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Gitmo inmate: My treatment shames American flag [W:508,759]

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That is false...Although I know how you liberals take the NYTimes as Gospel itself, they lied here:

"The New York Times reported last week that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the alleged mastermind of the Sept. 11 terror attacks, was waterboarded 183 times in one month by CIA interrogators. The "183 times" was widely circulated by news outlets throughout the world.

It was shocking. And it was highly misleading. The number is a vast inflation, according to information from a U.S. official and the testimony of the terrorists themselves.

A U.S. official with knowledge of the interrogation program told FOX News that the much-cited figure represents the number of times water was poured onto Mohammed's face -- not the number of times the CIA applied the simulated-drowning technique on the terror suspect. According to a 2007 Red Cross report, he was subjected a total of "five sessions of ill-treatment."

Despite Reports, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed Was Not Waterboarded 183 Times | Fox News



They were effective enough that KSM started giving classes to CIA after he was, as he put it, freed from his obligation to remain silent....

If waterboarding is that horrible (I don't know, I've never been waterboarded), it's hard to believe it took 180+ times to get him to talk. I'd only have to be tortured once to talk.
 
Yes MMC's comments did make sense. He was talking about the PC on steroids promoted on the left side of the aisle that has resulted in some folks not looking at things clearly. Not enough were willing to speak out against it and now we have a bunch of folks sympathizing with the enemy.

We are seeing the media being used as a propaganda machine to promote it. We are seeing Democrats through their decision to release the damn report comprised of third party persons that is putting our allies, and people who work for the CIA and our informants at risk. Even though Democrats almost unanimously supported the forms being used by the CIA through 39 friggin meetings where they were informed of the procedures they were being used on a limited number of detainees. Now all of a sudden Feinstein has a problem but didn't during all 39 briefings. In fact several Democrats words at the time were "do whatever it takes". Feinstein and other Democrats also have no problem using drones to target these terrorists which often kills a lot of innocent people along with our on the ground intelligent iinformers.

And this OP along with this new found decision to release the report while they do a kabookie dance unable to justify their own previous support is occurring while Obama just released more Gitmo prisoners and the media failed to cover it.

Hello Huston we have a problem, and it isn't the CIA.

I stopped reading at "PC."
 
No, but at some point, say after waterboard #73, a reasonable person might conclude that the process isn't working with this guy.
Maybe try a different tack?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't KSM waterboarded several years after his capture?
What vital info would he be able to divulge at that point in time?

1. he wasn't waterboarded 183 seperate times
2. What different tack would you have tried?
3. The vital info he gave was a name that led ultimately to the death of OBL....Pretty useful I'd say.
 
If waterboarding is that horrible (I don't know, I've never been waterboarded), it's hard to believe it took 180+ times to get him to talk. I'd only have to be tortured once to talk.

Sorry, I thought that was someone else.

On point, I will say, I don't know if I consider waterboarding to be "torture"... But, I think it comes close enough to the line as to make it not preferable to use...That said, in extraordinary circumstances, all bets are off...
 
I wonder how many would put that to a test with one of their family members. After they were kidnapped and tortured.

Interesting.. So you can't answer the question. I'll ask it again, it's pretty simple.


Why did the propagandists in WWII try to convince their own troops that the enemy would abuse and torture prisoners; and why did those same propagandists try to convince enemy troops that they would be well treated as prisoners?
 
Interesting.. So you can't answer the question. I'll ask it again, it's pretty simple.


Why did the propagandists in WWII try to convince their own troops that the enemy would abuse and torture prisoners; and why did those same propagandists try to convince enemy troops that they would be well treated as prisoners?


I don't know..... Why did they do this. Lets here your take on this ****.
 
Interesting.. So you can't answer the question. I'll ask it again, it's pretty simple.


Why did the propagandists in WWII try to convince their own troops that the enemy would abuse and torture prisoners; and why did those same propagandists try to convince enemy troops that they would be well treated as prisoners?

Your question answers itself....It's a tactic...But, are you saying that AQ, or ISIS are equal to soldiers captured in WWII?
 
Sorry, I thought that was someone else.

On point, I will say, I don't know if I consider waterboarding to be "torture"... But, I think it comes close enough to the line as to make it not preferable to use...That said, in extraordinary circumstances, all bets are off...

I have no opinion either way (is it torture or not). And I was never waterboarded so I don't have any personal experience. I just know if something was so horrible that it's called torture, I can't imagine any human willingly going along with it over 180 times, and I would suspect that he was told that if he sang like a canary, the torture would stop.

Interesting.
 
Golly....thanks!





Well, I know how you cons take Fox News as gospel, but their rebuttal seems to state that KSM was subjected to "waterboard lite" instead of the real deal.:shrug:




They were effective enough that KSM started giving classes to CIA after he was, as he put it, freed from his obligation to remain silent....
Do tell.
If I read this right, KSM is now a CIA asset?
Strange bedfellows, eh?.....or maybe not so strange.
Amazing that this putz KSM is still alive.
 
I have no opinion either way (is it torture or not). And I was never waterboarded so I don't have any personal experience. I just know if something was so horrible that it's called torture, I can't imagine any human willingly going along with it over 180 times, and I would suspect that he was told that if he sang like a canary, the torture would stop.

Interesting.

He wasn't waterboarded 180 separate times....It was 5 sessions, and the NYTimes that tried to push this false narrative to make the CIA look like monsters, counted every time during a session that water was spilled in the room.

For instance, a session could include pouring water on him say 20 times, they count that as 20 seperate waterboardings...It is false.
 
Wasn't it KSM who provided the information on the compound that enabled the Seals to go in and capture Bin Laden?
Hey, tres.
I've heard this stated and I've heard it debunked.
Since KSM was captured in 2003, I'm not understanding what info he could have given that led to Bin Laden in 2011.
 
Golly....thanks!






Well, I know how you cons take Fox News as gospel, but their rebuttal seems to state that KSM was subjected to "waterboard lite" instead of the real deal.:shrug:





Do tell.
If I read this right, KSM is now a CIA asset?
Strange bedfellows, eh?.....or maybe not so strange.
Amazing that this putz KSM is still alive.

*Sigh*

1. This was well known in 2009....Tell me why you haven't caught up....?
2. KSM is reported to have thanked his interrogators, for "Releasing him from his obligation to remain silent." Further, he is reported to have also told them "They should do this to all the brothers to ease their suffering in that respect."
 
Hey, tres.
I've heard this stated and I've heard it debunked.
Since KSM was captured in 2003, I'm not understanding what info he could have given that led to Bin Laden in 2011.

Heya Radioman. :2wave: Didn't CIA say that the information led to the courier and from there they were able to set him up for the take down?
 
Hey, tres.
I've heard this stated and I've heard it debunked.
Since KSM was captured in 2003, I'm not understanding what info he could have given that led to Bin Laden in 2011.

Happy Friday radio!

I heard quite a few times on both MSNBC and Fox that he (KSM) eventually cracked and gave the information that was missing - and needed - to find OBL. They could be wrong, I don't know but it's said a lot.
 
I stopped reading at "PC."

:lol: Doesn't surprise me one bit! Cause you are a Political Correct kind of guy! It's the ideology that has taken over America goes most commonly by the name of “Political Correctness.” Some people see it as a joke. It is not. It is deadly serious. It seeks to alter virtually all the rules, formal and informal, that govern relations among people and institutions. It wants to change behavior, thought, even the words we use. To a significant extent, it already has. Whoever or whatever controls language also controls thought. Nuff said.
 
:lol: Doesn't surprise me one bit! Cause you are a Political Correct kind of guy! It's the ideology that has taken over America goes most commonly by the name of “Political Correctness.” Some people see it as a joke. It is not. It is deadly serious. It seeks to alter virtually all the rules, formal and informal, that govern relations among people and institutions. It wants to change behavior, thought, even the words we use. To a significant extent, it already has. Whoever or whatever controls language also controls thought. Nuff said.

Okay.
 
Heya Radioman. :2wave: Didn't CIA say that the information led to the courier and from there they were able to set him up for the take down?
Hey MMC.
The CIA says lots of things.
Like any gov't bureaucracy, they divulge info---maybe true, maybe not--- and spin that info to make themselves look good.
 
Hey MMC.
The CIA says lots of things.
Like any gov't bureaucracy, they divulge info---maybe true, maybe not--- and spin that info to make themselves look good.

That may be true.....but what about the Navy Seals, Gates and the Pakistani with their statements, and actions with the matter? Wherein they spoke of certain elements or where they got the info. Then what about the Pakistani denying and arresting those that were involved.
 
Hey MMC.
The CIA says lots of things.
Like any gov't bureaucracy, they divulge info---maybe true, maybe not--- and spin that info to make themselves look good.

So why wouldn't that line of thinking apply to Feinstein's little fairy tale here? Seems your belief is situational.
 
I don't know..... Why did they do this. Lets here your take on this ****.

Somehow I'm not convinced that your ignorance is fully honest.

But I'll play along. Combatants will fight harder if they believe that they will be tortured if they are captured, and will surrender easier if they believe they will be well cared for. Obviously you know this, because it's something a 5 year old could figure out.

Which of course is why someone like John McCain would be against torture. Torture always results in a net negative for the side that does it.

And also, lets stop pretending that anyone cares about the effectiveness or the ethics of torture. This isn't about intelligence, it's about revenge. If there were a painless truth drug that made a suspect give up every shred of information, the same people demanding torture now would still support torture. And what's worse, these same people would support it without being able to actually go through with it themselves. I find it hard to respect that.
 
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