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Cleveland boy with fake pistol killed by police

Re: The next Ferguson ?

Tettsuo said:
Doesn't mean I'm wrong though.

Bottom line for me is, the entire claim that the boy went for the gun sees VERY illogical. I don't need evidence to make that claim, just like I don't need evidence to say it's very difficult to believe Satan forced the cop to shoot. I'm mean, I wasn't there, right? I wasn't in his head, so I don't know for sure.

At some point we have to just use our own logic. We don't need a video to think for us, particularly in situations like this where we have a government agency that has on more than one occasion made up or stretched information to exonerate their own.
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By the very DEFINITION it absolutely means you are wrong.
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

VanceMack said:
Woah...who said anything about covering something up? If the kid reached for a BB Gun there is no coverup. Its a good shoot. Oh...wait...a LEGIT shoot.

Its sad you cant trust 'the cops'. DO you have an equal difficulty trusting 'the black folks'? You know...some of them DO really bad things...
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How can it be proven that the kid reached for the toy?
 
CRUE CAB said:
Pull on the uniform and pin on the badge and do the job then let us know how it goes.
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Doesn't answer the question as to why on earth would the cop assume a 12 year old kid has a real gun? And honestly if the cop is that scared he needs to get a different job.
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

Hatuey said:
How can it be proven that the kid reached for the toy?
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The same way all things are 'proven'....by asking witnesses there.
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

StillBallin75 said:
Wrong, in this situation there is precious little the cop could do to distinguish a real weapon from a bb gun as the orange tip had been removed. Not saying the kid should deserved to die, but that bright orange tip is there for a reason.
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I don't believe BB/pellet guns have orange tips.
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

VanceMack said:
:lamo How is what you are doing any different than any other bigot that presumes blacks must be criminals because some are?
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I can see that you are really trying to make a point here but you are failing... being black is not a profession that gives you legal power to use deadly force over others. Nice try though...

CRUE CAB said:
Nice deflection.
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It is spot on point...

Hatuey said:
How can it be proven that the kid reached for the toy?
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Exactly...

Tettsuo said:
He's 12!! Holy crap.... you can't even be 12 and act stupid.
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Not anymore... cops will blast you and all these guys will pop out of the woodwork and call the kid a stupid idiot and that it was his and his parent's fault...

StillBallin75 said:
Wrong, in this situation there is precious little the cop could do to distinguish a real weapon from a bb gun as the orange tip had been removed. Not saying the kid should deserved to die, but that bright orange tip is there for a reason.
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I didn't say that there was more that the cop could do. I said it wasn't the kids fault... it was the cops fault.
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

VanceMack said:
The same way all things are 'proven'....by asking witnesses there.
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If he had reached for the toy, does that make the cops' actions justified?
 
Gaius46 said:
Doesn't answer the question as to why on earth would the cop assume a 12 year old kid has a real gun? And honestly if the cop is that scared he needs to get a different job.
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Seriously... and what is with so many cops assuming the worst in EVERYBODY?
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

VanceMack said:
The same way all things are 'proven'....by asking witnesses there.
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Most witnesses are very unreliable when it comes to accuracy...
 
Re: The next Ferguson ?

Bodhisattva said:
Mine didn't, but that was a while ago.
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It's only actual toys that get the orange tip. A bb gun is dangerous and not to be "played with".
 
Bodhisattva said:
Seriously... and what is with so many cops assuming the worst in EVERYBODY?
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That's the thing isn't it? We're constantly told that there is so much violent crime out there (fact: violent crime has been decreasing for 50 years). We're told that black neighborhoods are burning daily (fact: crime in black neighborhoods has also been on the decline). We're told that is so much crime out there, that it justifies aggressive police tactics. What I think is actually happening is that the police are being groomed to treat American citizens as criminals. Stop and frisk gets used because there's a possibility that 1 out of 100 people will be carrying drugs or a weapon. Warrantless searches are conducted and the federal government uses police forces. It's pretty clear that Americans are now criminals in the eyes of the police unions. It's pretty clear that with each successive government (Republican or Democrat) the government-police-prison complex develops stronger links. It's a shame that so many conservatives are in favor of justifying police action no matter how aggressive it may seem. We must keep the people safe by killing a few innocents.
 
Hatuey said:
That's the thing isn't it? We're constantly told that there is so much violent crime out there (fact: violent crime has been decreasing for 50 years). We're told that black neighborhoods are burning daily (fact: crime in black neighborhoods has also been on the decline). We're told that is so much crime out there, that it justifies aggressive police tactics. What I think is actually happening is that the police are being groomed to treat American citizens as criminals. Stop and frisk gets used because there's a possibility that 1 out of 100 people will be carrying drugs or a weapon. Warrantless searches are conducted and the federal government uses police forces. It's pretty clear that Americans are now criminals in the eyes of the police unions. It's pretty clear that with each successive government (Republican or Democrat) the government-police-prison complex develops stronger links. It's a shame that so many conservatives are in favor of justifying police action no matter how aggressive it may seem. We must keep the people safe by killing a few innocents.
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I agree.

Also, you can't forget the money aspect. If we admit the crime is the lowest it's been in decades, do we need to keep the sheer number of police on hand? Do we need to keep arming them with more and more dangerous weapons?
 
Hatuey said:
That's the thing isn't it? We're constantly told that there is so much violent crime out there (fact: violent crime has been decreasing for 50 years). We're told that black neighborhoods are burning daily (fact: crime in black neighborhoods has also been on the decline). We're told that is so much crime out there, that it justifies aggressive police tactics. What I think is actually happening is that the police are being groomed to treat American citizens as criminals. Stop and frisk gets used because there's a possibility that 1 out of 100 people will be carrying drugs or a weapon. Warrantless searches are conducted and the federal government uses police forces. It's pretty clear that Americans are now criminals in the eyes of the police unions. It's pretty clear that with each successive government (Republican or Democrat) the government-police-prison complex develops stronger links. It's a shame that so many conservatives are in favor of justifying police action no matter how aggressive it may seem. We must keep the people safe by killing a few innocents.
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Crime... down.

No-Knock raids - innocent people killed by cop - cop numbers... up.
 
Gaius46 said:
Doesn't answer the question as to why on earth would the cop assume a 12 year old kid has a real gun? And honestly if the cop is that scared he needs to get a different job.
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Because the assumption is that *EVERY* gun is real until proven otherwise.
 
Cephus said:
That's seriously debatable.
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I am sure that you would come to that conclusion and that simply helps affirm my point. Thank you...
 
Bodhisattva said:
I am sure that you would come to that conclusion and that simply helps affirm my point. Thank you...
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The point that you have no clue? Yeah, we all know that.
 
Cephus said:
The point that you have no clue? Yeah, we all know that.
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Why you are jumping in with personal attacks over a simple comment is beyond me... but you right ahead and beat off with your superiority complex. :lol:
 
Cephus said:
Because the assumption is that *EVERY* gun is real until proven otherwise.
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Broad blanket assumptions like that are excuses to not think and exercise judgment. In the hands of an adult I'd agree it's reasonable assumption. But a kid? Sorry. We should demand that LE actually think.
 
Gaius46 said:
In the hands of an adult I'd certainly agree. In the hands of a pre teen when in the vast majority of cases the kid will be holding a toy or at worst a BB gun? No. That's a bad assumption to make and it gets innocent kids killed.
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No, innocent kids doing stupid things are what gets innocent kids killed. If that kid hadn't been in that park, with a real-looking gun, waving it around at people to the point that someone had to call 911 on him, he'd still be alive today, wouldn't he? It was the kid's actions that got him killed.
 
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