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Stupidity of the American Voter?

Fletch said:
The Declaration, The Constitution and the American nation was built upon a single word. That word was liberty. You establish a free society and a free market emerges. To create a socialist society, you have to destroy the concept of liberty. Socialists lack the ability or popular support to do this via a frontal assault, so they attack liberty by attacking the free market. Chain the market and you chain the individual. Socialism is about state power. The Constitution was about limiting state power. The Constitution doesn't explicitly establish a free market nor explicitly reject socialism. It does both implicitly. Socialism is impossible for a federal government confined to the powers enumerated in the Constitution.
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No you dont. Socialism does not destroy liberty. Authoritarianism destroys liberty.
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tres borrachos said:
Again, speak for yourself. If you were a supporter of the ACA, you are, in fact, one of the voters that Gruber called "stupid". I was against the ACA. I still am. I'm not one of the stupid ones who needed to be duped.
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You must be such a smarty pants then! Good for you! The rest of us are just big fat dumbos.
 
MMC said:
Megyn is now calling it another scandal for BO and Team. After the second video popped up.


Gruber video #2: No, really, American voters are stupid; Update: Third video?.....

Call this Gruber 2: Stupid and Stupider. Jonathan Gruber attempted to escape scrutiny for his October 2013 declaration that Americans are “stupid” and that ObamaCare was designed to exploit that and hide its true nature by saying that he regretted his “off the cuff” comments. “I basically spoke inappropriately,” he told Ronan Farrow, “and I regret having made those comments.”

Last night, though, a second video emerged from the same time period in which Gruber explained that the ACA passed “because the American people are too stupid” to understand the law. Megyn Kelly wondered last night how this squared with Gruber’s mea culpa on that “little-watched MSNBC show”:

The tape, played on Fox News’ “The Kelley File,” showed Gruber speaking at an October 2013 event at Washington University in St. Louis. Referring to the so-called “Cadillac tax” on high-end health plans, he said: “They proposed it and that passed, because the American people are too stupid to understand the difference.” .....snip~

Gruber video #2: No, really, American voters are stupid; Update: Third video? « Hot Air
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It is a scandal, and a real one. But except for TDS who happens to agree with Gruber that he's stupid, none of the leftists seem the least bit bothered by this.

Once January rolls around, and the GOP takes over the Senate, they should use this to their advantage. This is deplorable, and if Bush's people ever uttered anything close to this, we would be witnessing meltdowns and 187634 threads all over this board, and the MSM would be running the clips non-stop 24/7.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
You must be such a smarty pants then! Good for you! The rest of us are just big fat dumbos.
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I'm not one of the "stupid voters" who supported the ACA. Gruber was talking about you. But that's okay, it doesn't seem to bother you one bit. Please don't mind if I point and laugh.
 
Zyphlin said:
I just find it funny how quickly and fluidly it changes, for both sides, and how quickly they are to grasp onto/ignore rationalizations of these type of things.
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While i share your amusement, i also view all things political on the basis of cost-benefit analysis. While our domestic healthcare system is a driver of innovation, healthcare costs are entirely inelastic and are susceptible to abuse and inefficiency. Helping to alleviate this shortcoming is a worthy cause! While i may not agree with the final product, we are stepping in the right direction.

Preemptive war at the expense of future taxpayers and thousands of lives is an entirely different animal. Through the gift of hindsight, we should all agree that the situation was handled poorly. The present value of the total cost of these engagements would likely have been enough to cover the cost of health care for those who either cannot afford it, or are in extreme situations.

It is hypocritical to support spending on wars while arguing against increasing healthcare expenditures given the nature of the healthcare market. Modern day guns vs. butter that has left our country worse off!
 
MMC said:
I'll bet BO said the same thing watching the Tele, huh? :lol:
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In all fairness to BO, he has a right to be mad. This was really out of line when you think about it. I'm no fan of Obama as you know, but I do think consultants have an obligation to protect confidentiality and this guy didn't.

What I want to know too is why did it take so long for this to come out? This was said in 2013 I believe.
 
tres borrachos said:
I'm not one of the "stupid voters" who supported the ACA. Gruber was talking about you. But that's okay, it doesn't seem to bother you one bit. Please don't mind if I point and laugh.
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Notice how he didnt say "stupid people supported it" he said they took advantage of stupid people to get it passed.
 
MMC said:
Megyn is now calling it another scandal for BO and Team. After the second video popped up.


Gruber video #2: No, really, American voters are stupid; Update: Third video?.....

Call this Gruber 2: Stupid and Stupider. Jonathan Gruber attempted to escape scrutiny for his October 2013 declaration that Americans are “stupid” and that ObamaCare was designed to exploit that and hide its true nature by saying that he regretted his “off the cuff” comments. “I basically spoke inappropriately,” he told Ronan Farrow, “and I regret having made those comments.”

Last night, though, a second video emerged from the same time period in which Gruber explained that the ACA passed “because the American people are too stupid” to understand the law. Megyn Kelly wondered last night how this squared with Gruber’s mea culpa on that “little-watched MSNBC show”:

The tape, played on Fox News’ “The Kelley File,” showed Gruber speaking at an October 2013 event at Washington University in St. Louis. Referring to the so-called “Cadillac tax” on high-end health plans, he said: “They proposed it and that passed, because the American people are too stupid to understand the difference.” .....snip~

Gruber video #2: No, really, American voters are stupid; Update: Third video? « Hot Air
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tres borrachos said:
It is a scandal, and a real one. But except for TDS who happens to agree with Gruber that he's stupid, none of the leftists seem the least bit bothered by this.

Once January rolls around, and the GOP takes over the Senate, they should use this to their advantage. This is deplorable, and if Bush's people ever uttered anything close to this, we would be witnessing meltdowns and 187634 threads all over this board, and the MSM would be running the clips non-stop 24/7.
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All true but to me the pièce de résistance is what he said about subsidies which should kill the whole damn thing.

Q: The health information exchanges for the states and it’s my understanding that if states don’t provide them that the federal government will provide them.

Gruber: Yeah, so these health insurance exchanges…will be these new shopping places and they’ll be the place that people go to get their subsidies for health insurance. In the law it says if the states don’t provide them then the federal backstop will. The federal government has been sort of slow in putting out its backstop I think partly because they want to sort of squeeze the states to do it. I think what’s important to remember politically about this is if you’re a state and you don’t set up an exchange that means your citizens don’t get their tax credits. But your citizens still pay the taxes that support this bill. So you’re essentially saying to your citizens, you’re going to pay all the taxes to help all the other states in the country.

I hope that that’s a blatant enough political reality that states will get their act together and realize there are billions of dollars at stake here in setting up these exchanges and that they’ll do it, but you know once again the politics can get ugly around this.

Gruber: States Without Exchanges Will Get No Subsidies | Sweetness & Light
 
tres borrachos said:
It is a scandal, and a real one. But except for TDS who happens to agree with Gruber that he's stupid, none of the leftists seem the least bit bothered by this.

Once January rolls around, and the GOP takes over the Senate, they should use this to their advantage. This is deplorable, and if Bush's people ever uttered anything close to this, we would be witnessing meltdowns and 187634 threads all over this board, and the MSM would be running the clips non-stop 24/7.
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He definitely didn't need another coming out..... and definitely here. He has only so much credit left. Has he sent out any Team members for defense yet?
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Notice how he didnt say "stupid people supported it" he said they took advantage of stupid people to get it passed.
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Notice how he said they relied on the stupidity of voters to get it passed?

The people who opposed it didn't want it passed.

You did, I gather. If so, he was counting on your stupidity.

Embrace the horror.
 
MMC said:
He definitely didn't need another coming out..... and definitely here. He has only so much credit left. Has he sent out any Team members for defense yet?
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I don't know. I want to catch his Chief Propagandist's presser today to see if it's brought up. I hope so. That would be delish.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
No you dont. Socialism does not destroy liberty. Authoritarianism destroys liberty.
27zvx5h.jpg
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Socialism requires authoritarianism. That you and other leftists cling to the fairy tale that socialism can be achieved without an authoritarian state is beyond naïve.
 
Grant said:
Is that why the streets of Texas are filled with dead children? I could hardly find room to park my new RV.
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Ah, I see, uninsured children in Texas is only an issue if there are bodies in the street.

Again, the argument is that the reason for the lack of participation of children in Medicare for all of these years....is the fault of the parents. Somehow, their is a problem with the parent in Texas that is 150% to 200% worse than the rest of the nation.
 
bubbabgone said:
All true but to me the pièce de résistance is what he said about subsidies which should kill the whole damn thing.

Q: The health information exchanges for the states and it’s my understanding that if states don’t provide them that the federal government will provide them.

Gruber: Yeah, so these health insurance exchanges…will be these new shopping places and they’ll be the place that people go to get their subsidies for health insurance. In the law it says if the states don’t provide them then the federal backstop will. The federal government has been sort of slow in putting out its backstop I think partly because they want to sort of squeeze the states to do it. I think what’s important to remember politically about this is if you’re a state and you don’t set up an exchange that means your citizens don’t get their tax credits. But your citizens still pay the taxes that support this bill. So you’re essentially saying to your citizens, you’re going to pay all the taxes to help all the other states in the country.

I hope that that’s a blatant enough political reality that states will get their act together and realize there are billions of dollars at stake here in setting up these exchanges and that they’ll do it, but you know once again the politics can get ugly around this.

Gruber: States Without Exchanges Will Get No Subsidies | Sweetness & Light
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OH.....going with the French eh.
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tres borrachos said:
It is a scandal, and a real one. But except for TDS who happens to agree with Gruber that he's stupid, none of the leftists seem the least bit bothered by this.
Click to expand...

Are you surprised? Was anyone on the right upset when they found out the Bush regime lied about WMDs in Iraq and a connection between Hussein and Al Qaeda? Were people on the left up in arms when Clinton blatantly lied about his affair with Monica? When G.H. bush blatantly lied about taxes, did that stop any conservative from voting for a Republican in the next election? When Reagan lied about Iran, were conservatives "bothered"? Of course not. The majority of this country is only about partisan politics, and the support whoever they voted for, and the party their in, regardless of what the politicians do.
 
Conservative said:
TX is a state that promotes personal responsibility and millions are moving here. It is a leader in the nation in job creation and is the home to 52 Fortune 500 Companies. It's low cost of living has set the standards that apparently you don't like. You have a choice, don't move to TX
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I don't plan to, that is not the issue, the issue still is why your state has double the rate of uninsured children as most other states.
 
apdst said:
Texas is number one in illegal aliens, too. Let's get a handle on illegal immigration and your insured numbers will look better, too.
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Con says the issue is with those who are eligible.
 
bubbabgone said:
All true but to me the pièce de résistance is what he said about subsidies which should kill the whole damn thing.

Q: The health information exchanges for the states and it’s my understanding that if states don’t provide them that the federal government will provide them.

Gruber: Yeah, so these health insurance exchanges…will be these new shopping places and they’ll be the place that people go to get their subsidies for health insurance. In the law it says if the states don’t provide them then the federal backstop will. The federal government has been sort of slow in putting out its backstop I think partly because they want to sort of squeeze the states to do it. I think what’s important to remember politically about this is if you’re a state and you don’t set up an exchange that means your citizens don’t get their tax credits. But your citizens still pay the taxes that support this bill. So you’re essentially saying to your citizens, you’re going to pay all the taxes to help all the other states in the country.

I hope that that’s a blatant enough political reality that states will get their act together and realize there are billions of dollars at stake here in setting up these exchanges and that they’ll do it, but you know once again the politics can get ugly around this.

Gruber: States Without Exchanges Will Get No Subsidies | Sweetness & Light
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Hey, paying taxes is patriotic, according to the Vice Simpleton. So, the citizens are paying taxes for everyone. And the young people are being gouged on purpose. No biggie.

;)

This guy is the gift that the Republicans didn't even know existed.
 
Leeburte said:
Are you surprised? Was anyone on the right upset when they found out the Bush regime lied about WMDs in Iraq and a connection between Hussein and Al Qaeda? Were people on the left up in arms when Clinton blatantly lied about his affair with Monica? When G.H. bush blatantly lied about taxes, did that stop any conservative from voting for a Republican in the next election? When Reagan lied about Iran, were conservatives "bothered"? Of course not. The majority of this country is only about partisan politics, and the support whoever they voted for, and the party their in, regardless of what the politicians do.
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No one " lied " about WMDs.

That's just a stale Liberal talking point its been debunked over and over on this very site.
 
tres borrachos said:
Notice how he said they relied on the stupidity of voters to get it passed?
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Yup.

The people who opposed it didn't want it passed.
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Does that make them smart? Afterall this was the group of people who opposed it:
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Got some smart ones there!

You did, I gather. If so, he was counting on your stupidity.

Embrace the horror.
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Death panels!!! Socialism!!! AHHHH!!
 
Fletch said:
Socialism requires authoritarianism.
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Nope no it does not.

That you and other leftists cling to the fairy tale that socialism can be achieved without an authoritarian state is beyond naïve.
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It is? Why is bringing socialism through a democratic system naive?
 
Leeburte said:
Are you surprised? Was anyone on the right upset when they found out the Bush regime lied about WMDs in Iraq and a connection between Hussein and Al Qaeda? Were people on the left up in arms when Clinton blatantly lied about his affair with Monica? When G.H. bush blatantly lied about taxes, did that stop any conservative from voting for a Republican in the next election? When Reagan lied about Iran, were conservatives "bothered"? Of course not. The majority of this country is only about partisan politics, and the support whoever they voted for, and the party their in, regardless of what the politicians do.
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Hello, can you maybe start a thread about Bush, WMDs, Hussein, Al Qaeda, Clinton, Monica, HW Bush, Reagan and Iran? This thread isn't about them and I'm not interested in discussing them here. Thanks!
 
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