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Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysvi[W:480]

Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
I deal with reality.

I believe in the constitution. and most states could not ban guns due to their own constitutions.
Click to expand...

I see no evidence of that. ;)

But, two points:

1) you failed to answer the question. It could happen.
2) the court allows for it. That is reality. And you don't seem to be accepting it.
3) I think you believe in what you project on the Constitution. it's not the same as believing in it.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

Boo Radley said:
I see no evidence of that. ;)

But, two points:

1) you failed to answer the question. It could happen.
2) the court allows for it. That is reality. And you don't seem to be accepting it.
3) I think you believe in what you project on the Constitution. it's not the same as believing in it.
Click to expand...

I cannot help what you fail to understand as to state constitutions.

yes it could happen. but now that the Supreme court has extended the 2A to states it cannot.

I think you are not able to understand what the constitution really says or how to analyze it. none of you gun banners or gun restrictionists have ever made a rational argument that the federal government was actually delegated a power to control firearms
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
I cannot help what you fail to understand as to state constitutions.

yes it could happen. but now that the Supreme court has extended the 2A to states it cannot.

I think you are not able to understand what the constitution really says or how to analyze it. none of you gun banners or gun restrictionists have ever made a rational argument that the federal government was actually delegated a power to control firearms
Click to expand...

Oh, I admit my novice status. I wish others would as well. But I do know that it allows the courts to rule on this, and they have. You largely have lost your argument already. The reality is what it is.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

Boo Radley said:
I understand it, but if your issue is freedom to own guns, you logically would be upset no matter who banned them. You would not argue that guns can't be banned, that it's a protected right. If you acknowledge states can ban them, then get ready for states banning them. ;)
Click to expand...

States can not ban them, as per the Supreme Court (DC vs Heller) but they can regulate them.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
remind me of your training in constitutional law.

its clearly about an individual right

what pre-existing right did the founders seek to recognize with the 2A?
Click to expand...
I'm not sure why you are confused
there was no pre-existing right
since there was no pre-existing US of A
prior to all of that
you were nothing but a number of different colonies
much like all the rest of great Britain's colonies
including botany bay
but the auzzis got smart (long before you)
so great Britain started sending all their convicts your way instead
.
its not an individual right dude
your courts your scholars happen to agree on this fact
.
its only a minute proportion of the mighty yank that figures those learned people are all wrong
.
so tell us again...your reason for refusing to registar your firearms is...
A...too much work
and
B...insurrection
(I believe you also muttered something about your fed gov shouldn't impose taxes on you as well...however you've still given no valid reason why not)
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

mrmacq said:
I'm not sure why you are confused
there was no pre-existing right
since there was no pre-existing US of A
prior to all of that
you were nothing but a number of different colonies
much like all the rest of great Britain's colonies
including botany bay
but the auzzis got smart (long before you)
so great Britain started sending all their convicts your way instead
.
its not an individual right dude
your courts your scholars happen to agree on this fact
.
its only a minute proportion of the mighty yank that figures those learned people are all wrong
.
so tell us again...your reason for refusing to registar your firearms is...
A...too much work
and
B...insurrection
(I believe you also muttered something about your fed gov shouldn't impose taxes on you as well...however you've still given no valid reason why not)
Click to expand...

complete blather. dismissed as opinion based on a desire to ban guns

your posts are disjointed, poorly written and make no sense

I don't support registration because

a) the federal government doesn't have the proper power to do so based on even the most extreme version of the commerce clause

b) every asshole who wants to ban guns supports registration

c) it doesn't help me in any way shape or form

d) criminals are exempt from registration due to the fifth amendment


the foundation upon which the bill of rights is premised upon is not my creation but one recognized by constitutional historians
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
I cannot help it if your knowledge of firearms and artillery is as deficient as your understanding of constitutional law
Click to expand...
.
right
cause once again you want to decide what is and what isn't
"its a frickin tube which a projectile runs through propelled by escaping gasses
usually initiated by a trigger mechanism
the spent casing is then ejected
...sounds eerily similar enough to me"
.
youre funny
.
a thought for you
gun boats and gun ships (well okay...that was two)
AND
in the day of the sail all those cannons were designated "guns" (oops...now three)
"Naval artillery is artillery mounted on a warship, originally used only for naval warfare, later also for naval gunfire "
...note the word "gun" in "gunfire?
...
but hey dude
we can keep on playing your silly game
its been noticed you prefer to make up your own rules as you go along
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
I don't support registration because



b) every asshole who wants to ban guns supports registration
Click to expand...

So if someone turned the tables on you and said ...... " yeah, every asshole with the three page centerfold to GUN MONTHLY over their bed for inspiration opposes registration"?


Can you tell us how that sort of vitriolic hyperbole advances the discussion in any intelligent way?
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

haymarket said:
So if someone turned the tables on you and said ...... " yeah, every asshole with the three page centerfold to GUN MONTHLY over their bed for inspiration opposes registration"?


Can you tell us how that sort of vitriolic hyperbole advances the discussion in any intelligent way?
Click to expand...

mine is truthful, yours is not. I have never heard of gun monthly or a centerfold thereof

why would any gun owner support registration?
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
complete blather. dismissed as opinion based on a desire to ban guns

your posts are disjointed, poorly written and make no sense

I don't support registration because

a) the federal government doesn't have the proper power to do so based on even the most extreme version of the commerce clause

b) every asshole who wants to ban guns supports registration

c) it doesn't help me in any way shape or form

d) criminals are exempt from registration due to the fifth amendment


the foundation upon which the bill of rights is premised upon is not my creation but one recognized by constitutional historians
Click to expand...
.
except for rather majorly huge problem dude
namely...I own three
why would you assume I want my possession of said firearms banned?
.
time to give your head a shake
and listen for the rattle
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

mrmacq said:
.
except for rather majorly huge problem dude
namely...I own three
why would you assume I want my possession of said firearms banned?
.
time to give your head a shake
and listen for the rattle
Click to expand...

where do you get the idea that gun banners don't own guns. French Knights killed any peasant who owned a crossbow
Samurai murdered any commoner caught with a sword
Jay Rockefeller had an AR 15 when he voted to ban them
the Klan passed laws keeping freed blacks from owning firearms
the Sullivan Act was designed to disarm rival ethnic groups


You have never said what kind so I might inquire as to them to see if you are truthful
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
mine is truthful, yours is not. I have never heard of gun monthly or a centerfold thereof
Click to expand...

AMAZING!!!!! Truly AMAZING!!!!!! :doh:roll::doh
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

haymarket said:
AMAZING!!!!! Truly AMAZING!!!!!! :doh:roll::doh
Click to expand...

nice diversion. do you support registration Haymarket?
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
nice diversion. do you support registration Haymarket?
Click to expand...

If it was done right - with proper protections - it could have the potential to be a valuable tool for law enforcement.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

haymarket said:
If it was done right - with proper protections - it could have the potential to be a valuable tool for law enforcement.
Click to expand...

it does nothing for public safety and there is no evidence of it having any value. that is objective evidence rather than the blatherings of police officers who are toeing the company line

we do know that registration costs gun owners money

it costs taxpayers

and it has been used for confiscation

and it cannot be enforced due to fifth amendment issues on those who are not allowed to own guns

and it is not constitutionally permitted of the federal government
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
I cannot help what you fail to understand as to state constitutions.

yes it could happen. but now that the Supreme court has extended the 2A to states it cannot.

I think you are not able to understand what the constitution really says or how to analyze it. none of you gun banners or gun restrictionists have ever made a rational argument that the federal government was actually delegated a power to control firearms
Click to expand...
'
holy crap dude
are you really stuck on stupid?
. you have lawmakers and educated people trying to get it therough your noggin
but you still resort to "they are just stupid people...cause I know best"
.
allw me to put your words in correct form
you
want it a certain way
and you get confused and befuddled when others don't think your way
you fele someones trying to take something away from you that you really never owned in the first place
you misconstrue even simple English
"The Second Amendment was based partially on the right to keep and bear arms in English common-law and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. Sir William Blackstone described this right as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state.[8]

In United States v. Cruikshank (1876), the Supreme Court of the United States ruled that, "The right to bear arms is not granted by the Constitution; neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence" and limited the applicability of the Second Amendment to the federal government.[9] In United States v. Miller (1939), the Supreme Court ruled that the federal government and the states could limit any weapon types not having a “reasonable relationship to the preservation or efficiency of a well regulated militia”.[
...
yeah yeah...we know
they are wrong YOU are right
.
so when you finally get that ten million man(woman and kiddies ...dogs and cats) army of yours on the same page
have you ever stopped to consider how many your going up against?
that have the very same weapons as you?
simple math time
theres 300 mill yanks of which its figured 80 % own firearms
and your army wishing to wage insurrection is only ten mill...so just how good is your math?
.
as another poster posted
I hope you have a plan "B"
♫ Oh, I wish I was in the land of cotton, Old times there are not forgotten,♫
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

mrmacq said:
'
holy crap dude
are you really stuck on stupid?
. you have lawmakers and educated people trying to get it therough your noggin
but you still resort to "they are just stupid people...cause I know best"
.
allw me to put your words in correct form
you
want it a certain way
and you get confused and befuddled when others don't think your way
you fele someones trying to take something away from you that you really never owned in the first place
you misconstrue even simple English
"The Second Amendment was based partially on the right to keep and bear arms in English common-law and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. Sir William Blackstone described this right as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state.[8]

In United States v. Cruikshank (1876), the Supreme Court of the United States ruled that, "The right to bear arms is not granted by the Constitution; neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence" and limited the applicability of the Second Amendment to the federal government.[9] In United States v. Miller (1939), the Supreme Court ruled that the federal government and the states could limit any weapon types not having a “reasonable relationship to the preservation or efficiency of a well regulated militia”.[
...
yeah yeah...we know
they are wrong YOU are right
.
so when you finally get that ten million man(woman and kiddies ...dogs and cats) army of yours on the same page
have you ever stopped to consider how many your going up against?
that have the very same weapons as you?
simple math time
theres 300 mill yanks of which its figured 80 % own firearms
and your army wishing to wage insurrection is only ten mill...so just how good is your math?
.
as another poster posted
I hope you have a plan "B"
♫ Oh, I wish I was in the land of cotton, Old times there are not forgotten,♫
Click to expand...

you apparently cannot remember what I said about cruikshank

the court said the right recognized was a PRE EXISTING RIGHT that was not CREATED By the 2A but merely recognized by it

I have no idea what the rest of your blather is about but it appears to be as erroneous as your claims about my views on Cruikshank
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

mrmacq said:
'
holy crap dude
are you really stuck on stupid?
. you have lawmakers and educated people trying to get it therough your noggin
but you still resort to "they are just stupid people...cause I know best"
.
allw me to put your words in correct form
you
want it a certain way
and you get confused and befuddled when others don't think your way
you fele someones trying to take something away from you that you really never owned in the first place
you misconstrue even simple English
"The Second Amendment was based partially on the right to keep and bear arms in English common-law and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. Sir William Blackstone described this right as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state.[8]

In United States v. Cruikshank (1876), the Supreme Court of the United States ruled that, "The right to bear arms is not granted by the Constitution; neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence" and limited the applicability of the Second Amendment to the federal government.[9] In United States v. Miller (1939), the Supreme Court ruled that the federal government and the states could limit any weapon types not having a “reasonable relationship to the preservation or efficiency of a well regulated militia”.[
...
yeah yeah...we know
they are wrong YOU are right
.
so when you finally get that ten million man(woman and kiddies ...dogs and cats) army of yours on the same page
have you ever stopped to consider how many your going up against?
that have the very same weapons as you?
simple math time
theres 300 mill yanks of which its figured 80 % own firearms
and your army wishing to wage insurrection is only ten mill...so just how good is your math?
.
as another poster posted
I hope you have a plan "B"
♫ Oh, I wish I was in the land of cotton, Old times there are not forgotten,♫
Click to expand...

If you want to include yourself with the "educated people", then you really should take a course in how to write simple prose, including, but not limited to, punctuation, sentence structure, and spelling.

You did bring up an interesting court case. I'd think that DC vs Heller would supersede it, but let's hear what Turtledude has to say about the case of US vs. Cruikshank.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
it does nothing for public safety and there is no evidence of it having any value. that is objective evidence rather than the blatherings of police officers who are toeing the company line

we do know that registration costs gun owners money

it costs taxpayers

and it has been used for confiscation

and it cannot be enforced due to fifth amendment issues on those who are not allowed to own guns

and it is not constitutionally permitted of the federal government
Click to expand...

You are talking through your hat. Come back and report on the results when we have a national system of registration combined with background checks on all weapons purchases. Until then - its you who are toeing the company line of the NRA and the gun lobby.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
you apparently cannot remember what I said about cruikshank

the court said the right recognized was a PRE EXISTING RIGHT that was not CREATED By the 2A but merely recognized by it

I have no idea what the rest of your blather is about but it appears to be as erroneous as your claims about my views on Cruikshank
Click to expand...

Apparently your love affair with one decision during the darker days of the Court is not shared by others here. A pre-existing right? So if belief in natural rights is a belief which exists only in somebodys head - just what right is it that is being exercised or used or enjoyed in the real world by real people?
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

haymarket said:
Apparently your love affair with one decision during the darker days of the Court is not shared by others here. A pre-existing right? So if belief in natural rights is a belief which exists only in somebodys head - just what right is it that is being exercised or used or enjoyed in the real world by real people?
Click to expand...

do you admit or deny that the bill of rights was premised on the concept of inalienable rights?
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

haymarket said:
You are talking through your hat. Come back and report on the results when we have a national system of registration combined with background checks on all weapons purchases. Until then - its you who are toeing the company line of the NRA and the gun lobby.
Click to expand...

I have no duty to justify why I don't support a proposed law that is unconstitutional

the ENTIRE BURDEN is on people like you to justify its existence

you cannot
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
do you admit or deny that the bill of rights was premised on the concept of inalienable rights?
Click to expand...

Define inalienable rights according to your belief system.
 
Re: Breaking: Investigators are responding to reported school shooting in Marysville,

TurtleDude said:
I have no duty to justify why I don't support a proposed law that is unconstitutional

the ENTIRE BURDEN is on people like you to justify its existence

you cannot
Click to expand...

How does one tell you that a system works that we do not yet have?

This is yet another example of how the supporters of the gun lobby ask for things to be proven that they know cannot be done because it is impossible to do so. And in doing so it is blatantly intellectually fraudulent to attempt such a tactic.

But tell us all Turtle - since you now concede that a belief in natural rights exists only in the belief system of the believer, can you explain how at the same time you can assert that these rights are "pre-existing" since a right which exists only as a belief cannot be exercised or used or enjoyed in reality in our world?
 
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