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Most of America’s rich think the poor have it easy

Grant said:
There's probably stats to cover this situation but it seems to me that many who were raised in poor families have managed to work their way up in the world if they educate themselves and work hard. Instead of sports or celebrities learn about investments in real estate, stocks, metals, and so on. Figure out what people need and give it to them. There's always room for another entrepreneur who is willing to give someone the best value for their dollar.
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There have been lots of studies on this. The basics are that most poor people will always be poor and most rich people will never be worse than middle class. It is often referred to as "stickiness" at the ends of the spectrum. Interesting though, most of the wealthy family wealth dissipates quickly over a few generations.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
I worked from age 15 on. Worked 2 jobs when I was young until I went into IT. Frankly though, I am a pretty smart guy and I have an aptitude for IT. When you are poor you not only have to be smart and have a good work ethic to succeed, you have to be smarter and work harder than those that had everything handed to them in life. Climbing out of poverty isn't possible for everyone these days. Most good careers these days require you to be pretty smart and not everyone is cut out for IT, engineering, or good paying medical fields.
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I've had many of jobs but never a career. I'm an entrepreneur and only mildly successful BUT I am my own boss. There are always opportunities for entrepreneurs and if i wasn't so damn lazy, or needed the money, I'd be out there right now giving it a go. And I've discovered that there are many people are always willing to help those who want to get ahead in this world.
 
Declan said:
There have been lots of studies on this. The basics are that most poor people will always be poor and most rich people will never be worse than middle class. It is often referred to as "stickiness" at the ends of the spectrum. Interesting though, most of the wealthy family wealth dissipates quickly over a few generations.
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Perhaps that's true for the very poor but it's not that difficult for the lower middle to rise to the upper middle, or beyond. That's the story for many of us. And I would have once been quite happy to rise to middle class, as would have many others. Not such a bad place to be at all.
 
Grant said:
Perhaps that's true for the very poor but it's not that difficult for the lower middle to rise to the upper middle, or beyond. That's the story for many of us. And I would have once been quite happy to rise to middle class, as would have many others. Not such a bad place to be at all.
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It is all relative in the end. Where I live the cost of living is lower, so someone making $25K a year will live comparable to someone making $40K elsewhere. The only difference is that the iPhone purchase has a greater opportunity cost for the $25K worker than it will for the $40K worker.
 
Grant said:
Compulsory charity? There really is no such thing.
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It's a stretch on the definitions for the giver, admittedly, but the outcome is the same, if not better, for the recipient.
 
Unrepresented said:
It's a stretch on the definitions for the giver, admittedly, but the outcome is the same, if not better, for the recipient.
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Stretch? Here is reality. Charity is reaching into your own pocket to pull out money you then give away to someone you consider needy. Reaching into someone else's pocket for the money isn't charity. It's theft.
 
Papa bull said:
Stretch? Here is reality. Charity is reaching into your own pocket to pull out money you then give away to someone you consider needy. Reaching into someone else's pocket for the money isn't charity. It's theft.
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We have different definitions of who has rightful ownership of the respective pockets.
 
Unrepresented said:
We have different definitions of who has rightful ownership of the respective pockets.
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I won't argue with that. I've seen how liberals think enough to know that respect for other peoples' property rights isn't much of a concern for them.
 
Papa bull said:
I won't argue with that. I've seen how liberals think enough to know that respect for other peoples' property rights isn't much of a concern for them.
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Coincidentally, I've seen conservatives take full credit for accomplishments that are products of society and refuse to pay it forward.
 
Unrepresented said:
Coincidentally, I've seen conservatives take full credit for accomplishments that are products of society and refuse to pay it forward.
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Yeah? Tell me all about it, why don't you? Tell me about a few of them you've seen.
 
Unrepresented said:
Coincidentally, I've seen conservatives take full credit for accomplishments that are products of society and refuse to pay it forward.
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the old "you didnt build that" argument

well....i dont agree with that statement anymore now, than i did when the president opened his mouth and said it the first time

most politicians dont have a ****ing clue as to what it takes to build a successful business, and to thrive in a competitive marketplace

on EITHER side of the aisle

most of them have never done anything other than politics, or law, or lobbying

building a business from the ground up, and making it successful is very very hard

the failure rate of new businesses in the US is approximately 80% as this article states

Five Reasons 8 Out Of 10 Businesses Fail - Forbes
 
Papa bull said:
Yeah? Tell me all about it, why don't you? Tell me about a few of them you've seen.
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I have a feeling I may be discussing this with one of them.

gdgyva said:
the old "you didnt build that" argument

well....i dont agree with that statement anymore now, than i did when the president opened his mouth and said it the first time

most politicians dont have a ****ing clue as to what it takes to build a successful business, and to thrive in a competitive marketplace

on EITHER side of the aisle

most of them have never done anything other than politics, or law, or lobbying

building a business from the ground up, and making it successful is very very hard
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The percentage of failures doesn't really negate the argument that it's a communal product, dependent on society to exist, let alone succeed.
j-mac said:
Wait....What the? Who has ownership of MY pocket?
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Everyone, to a degree. "Ownership" is an incredibly subjective issue.
 
Grant said:
You can see poverty to the south in Mexico and wealth to the north in Canada and we can ask ourselves why this is so. Why such poverty in Tijuana and such wealth in San Diego? We know that many Mexicans work very hard, as do many Latin Americans, but they usually stay mired in the same conditions in which they were born. Corruption is a factor, as is culture and the laws. Were more countries to adopt the US Constitution with the Bill of Rights, and laws to protect free enterprise, they may do a lot better in this world. But it's doubtful that even the American people would pass these two acts today.
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Harvard did a study, years ago and noted that in the middle ages, property rights were the main spur to growth within Europe.
Rule of law, free from corruption, educated work force, infrastructure does spur growth.
 
JANFU said:
Harvard did a study, years ago and noted that in the middle ages, property rights were the main spur to growth within Europe.
Rule of law, free from corruption, educated work force, infrastructure does spur growth.
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There is lots of research that confirms that.
 
Papa bull said:
Again to thieves but not to honest people. What a coincidence, huh!?
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We're apparently adding "honest people" to the list of subjective things too. When will this list end?!
 
JANFU said:
Harvard did a study, years ago and noted that in the middle ages, property rights were the main spur to growth within Europe. Rule of law, free from corruption, educated work force, infrastructure does spur growth.
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Yes, property rights is largely the reason why North American did so well and Central and South America did so poorly by comparison. This was covered in an excellent series by Niall Ferguson called "Civilization". Civilization: The West and the Rest with Niall Ferguson | PBS
 
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