Philly Mayor: ‘You Have Some Police Officers Who Are Increasingly Afraid...."

http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2014/12...who-are-increasingly-afraid-of-the-community/

“You in essence have the citizens who want to be protected who are now are increasingly afraid of the police and you have some police officers who are increasingly afraid of the community,” the mayor said “There is a large gap in that context, so it is about training. People need the police to protect them.”

Nutter added, “I support my police officers back in Philadelphia. This is a dangerous job. They interact with really bad people.

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This discussion hints at the REAL source of the problem, which CNN and the msm wouldn't dare touch with a 10-foot pole.

Is this an issue about trusting the police, or is this about resentment for repeatedly getting caught by the police? Do many of these folks want better police enforcement, or do they want no police enforcement? It smells of "my teacher hates me."

We're headed for a situation where cops will refuse to police these neighborhoods altogether for fear of being singled out like the Ferguson police officer. Rough areas will be left to fend for themselves.

That, or black officer will be assigned to black neighborhoods, and whites to white neighborhoods. How racially divided does that sound?

Erod said:

Philly Mayor: ‘You Have Some Police Officers Who Are Increasingly Afraid Of The Community’ « CBS St. Louis



This discussion hints at the REAL source of the problem, which CNN and the msm wouldn't dare touch with a 10-foot pole.

Is this an issue about trusting the police, or is this about resentment for repeatedly getting caught by the police? Do many of these folks want better police enforcement, or do they want no police enforcement? It smells of "my teacher hates me."

We're headed for a situation where cops will refuse to police these neighborhoods altogether for fear of being singled out like the Ferguson police officer. Rough areas will be left to fend for themselves.

That, or black officer will be assigned to black neighborhoods, and whites to white neighborhoods. How racially divided does that sound?

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:shrug:

I don't need the police to protect me, so I'm kind of indifferent.

Goshin said:

:shrug:

I don't need the police to protect me, so I'm kind of indifferent.

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I suspect you don't live in Ferguson.

Erod said:

Philly Mayor: ‘You Have Some Police Officers Who Are Increasingly Afraid Of The Community’ « CBS St. Louis



This discussion hints at the REAL source of the problem, which CNN and the msm wouldn't dare touch with a 10-foot pole.

Is this an issue about trusting the police, or is this about resentment for repeatedly getting caught by the police? Do many of these folks want better police enforcement, or do they want no police enforcement? It smells of "my teacher hates me."

We're headed for a situation where cops will refuse to police these neighborhoods altogether for fear of being singled out like the Ferguson police officer. Rough areas will be left to fend for themselves.

That, or black officer will be assigned to black neighborhoods, and whites to white neighborhoods. How racially divided does that sound?

Click to expand...

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

Erod said:

Philly Mayor: ‘You Have Some Police Officers Who Are Increasingly Afraid Of The Community’ « CBS St. Louis



This discussion hints at the REAL source of the problem, which CNN and the msm wouldn't dare touch with a 10-foot pole.

Is this an issue about trusting the police, or is this about resentment for repeatedly getting caught by the police? Do many of these folks want better police enforcement, or do they want no police enforcement? It smells of "my teacher hates me."

We're headed for a situation where cops will refuse to police these neighborhoods altogether for fear of being singled out like the Ferguson police officer. Rough areas will be left to fend for themselves.

That, or black officer will be assigned to black neighborhoods, and whites to white neighborhoods. How racially divided does that sound?

Click to expand...

What would be wrong with assigning black officers to black neighborhoods? We've been preached to that, "OMG!!! That's raaacist!" if they're white officers in a black neighborhood. And, if we were to assign black officers to black neighborhoods? We'd be hearing, "OMG!!! That's raaacist!"

I don't think we fully understand what happens to officers who are hit with the charges that Ferguson's cop was hit with. Their lives are ruined.

If black neighborhoods don't trust white cops? Don't put white cops in the street.

I've been watching COPS this morning while on computer. Almost every single arrest, white or black, the perp is yelling, "I can't breath! OMG! I have allergies! I have a back injury! You're killin' me, man!" Saw one guy (white) get arrested after a foot chase and being tased that, when escorted in cuffs to the patrol car for transport, banged his head against the roof of the squad car hard enough that he could've knocked himself out. Just a little insurance, I'd imagine. Apparently he was too stupid to know there were two TV cameras pointed at him at the time.

It's a huge problem. I don't know the solution. But I wouldn't be a cop today for nuthin'.

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

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That cant happen until we get rid of those unions

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

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The point is, a very high percentage of that 98 percent don't want anything to do with patrolling Ferguson for fear of what will happen if they have to shoot a black suspect.

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

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What about the neighborhoods where crime is rampant? Shouldn't the "98%" of the good people in those neighborhoods get rid of the bad crooks in their neighborhood instead of adhering to THEIR code of silence - not ratting out people?

It's a two way street. People can't demand police protection and then get all up in arms when bad people are shot for attacking, not complying with orders to lay down and instead charge a police officer - or in the NYC case, not complying and getting tackled when they know they have medical issues that would put them in danger.

Cops can't be held to higher standard than the average citizen, when the average citizen is armed just like the cops, and has a protective system around them where the majority of people in the neighborhood will not help the police and point out the bad guys. Both should be held to the law. As of right now, only cops are being attacked and accused of not being held to the law - which is not true.

If the neighborhoods would point and say "there he is... that's the guy" then cops wouldn't have to profile, because they would know EXACTLY who to go after. As it is now, the cops have to suspect anyone that fits a number of profiles for a potential criminal.

Want to stop the profiling? Stop the protection of criminals by the law abiding good people. Until then, with cops getting drug before Grand Juries or being charged by prosecutors because of civilian outrage when they are just doing their job protecting us, the cops may just let those in the crime riddled areas just fend for themselves - they want to protect the bad guys and refuse to point them out, then learn to live with them without police protection.

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

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You make that sound really easy but most abusive practices are subtle and defensible. What do you do when your partner bounces some asshole's head off the pavement? He says that the suspect tried to escape and tripped so what are you left with? It becomes a he said/he said situation with no upside for you. Beside that, what you might consider to be excessive could easily be considered to be necessary for someone else. Just because you have mad ninja skills and can sweet talk a PCP freak into a civilized game of chess doesn't mean that everyone else can.

In my experience the cops that complain most about their fellow cops abusing their authority are the ones who simply don't have the emotional capacity to do the job. There are, no doubt, some "war heroes" that cause more trouble than they stop but they generally don't last too long.

Erod said:

I suspect you don't live in Ferguson.

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Nope, I do not live in Ferguson, where police and national guard failed to prevent the looting and arson of dozens of local businesses.



Lots of black folks around here though. They have enough sense not to riot and burn stuff down, however.


Granted, it was an off the cuff remark and meant to be a bit spikey. The police are somewhat useful sometimes, but I do not and never have depended on them to protect me. SCOTUS has determined that they are not responsible for my protection, you know.

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

Click to expand...

Well, there is not only the code of silence, but there are the Police Unions which have a great say in how officers are dealt with. Both areas need to be addressed in order to weed out the officers who shouldn't be on the force. Of course, all this pales in comparison the main issue that people don't want to focus on. Citizen on citizen crime in these communities.

As Charles Barkley said, the police are the only ones keeping these communities from turning into the wild west. Until the citizen rise up and clean up their own mess, this merry-go-round will continue into the foreseeable future.

Erod said:

The point is, a very high percentage of that 98 percent don't want anything to do with patrolling Ferguson for fear of what will happen if they have to shoot a black suspect.

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The reality is that they have brought a lot of that on themselves. People would have more respect for the police if the bad cops weren't ruining it for the good ones.

I think this guy is a Nutter.

disneydude said:

The reality is that they have brought a lot of that on themselves. People would have more respect for the police if the bad cops weren't ruining it for the good ones.

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...and lawyers, and doctors, and politicians, and mechanics, and used car salesmen, etc.

Lutherf said:

In my experience the cops that complain most about their fellow cops abusing their authority are the ones who simply don't have the emotional capacity to do the job. There are, no doubt, some "war heroes" that cause more trouble than they stop but they generally don't last too long.

Click to expand...

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence.

Click to expand...

Erod said:

The point is, a very high percentage of that 98 percent don't want anything to do with patrolling Ferguson for fear of what will happen if they have to shoot a black suspect.

Click to expand...

In the NYPD 5% of cops produce 40% of the "resisting arrest" charges; while 15% of their cops produce 72% of the "resisting arrest" charges.

5% of New York cops turn in 40% of "resisting arrest" cases - Vox

If Philly or other cities are reflective of the NYPD's stastitics, it would seem to me there is a small minority of cops who -- somehow -- manage to constantly produce violent interactions with criminals everywhere they go, while another 85% don't seem to have such a problem. Meaning that I heavily suspect that, no, the REAL source of the problem has much more to do with personnel more than anything else.

brothern said:

In the NYPD 5% of cops produce 40% of the "resisting arrest" charges; while 15% of their cops produce 72% of the "resisting arrest" charges.

5% of New York cops turn in 40% of "resisting arrest" cases - Vox

If Philly or other cities are reflective of the NYPD's stastitics, it would seem to me there is a small minority of cops who -- somehow -- manage to constantly produce violent interactions with criminals everywhere they go, while another 85% don't seem to have such a problem. Meaning that I heavily suspect that, no, the REAL source of the problem has to do with personnel more than anything else.

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I figure those percentages are about right. There are definitely some cops who are in it for the "authority" but, as I said, they usually don't last. Nobody wants to partner with the guy who is going to get you targeted either by the bad guys or by the administration.

Erod said:

Philly Mayor: ‘You Have Some Police Officers Who Are Increasingly Afraid Of The Community’ « CBS St. Louis



This discussion hints at the REAL source of the problem, which CNN and the msm wouldn't dare touch with a 10-foot pole.

Is this an issue about trusting the police, or is this about resentment for repeatedly getting caught by the police? Do many of these folks want better police enforcement, or do they want no police enforcement? It smells of "my teacher hates me."

We're headed for a situation where cops will refuse to police these neighborhoods altogether for fear of being singled out like the Ferguson police officer. Rough areas will be left to fend for themselves.

That, or black officer will be assigned to black neighborhoods, and whites to white neighborhoods. How racially divided does that sound?

Click to expand...

What one will end up with is a whole city like Detroit---where most good people have fled, and the survivors live in fear. Shoddy or non-exsistant police. A broken fire department.

From there, whole areas will become crapholes---like Mexico, Haiti, Lybia, Nigeria and so forth.

MaggieD said:

What would be wrong with assigning black officers to black neighborhoods? We've been preached to that, "OMG!!! That's raaacist!" if they're white officers in a black neighborhood. And, if we were to assign black officers to black neighborhoods? We'd be hearing, "OMG!!! That's raaacist!"

I don't think we fully understand what happens to officers who are hit with the charges that Ferguson's cop was hit with. Their lives are ruined.

If black neighborhoods don't trust white cops? Don't put white cops in the street.

I've been watching COPS this morning while on computer. Almost every single arrest, white or black, the perp is yelling, "I can't breath! OMG! I have allergies! I have a back injury! You're killin' me, man!" Saw one guy (white) get arrested after a foot chase and being tased that, when escorted in cuffs to the patrol car for transport, banged his head against the roof of the squad car hard enough that he could've knocked himself out. Just a little insurance, I'd imagine. Apparently he was too stupid to know there were two TV cameras pointed at him at the time.

It's a huge problem. I don't know the solution. But I wouldn't be a cop today for nuthin'.

Click to expand...

Part of the issue comes into play that there just aren't a lot of black police officers. Sure big cities like NY and LA can afford to outsource and recruit nationwide, but for everyone else, you kind of have to deal with the police force your able to put out. And do we really want a society where we're segregating out police forces? What happens when a call comes in and your black officer isn't available? Does no one answer it?

disneydude said:

What needs to happen is for the good cops (the 98% of cops out there) to start weeding out the bad apples rather than adhering to the code of silence. The bad cops make it harder for the good cops to do their job as the community loses faith in the police department and loses respect for the department. If the good cops would help get rid of the bad ones they would be improving their own quality of life, but sadly the code of silence is strong.

Click to expand...

Darren Wilson is a good cop.

disneydude said:

The reality is that they have brought a lot of that on themselves. People would have more respect for the police if the bad cops weren't ruining it for the good ones.

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But a lot of this has nothing to do what. I mean if you listen to people like Sharpton, they'll tell you it's about race, and that the cops are just racist. And when you have communities that believe such, their not willing to work with the police force. Hell, there's a lto of good white cops, but for the average black, just think of him as some racist white cop coming into the neighborhood.

ocean515 said:

Well, there is not only the code of silence, but there are the Police Unions which have a great say in how officers are dealt with. Both areas need to be addressed in order to weed out the officers who shouldn't be on the force. Of course, all this pales in comparison the main issue that people don't want to focus on. Citizen on citizen crime in these communities.

As Charles Barkley said, the police are the only ones keeping these communities from turning into the wild west. Until the citizen rise up and clean up their own mess, this merry-go-round will continue into the foreseeable future.

Click to expand...

Speaking of which, is it just me, or has the unions been incredibly silent throughout all this? Shouldn't they be standing up for these cops and speaking out?

MaggieD said:

What would be wrong with assigning black officers to black neighborhoods? We've been preached to that, "OMG!!! That's raaacist!" if they're white officers in a black neighborhood. And, if we were to assign black officers to black neighborhoods? We'd be hearing, "OMG!!! That's raaacist!"

I don't think we fully understand what happens to officers who are hit with the charges that Ferguson's cop was hit with. Their lives are ruined.

If black neighborhoods don't trust white cops? Don't put white cops in the street.

I've been watching COPS this morning while on computer. Almost every single arrest, white or black, the perp is yelling, "I can't breath! OMG! I have allergies! I have a back injury! You're killin' me, man!" Saw one guy (white) get arrested after a foot chase and being tased that, when escorted in cuffs to the patrol car for transport, banged his head against the roof of the squad car hard enough that he could've knocked himself out. Just a little insurance, I'd imagine. Apparently he was too stupid to know there were two TV cameras pointed at him at the time.

It's a huge problem. I don't know the solution. But I wouldn't be a cop today for nuthin'.

Click to expand...

What if I am a white cop and I want to work in primarily black communities? What if I am a black cop and I want to work in primarily white communities? Why would I want to be assigned duty based on the color of my skin? If black cops work exclusively in black communities, why would then not want black supervisors and why would black supervisors not want a black chief? The overarching question is why do we still have separate black and white communities?

Flamethrower said:

What one will end up with is a whole city like Detroit---where most good people have fled, and the survivors live in fear. Shoddy or non-exsistant police. A broken fire department.

From there, whole areas will become crapholes---like Mexico, Haiti, Lybia, Nigeria and so forth.

Click to expand...

Parts of our major cities are already like that.
The question is, why does anyone stay in a place that is unsafe, where the cops can't be trusted, where the whole area is under the control of violent gangs?

MaggieD said:

I don't think we fully understand what happens to officers who are hit with the charges that Ferguson's cop was hit with. Their lives are ruined.

Click to expand...

I fully understand what happens to officers who are "hit with charges". More than 99% of the time, "exactly nothing". More than 99% of the time, they are not only not indicted for anything, they are not disciplined in any way

Hamster Buddha said:

Speaking of which, is it just me, or has the unions been incredibly silent throughout all this? Shouldn't they be standing up for these cops and speaking out?

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Good point. Seems to me they usually lay very low in most matters.