I'd heard about that shooting there in Duke city on the internet, but couldn't find any news reporting on it.
 
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