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No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

joko104 said:
Can you imagine that defense otherwise?

4 men. One surprises a man by jumping on this back from behind in a chock hold - as 2, the 3 more men shove him to the concrete. The chock hold continues, another man put most his body weight pressing his head against the concrete, and still another on his back - as the man begs "I can't breathe. I can't breathe."

All on video. The men arrested for assault.

And the defense attorney says: "Your honor, by the video itself clearly my clients weren't trying to hurt him."

Yeah, you can do that to anyone. Jump anyone from behind in a chock hold and you and your buddies throw that person to the concrete - because its not like you're hurting the person. :lol:

The cop groupies/worshippers messages always become this bizarre.
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You're forgetting that cops play by different rules. They can not only assault you, but kidnap you.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Henrin said:
It's your story dude. I'm just reporting on who your buddies are.
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I do indeed know prison guards. And cops. Its cute you think they are rapists. Or maybe thats where your fantasy mind goes. Either way...just be sure when you exercise your false bravado and resist arrest that someone is filming it. And who knows...maybe hif someone slips you the nightstick, you will have something extra for your private film stash.

Oh...listen...I know this is all just crazy talk. At the end of the day, I highly doubt you are subject to being arrested any time soon (which is why you can talk BIG ****) and if you were arrested you would go along mewling about your 'rights' but you would go along quietly just the same because while you talk a good game...you arent stupid. We both know that. SO...can we dispense with the tough talk and all the other assorted bull****?
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Peter Grimm said:
Some people just don't get how the rule of law works. You don't get to resist arrest, no matter how petty the crime. You submit to the arresting officer because that's what the law requires you to do.

If you get injured or killed trying to resist arrest, that's on you and nobody else. The cop shouldn't have to put himself in danger because you're being a dumbass.
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I was not aware that the penalty for "resisting arrest," which this guy barely did and no police were in danger in any way, was death.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

tres borrachos said:
Interesting questions.

If an 18 year olds tosses something off a highway overpass in front of a car and it causes the driver to be startled and have a heart attack is he charged with murder?
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Yes, most likely, or at least manslaughter.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

VanceMack said:
I do indeed know prison guards. And cops. Its cute you think they are rapists. Or maybe thats where your fantasy mind goes. Either way...just be sure when you exercise your false bravado and resist arrest that someone is filming it. And who knows...maybe hif someone slips you the nightstick, you will have something extra for your private film stash.

Oh...listen...I know this is all just crazy talk. At the end of the day, I highly doubt you are subject to being arrested any time soon (which is why you can talk BIG ****) and if you were arrested you would go along mewling about your 'rights' but you would go along quietly just the same because while you talk a good game...you arent stupid. We both know that. SO...can we dispense with the tough talk and all the other assorted bull****?
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I wasn't the one talking big. Maybe you should review your own posts dude.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

joko104 said:
The chock hold continues, another man put most his body weight pressing his head against the concrete
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Thats fascinating. Please tell us how the same guy that applied the hold to take the man down was simultaneously pressing his head against the concrete. (whaaaaaaaaat? Oops...its the SAME GUY.....)
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Henrin said:
I wasn't the one talking big. Maybe you should review your own posts dude.
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SURE you werent. :lamo
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

beefheart said:
You want to justify the killing of someone over something so freaking petty.

You are using obesity as your cognitive dissonance. You are the one blood dancing here and praising the actions of an overactive police using deadly force for a silly thing that should be no more than a summons.

Sounds like you are the one licking the jackboots.
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Yet Misterveritis dares brand those who disagree with him "statists."
 
Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

Misterveritis said:
What you are saying is that emotion trumps logic.

EVeryone "feels" that something wrong occurred. So, therefore it must have.

But the grand jury who reviewed the evidence for a crime found there to be insufficient evidence to charge anyone with a crime. And that is justice.

To deny that is to invite tyrants into our homes.
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To say that a grand jury reached an erroneous decision that seems to fly in the face of available evidence is to "invite tyranny into our homes"?
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

VanceMack said:
SURE you werent. :lamo
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Lets review.

Henrin said:
You need to understand that to some people it's the law and you have to do what the law says is a very powerful argument. Therefore, if the law says you did something wrong and you don't act like a submissive little sheep you're being out of line and force is called for to get you to behave. It's the circle of logic that is necessary to really believe in any of this stuff really and it's one of the reasons I no longer do.
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Henrin said:
You're not impressing me right now.
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VanceMack said:
Not even remotely trying to impress you. Hell...you were the one spewing your mock bravado. I want you to make sure if you ever are in a situation where you are going to resist arrest, please make sure you have someone film it and post it for us...okay?
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Henrin said:
Being part of a gang that is assaulting someone doesn't make you a man. It makes you a thug and an idiot.
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VanceMack said:
Alrighty then.

But hey...I'm serious about that video thing, OK?
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Henrin said:
Just call your gang of idiots. Aren't you buddies with them? Oh right, only prison guards that rape dudes are you buddies with. Well, don't call those guys. I just want physically assaulted. Keep your sexual assault prison guard buddies in prison, thanks.
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VanceMack said:
:lamo

Thats hilarious!
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Henrin said:
It's your story dude. I'm just reporting on who your buddies are.

And yes, it was supposed to be humorous.
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VanceMack said:
I do indeed know prison guards. And cops. Its cute you think they are rapists. Or maybe thats where your fantasy mind goes. Either way...just be sure when you exercise your false bravado and resist arrest that someone is filming it. And who knows...maybe hif someone slips you the nightstick, you will have something extra for your private film stash.

Oh...listen...I know this is all just crazy talk. At the end of the day, I highly doubt you are subject to being arrested any time soon (which is why you can talk BIG ****) and if you were arrested you would go along mewling about your 'rights' but you would go along quietly just the same because while you talk a good game...you arent stupid. We both know that. SO...can we dispense with the tough talk and all the other assorted bull****?
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How many times did you say the cops should assault me for resisting arrest and that I should get this assault on video?

Again, big boy, joining a gang and assaulting someone doesn't make you a man.
 
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Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Peter Grimm said:
You know what, I learned something today. I didn't know that resisting arrest under some circumstances and in some states is legal, but upon looking it up, it seems that's the case.

Reading more about it, though, I also learned that an arrest made in error is not unlawful if the officer's belief that the arrest was lawful was reasonable.

In this case, the arrest was reasonable, because the man was breaking the law by selling contraband cigarettes.
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He wasn't selling contraband cigarettes at the time of the incident. He had numerous prior arrests/citations for that "crime," but that's not what he was doing when the cops confronted him at that moment.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Looking at the video it does look like the cops were in the wrong.

I'm not going to go through 635+ posts but has anyone pointed out that if this man was being apprehended for not rendering on to Caesar?

Was killed because Uncle Sam wasn't getting his cut?

That's what it has come to?

Really?

This one people got a reason to kvetch...
 
No Indictment in Chokehold Death

vesper said:
It's not "thug stuff" it's reality and pertinent in discerning the truth. And yes Garner resisted arrest. What do you call a person who has been arrested 30 times? St. Francis of Assisi? A "gentle giant"? This guy was no stranger to the cops.
Garner was arguing with the cops who were there to arrest him after he got busted for selling untaxed (black market) cigarettes by an undercover cop. A crime he was currently on bail awaiting trial, along with driving without a licence, possession of drugs, and false personation. He was in no way co-operating with the police.

The one that created this video and added all the "commentary" was his friend Ramsey Orta who also has a rap sheet including a couple of felonies. According to court records he was due in court on robbery charges stemming from a May arrest and an assault charge from an arrest that occurred three days prior of him filming this video. A few weeks after the death of Garner he was spotted in a drug prone district under surveillance by undercover cops. He was in possession of a gun. Felons aren't allowed to have guns and he got arrested again. Why is this important? Neither Ramsey Orta nor Garner were/are law abiding citizens. The police had a reason for being there that day. It's not due to racial profiling or mistreating another over the color of their skin. They were there because of criminal activity.
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The criminal record of the person who filmed Garner's death is 100% irrelevant to the question of whether the NYPD used excessive force. Unless he is Magneto and his criminal powers include being able to rearrange video so things are portrayed that didn't ****ing happen, Orta's past and future criminality has no bearing on anything. Guilt by association is a fallacious argument.
 
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Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

VanceMack said:
Thats pathetic. Why was he on the ground?

If the offense he was being charged with was a ticket offense, fine...happy days. Was it? If not, then is your problem with the cop or with the people that write the statutes cops enforce?

"Hatred"

Like I said....pathetic.
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:lamo:lamo:lamo So I win.

He was on the ground because he was violently attacked from behind with a chock hold and 2 more men joined in to throw him to the concrete - where upon one of those put his body weight on his back while another shoved his head against the concrete, the initially attacker still with the chock hold.

Police always have discretion of whether or not to arrest someone if they are who initiate the possible legal action.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

ChezC3 said:
Looking at the video it does look like the cops were in the wrong.

I'm not going to go through 635+ posts but has anyone pointed out that if this man was being apprehended for not rendering on to Caesar?

Was killed because Uncle Sam wasn't getting his cut?

That's what it has come to?

Really?

This one people got a reason to kvetch...
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The government's cut on a single cigarette in NYC is 29 cents. However, if the cigarettes he was selling he had bought the pack for legitimately, the government had it's cut - so really it was then the offense of street peddling without a permit.

And it wasn't that the police saw him selling a cigarette. One the officers said some unnamed person who hadn't signed anything up the way said he/she saw him sell a cigarette to someone - also unknown. So they were taking him to jail because one officer said someone somewhere told a police officer he had sold a cigarette without a peddler's permit.

That's how it works you know. The police pull you over and write you a speeding ticket, explaining to you some unnamed person up the road told the officer he saw you speeding. :roll:

This was wrong from the start, and the father of 6 knew exactly what this was, deliberate police harassment of him for whatever reason.
 
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Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Unlike how the media portrays this in incessant, false and destructive race baiting, this incident has NO similarity to the Michael Brown shooting. None.

I have NO problem with Michael Brown being shot. ZERO.

This incident is outrageous and totally unacceptable police conduct.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Henrin said:
Lets review.




















How many times did you say the cops should assault me for resisting arrest and that I should get this assault on video?

Again, big boy, joining a gang and assaulting someone doesn't make you a man.
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Never. Not once. I said that when you advocate resisting arrest that will be the likely consequence and should that ever happen, you should make sure to get it on video. THEN you went into your foamy lather about your prison rape fantasy. Easy Henrin...when you close your eyes tonight, make sure your heart can handle the fantasy. Hate to see TWO dead bodies over the same silly crime.
 
Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

joko104 said:
:lamo:lamo:lamo So I win.

He was on the ground because he was violently attacked from behind with a chock hold and 2 more men joined in to throw him to the concrete - where upon one of those put his body weight on his back while another shoved his head against the concrete, the initially attacker still with the chock hold.

Police always have discretion of whether or not to arrest someone if they are who initiate the possible legal action.
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'Win'? Dood...you are so busy kicking your own ass you cant get out of your own way.


You say he was being choked (well...you say 'chocked' but I know what you meant) while someone was holding his head down. No...he wasnt because the same guy that took him to the ground is the same guy that was holding him down, 8 seconds later.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

VanceMack said:
Never. Not once. I said that when you advocate resisting arrest that will be the likely consequence and should that ever happen, you should make sure to get it on video. THEN you went into your foamy lather about your prison rape fantasy. Easy Henrin...when you close your eyes tonight, make sure your heart can handle the fantasy. Hate to see TWO dead bodies over the same silly crime.
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The crime of what? Oh right, resisting arrest. :lamo
 
Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

VanceMack said:
'Win'? Dood...you are so busy kicking your own ass you cant get out of your own way.


You say he was being choked (well...you say 'chocked' but I know what you meant) while someone was holding his head down. No...he wasnt because the same guy that took him to the ground is the same guy that was holding him down, 8 seconds later.
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No, that is false.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Henrin said:
The crime of what? Oh right, resisting arrest. :lamo
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Resisting arrest does not automatically justify lethal force.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

VanceMack said:
Never. Not once. I said that when you advocate resisting arrest that will be the likely consequence and should that ever happen, you should make sure to get it on video. THEN you went into your foamy lather about your prison rape fantasy. Easy Henrin...when you close your eyes tonight, make sure your heart can handle the fantasy. Hate to see TWO dead bodies over the same silly crime.
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My first post didn't even mention resisting arrest, btw. I do however enjoy how you jumped from not being submissive to resisting arrest.

Again, lets review.

Therefore, if the law says you did something wrong and you don't act like a submissive little sheep you're being out of line and force is called for to get you to behave
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Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Henrin said:
The crime of what? Oh right, resisting arrest. :lamo
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Well...no...if you let go of your histrionics you would see that the man was being arrested for suspicion of a crime had been convicted of on numerous occasions in the past. Those crimes were several of the 30 he had previously been convicted of.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Henrin said:
My first post didn't even mention resisting arrest, btw. I do however enjoy how you jumped from not being submissive to resisting arrest.

Again, lets review.
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That is correct. If the law decides you are going to be arrested, you are going to be arrested. Resist...dont be a 'sheep'...and you will...well...you will have a shot at your frothy foamy rape fantasy that got you so worked up about. :lamo
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

VanceMack said:
Well...no...if you let go of your histrionics you would see that the man was being arrested for suspicion of a crime had been convicted of on numerous occasions in the past. Those crimes were several of the 30 he had previously been convicted of.
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Did the officers even have probable cause to make an arrest?
 
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