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Senate Narrowly Defeats Keystone XL Pipeline

EnigmaO01 said:
I assume you are referring to Obama Care? If so the republicans originally gave it that name to deride it. It's really the PPACA (Patient Protection Afforable Care Act).

If some of the states it would pass through don't want it and the Native American lands it would pass through don't want it and were never conferred with than I say it should be dead in the water. Not that many permanent jobs and it will help Canada out a lot more than the US at the risk of polluting our land.
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No I was referring to if you put an attractive sounding name on a piece of legislation, it makes it hard for people to vote against it--Like No Child Left Behind.
 
American said:
This isn't good for Landrieu.
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She was already behind by double digits. She's toast. Why the hell do dems do this? Why run as a republican light? Who from the right would vote for a republican light when they can have a real republican? It's the stupidest campaign though process ever.
 
EnigmaO01 said:
Fossil Fuel Subsidies: Overview - Oil Change InternationalOil Change International
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Why do you guys insist on providing biased disinformation from sources that are even more biased than you? From your source...

What is a fossil fuel subsidy?

A fossil fuel subsidy is any government action that lowers the cost of fossil fuel energy production, raises the price received by energy producers or lowers the price paid by energy consumers. There are a lot of activities under this simple definition—tax breaks and giveaways, but also loans at favorable rates, price controls, purchase requirements and a whole lot of other things.
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What this basically means is that any tax break given to any industry, like accelerated depreciation for example, qualifies as a "fossil fuel subsidy". This is a totally dishonest way to characterize the industry. If they are getting serious breaks that others are not then lets see it but if this is all you have to offer then your doing nothing more than peddling false information.
 
Ok folks who support the Keystone... Here's where I ask why. Why do you support the keystone pipeline? What is the reason(s)?

I mean this rabid support can't be for the whole 50 full time jobs it provides after its constructed.
It can't be for the gas prices because it won't effect the prices at the pump at all.

Why do you want a pipeline constructed that puts our land at risk so that a Canadian oil company can pipe their oil across our land so that they can sell it to other countries? Where in all this does your support foster?
 
pbrauer said:
This issue is dead until the next Congress in sworn in. Will Obama Veto the legislation or sign it?

WASHINGTON — Senate Democrats on Tuesday defeated a bill, 59 to 41, that would have approved the construction of the Keystone XL oil pipeline, rebuffing a Democratic colleague, Senator Mary L. Landrieu of Louisiana, who had hoped to muscle the legislation through in advance of her uphill runoff election fight back home.

Forty Democrats and Angus King, independent of Maine, voted against the bill, with just 14 Democrats joining all 45 Republicans in support of the oil pipeline.

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Senate Narrowly Defeats Keystone XL Pipeline
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thats not really a defeat,its more of didnt recieve a filibuster proof majority or veto proof majority,or even a reid proof majority.
 
Senate Repubs give up something?
They filibustered an NSA bill today 42-58 that most Libertarians want.
McConnell said it went too far and Paul said it didn't go far enough.
Just more of the clown show we're about to see open in January .

sangha said:
Whatever the senate repubs would give up in return would be nixed by the repubs in the house.
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beerftw said:
thats not really a defeat,its more of didnt recieve a filibuster proof majority or veto proof majority,or even a reid proof majority.
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And it will be vetoed in the new year .
 
pbrauer said:
They voted no, because they are against the pipeline. Just because they were voted out, that doesn't mean their political life is over. What would you do in that situation?
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I know you didn't ask me, but if I'm on my way out and my constituents wanted something I was against I would abstain.
 
And incoming Sen. Grassley promised to further expand the "nuclear option" to legislation.
The same GOPs who threatened the original "nuclear option" when Bush was reigning king.
When Dems backed off and gave him his judges as well as his cabinet, something McConnell refused to do for Obama .

poweRob said:
And I hope they do. I pray that they do. Kill that ****ing disastrous crap called the filibuster. Let the Republicans lead the legislature as they have won. Let the country move in the direction that they wish to lead. If the people don't like it, they will change leadership. We don't need mitigating BS rules that, IMO, further separate the government's representation of it's people.
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Senators are not elected for 5.75 years.
This is just one of the many new Nixon cards being played at the federal and state levels.
An excellent messaging game that GOPs have bought into .
azgreg said:
I know you didn't ask me, but if I'm on my way out and my constituents wanted something I was against I would abstain.
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NIMBY said:
And incoming Sen. Grassley promised to further expand the "nuclear option" to legislation.
The same GOPs who threatened the original "nuclear option" when Bush was reigning king.
When Dems backed off and gave him his judges as well as his cabinet, something McConnell refused to do for Obama .
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It matters not to me. Politicians are hypocrites? Absolutely. I still want that non-law non-constitutional "rule" killed. Then let people get the leadership they vote for.
 
Actually I did bring up Kennedy but not his hospitalization.
Thank you for adding Byrd's name.
We still have GOP posters on here lying that Dems had a filibuster-proof Senate for two years.
Go figure .

poweRob said:
Well you left out that also during that time when the dems were supposed to have had a "filibuster proof majority" Ted Kennedy and Robert Byrd were hospitalized and their vote was basically vacated.
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NIMBY said:
And it will be vetoed in the new year .
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If Obama vetoes it, then Obama and Democrats can deal with the 60% of Americans (according to the latest USA Today Poll) that want to see it passed.
 
azgreg said:
I know you didn't ask me, but if I'm on my way out and my constituents wanted something I was against I would abstain.
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Okay, that would show you have no principals and your opponents will use it against you in the future.
 
That would make both the House and Senate the same.
I'm not so sure McConnell is willing to do this, knowing it will come back on the GOP sooner than later .
poweRob said:
It matters not to me. Politicians are hypocrites? Absolutely. I still want that non-law non-constitutional "rule" killed. Then let people get the leadership they vote for.
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Helix said:
the choices are pretty poor. the best thing we can do would be to eliminate gerrymandering nationwide and to ease ballot access restrictions. unfortunately, the only people who can do that are the ones who would lose the most if the effort was actually successful.
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Exactly, the Republicans and Democrats write the election laws and they do so as a mutual protection act. I really do not think either parties care one iota how much the people come to dislike them, they know there are really only two choices on the ballot. ABC exit poll had this on party favorability ratings and it is kind:

44% of voters view the Democratic Party favorably, 53% unfavorably
40% of voters view the Republican Party favorably, 55% unfavorably

CBS a month before the election had this:
37% favorable view of the Democratic Party, 60% unfavorable
33% favorable view of the Republican Party, 61% unfavorable

So who really cares if the people dislike you political party, that is as long as they dislike the other party more.
 
vesper said:
If Obama vetoes it, then Obama and Democrats can deal with the 60% of Americans (according to the latest USA Today Poll) that want to see it passed.
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So you think politicians should watch the polls and vote accordingly?
 
poweRob said:
It matters not to me. Politicians are hypocrites? Absolutely. I still want that non-law non-constitutional "rule" killed. Then let people get the leadership they vote for.
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sorry its not unconstitutional.



Each House may determine the Rules of its Proceedings, punish its Members for disorderly Behaviour, and, with the Concurrence of two thirds, expel a Member.
 
vesper said:
If Obama vetoes it, then Obama and Democrats can deal with the 60% of Americans
(according to the latest USA Today Poll) that want to see it passed.
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According to which poll and in which states?
Even oil executives now say this KXL won't make a difference, unless we get theoil.

The GOP has an excellent messaging game right now.

We'll see if they can transition from the party of NO to the party that can rule.

With the way GOP posters are gloating, a good part of me is back to wanting to give McConnell his own medicine for the next two years .
 
NIMBY said:
That would make both the House and Senate the same.
I'm not so sure McConnell is willing to do this, knowing it will come back on the GOP sooner than later .
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Not really. The filibuster was barely ever used for the bulk of the time the country existed. That didn't make both houses the same at all. Their constituents are vastly different. Small districts vs entire states.
 
nimby said:
according to which poll and in which states?
Even oil executives now say this kxl won't make a difference, unless we get theoil.

The gop has an excellent messaging game right now.

We'll see if they can transition from the party of no to the party that can rule.

With the way gop posters are gloating, a good part of me is back to wanting to give mcconnell his own medicine for the next two years .
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lol.....
 
ernst barkmann said:
sorry its not unconstitutional.



Each House may determine the Rules of its Proceedings, punish its Members for disorderly Behaviour, and, with the Concurrence of two thirds, expel a Member.
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That's why I said non-constitutional instead of unconstitutional. It's not against the law, it's just a governing action not scripted into the constitution.
 
poweRob said:
That's why I said non-constitutional instead of unconstitutional. It's not against the law, it's just a governing action not scripted into the constitution.
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OK, but since it can determine the Rules of its Proceedings, thats not doing to happen, want to see a real shake up in the senate, repeal the 17th.
 
NIMBY said:
According to which poll and in which states?
Even oil executives now say this KXL won't make a difference, unless we get theoil.

The GOP has an excellent messaging game right now.

We'll see if they can transition from the party of NO to the party that can rule.

With the way GOP posters are gloating, a good part of me is back to wanting to give McConnell his own medicine for the next two years .
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And he'd deserve each and every single filibuster coming at him for the next two years for the way he's acted. But I still want the filibuster dead.
 
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