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Senate Narrowly Defeats Keystone XL Pipeline

I don't really have a problem with the KXL going through our country because it goes through all RED states.
Let those folks find out what we've been trying to protect tem from since they'll never vote for us.

Yet here in Illinois, GOP farmers are fighting an oil pipeline from the QUAD-Cities to Indiana.
I believe it's called the NIMBY effect .

Ok folks who support the Keystone... Here's where I ask why. Why do you support the keystone pipeline? What is the reason(s)?

I mean this rabid support can't be for the whole 50 full time jobs it provides after its constructed.
It can't be for the gas prices because it won't effect the prices at the pump at all.

Why do you want a pipeline constructed that puts our land at risk so that a Canadian oil company can pipe their oil across our land so that they can sell it to other countries? Where in all this does your support foster?
 
OK, but since it can determine the Rules of its Proceedings, thats not doing to happen, want to see a real shake up in the senate, repeal the 17th.

yeah... no. I like electing my senators.
 
This issue is dead until the next Congress in sworn in. Will Obama Veto the legislation or sign it?

WASHINGTON — Senate Democrats on Tuesday defeated a bill, 59 to 41, that would have approved the construction of the Keystone XL oil pipeline, rebuffing a Democratic colleague, Senator Mary L. Landrieu of Louisiana, who had hoped to muscle the legislation through in advance of her uphill runoff election fight back home.

Forty Democrats and Angus King, independent of Maine, voted against the bill, with just 14 Democrats joining all 45 Republicans in support of the oil pipeline.

snip

Senate Narrowly Defeats Keystone XL Pipeline

The Democratic Senators threw Landrieu under the bus. Sucks to be her. I guess she just didn't have the support from Harry that she thought she had.

So, it's certain the Republicans will pass a bill early next year. Then the ball will be in Obama's court. He'll veto or he won't. In my opinion, he won't veto it...especially if it gets any number of Democrat supporters.
 
And it will be vetoed in the new year .

then obama will be put on the spotlight,good or bad,he wont be protected from reid anymore.he will be required to either veto or comprimise,and if hes smart,he would do like clinton and comprimise,which was beneficial to clinton.
 
McConnell owns the all-time records for the filibuster for each of the last six years.
The latest "hell no" caucus belongs to the Liberal Dems in the Senate.

McConnell poisoned this well--if his caucus pushes too hard, he'll reap what he has sewn..
As he did last decade by being the first to ever raise the possibility of the "nuclear option" .

Not really. The filibuster was barely ever used for the bulk of the time the country existed. That didn't make both houses the same at all. Their constituents are vastly different. Small districts vs entire states.
 
I don't really have a problem with the KXL going through our country because it goes through all RED states.
Let those folks find out what we've been trying to protect tem from since they'll never vote for us.

Oh stop. You haven't been protecting them from anything. The pipeline will be perfectly safe. The objection to the pipeline is based upon ideology, not reason. Its about the lefts irrational hatred of fossil fuel not some wish to protect us all from a pipeline. Seriously. Why cant you liberals just be honest about something.
 
then be content in the rule making, the lobbying, and the power and greed concentrated in that body.

False choice narrative. You make is seem if I don't believe in repealing the 17th amendment then there is absolutely NO other alternative to what is going on right now. We can have what we have now AND kill the filibuster. Its not like killing the 17th amendment assures the killing of the filibuster either.

Hell if we are going to do some merry wish-making for shakeup... I say kill the house districts and make it a parliament. Keep the senate and kill the filibuster. Gerrymandering is then therefore dead and third parties will have a foothold in it's proportional representation that looks a helluvalot more like the people it represents than the crap we have now.
 
Ok folks who support the Keystone... Here's where I ask why. Why do you support the keystone pipeline? What is the reason(s)?

I mean this rabid support can't be for the whole 50 full time jobs it provides after its constructed.
It can't be for the gas prices because it won't effect the prices at the pump at all.

Why do you want a pipeline constructed that puts our land at risk so that a Canadian oil company can pipe their oil across our land so that they can sell it to other countries? Where in all this does your support foster?

It's not just Canada oil that'll go through that pipeline. North Dakota oil will too. That's America benefiting.
 
This issue is dead until the next Congress in sworn in. Will Obama Veto the legislation or sign it?

WASHINGTON — Senate Democrats on Tuesday defeated a bill, 59 to 41, that would have approved the construction of the Keystone XL oil pipeline, rebuffing a Democratic colleague, Senator Mary L. Landrieu of Louisiana, who had hoped to muscle the legislation through in advance of her uphill runoff election fight back home.

Forty Democrats and Angus King, independent of Maine, voted against the bill, with just 14 Democrats joining all 45 Republicans in support of the oil pipeline.

snip

Senate Narrowly Defeats Keystone XL Pipeline
As long as they are using eminent domain then I hope the bill continues to fail,hopefully long enough for Canadians to decide to start processing their own oil.Its a shame that most republicans have their lips firmly wrapped around the cocks of big business to not give a **** about property rights.
 
Oh stop. You haven't been protecting them from anything. The pipeline will be perfectly safe. The objection to the pipeline is based upon ideology, not reason. Its about the lefts irrational hatred of fossil fuel not some wish to protect us all from a pipeline. Seriously. Why cant you liberals just be honest about something.

Support for the pipeline is based on ideology, not reason.

If you think not... put your reasons for support here:
 
False choice narrative. You make is seem if I don't believe in repealing the 17th amendment then there is absolutely NO other alternative to what is going on right now. We can have what we have now AND kill the filibuster. Its not like killing the 17th amendment assures the killing of the filibuster either.

Hell if we are going to do some merry wish-making for shakeup... I say kill the house districts and make it a parliament. Keep the senate and kill the filibuster.

senators cannot be lobbied per 17th...

states control the senate, not the senators....so those actions the states want will get passed by the senate.

senators before the 17th rarely ever see a 2nd or 3rd term in office...built in term limits.

senate would return to a check on federal power over reach.
 
As long as they are using eminent domain then I hope the bill continues to fail,hopefully long enough for Canadians to decide to start processing their own oil.Its a shame that most republicans have their lips firmly wrapped around the cocks of big business to not give a **** about property rights.

Absofreeginloutly!
 
senators cannot be lobbied per 17th...

states control the senate, not the senators....so those actions the states want will get passed by the senate.

senators before the 17th rarely ever see a 2nd or 3rd term in office...built in term limits.

senate would return to a check on federal power over reach.

You'd have to tell the SCOTUS and their belief that money is speech and therefore stopping lobbying is against the first amendment.
 
Oh stop. You haven't been protecting them from anything. The pipeline will be perfectly safe. The objection to the pipeline is based upon ideology, not reason. Its about the lefts irrational hatred of fossil fuel not some wish to protect us all from a pipeline. Seriously. Why cant you liberals just be honest about something.

I oppose the pipeline because I actually respect the property rights of the land owners.
 
This would be two decades later.
The GOPs in DC have no intention of working with Obama as they had to with Clinton after election losses.
The GOP actions over the last six years are proof positive that this is all-out electioneering war .

then obama will be put on the spotlight,good or bad,he wont be protected from reid anymore.he will be required to either veto or comprimise,and if hes smart,he would do like clinton and comprimise,which was beneficial to clinton.
 
You'd have to tell the SCOTUS and their belief that money is speech and therefore stopping lobbying is against the first amendment.

senators are not independent pre 17th as they are today, they have to vote according to how their state directs them to vote.....they cannot be lobbied.
 
The judge hasn't even ruled in Nebraska yet.
Something that GOPs normally fight for.
Not to mention how GOPs are normally against the excesses of eminent domain .

I oppose the pipeline because I actually respect the property rights of the land owners.
 
senators are not independent pre 17th as they are today, they have to vote according to how their state directs them to vote.....they cannot be lobbied.

Who in their state would direct them on how to vote?
 
then you take it to the American people, and sell a compromise.

or you at least try to do that.

Greetings, Helix. :2wave:

It's apparently been forgotten somewhere along the line that "compromise" is a good word, and it should be revived! This "my way or the highway" thinking has not worked to keep people happy - rather the opposite! With compromise everyone wins something, and it can truthfully be shouted from the rooftops - by both sides! What's wrong with that? Business and unions do it all the time, and it works. WTH is wrong with our current elected leaders in DC today? :2mad:
 
As long as they are using eminent domain then I hope the bill continues to fail,hopefully long enough for Canadians to decide to start processing their own oil.Its a shame that most republicans have their lips firmly wrapped around the cocks of big business to not give a **** about property rights.
Well said James.
 
thats not really a defeat,its more of didnt recieve a filibuster proof majority or veto proof majority,or even a reid proof majority.

It's a defeat, for the time being. You can bet the house will pass it again next year and most likely the senate will pass it. But that is not guaranteed

.00 Democrats who voted AYE on the Keystone

Dem Aye Replaced by Republican Aye
Begich AK
Hagan NC
Landrieu LA
Pryor AR
Walsh MT

But will these Democrats vote AYE again next year
Donnelly IN
Heitkamp ND
Manchin WV
McCaskill Mo
Tester MT
Warner VA

On the plus side Harkin of IA voted Nay, Ernst who is replacing him will vote AYE, the same for Udall of Colorado who is being replaced by Gardner, Johnson of SD nay will be replaced with an AYE from Rounds and Rockefellers Nay in West Virginia will be replace by an Aye from Capito.

So the Keystone should have 57 votes in January. The GOP will need 3 of the 6 Democrats who voted AYE in order to reach 60. I do not see 4 of them changing their vote, although one or two might. Keystone will pass the senate. But there is no way to get to 67 if the president veto’s it. 63 as I see it is the max.
 
He only wants to kill the 17th amendment because more than 30 some state legislatures are GOP.
And would pick the Senators--he doesn't tell you that .

False choice narrative. You make is seem if I don't believe in repealing the 17th amendment then there is absolutely NO other alternative to what is going on right now. We can have what we have now AND kill the filibuster. Its not like killing the 17th amendment assures the killing of the filibuster either.

Hell if we are going to do some merry wish-making for shakeup... I say kill the house districts and make it a parliament. Keep the senate and kill the filibuster. Gerrymandering is then therefore dead and third parties will have a foothold in it's proportional representation that looks a helluvalot more like the people it represents than the crap we have now.
 
Support for the pipeline is based on ideology, not reason.

If you think not... put your reasons for support here:
Support for the pipeline is based upon the idea that human life and human activity relies upon the availability of affordable energy. In short: it exists, we need it, and have the ability to refine it into a useable substance. And the there is no argument that doing so is against the national interest. If anti-progress liberals like you and Obama were around and in charge when the first oil well was drilled, you would have sought to have it capped.
 
Who in their state would direct them on how to vote?

the state legislatures, and since the states control the senate, it is no longer a collective body as the house.

collective bodies are full of faction/ special interest.

that is not to say there not going to be corruption in government be it federal or state, however since i know corruption exist i want it as close to the people as possible, because it is easier to expose and correct the problem, then 3000 miles away.
 
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