• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Shooting at Canadian Parlament

Grant said:
Yes, exactly! What they share is the same set of religious beliefs. Some sympathize with terrorists and most don't. I suggest that Canada does not play Islam roulette, hoping that the Muslim they invite to emigrate to Canada is not a terrorist, or a sympathizer.. Instead I suggest we look to other countries, with people who are keen to become good Canadians and share our common values. This is wrong?
Click to expand...

Uh, exactly how many agree with terrorist beliefs? Where are you figures?

How do a billion people all fit into an exact consensus of what their belief actually is, when such belief is, in reality, all the projection of these myriad individuals? Do you have any clue as to the figures we are talking about?

If you don't like roulette, maybe you don't want to do a Catholic roulette either. We know some Catholics are terrorists, although most aren't. So when we allow Catholics to enter the country, are we playing roulette with them?

Grant said:
Great idea!!
Click to expand...

I'm glad you agree. You can start by visiting your local library, and asking the librarian how you can get a good grounding in history, sociology, psychology, and with perhaps an extra dollop of fascism studies to start off with. Bring a lunch. And dinner.

Grant said:
His father is Syrian.
Click to expand...

Indeed, and that makes his crime what exactly...?
 
Ganesh said:
Uh, exactly how many agree with terrorist beliefs? Where are you figures?
Click to expand...
The World Preface | Pew Research Center's Religion & Public Life Project http://freethoughtblogs.com/taslima...11womens-oppressionsharia-lawshonor-killings/ If the subject interests you you can also do some research yourself.
How do a billion people all fit into an exact consensus of what their belief actually is, when such belief is, in reality, all the projection of these myriad individuals? Do you have any clue as to the figures we are talking about?
Click to expand...
Read the reports and learn.
If you don't like roulette, maybe you don't want to do a Catholic roulette either. We know some Catholics are terrorists, although most aren't. So when we allow Catholics to enter the country, are we playing roulette with them?
Click to expand...
You've wandered into the kiddy pool.
I'm glad you agree. You can start by visiting your local library, and asking the librarian how you can get a good grounding in history, sociology, psychology, and with perhaps an extra dollop of fascism studies to start off with. Bring a lunch. And dinner.
Click to expand...
Don't get snotty. It's me sending you some learning material.
Indeed, and that makes his crime what exactly...?
Click to expand...
A Muslim guilty of the murder of an innocent Canadian soldier.
 
Grant said:
Yes, exactly! What they share is the same set of religious beliefs. Some sympathize with terrorists and most don't. I suggest that Canada does not play Islam roulette, hoping that the Muslim they invite to emigrate to Canada is not a terrorist, or a sympathizer.. Instead I suggest we look to other countries, with people who are keen to become good Canadians and share our common values. This is wrong?
Click to expand...

It's a good thing Canadians reject your hateful premise.

B0wK1wFIMAEyZ-d.jpg:large


a-mosque-in-cold-lake-alberta-shown-in-this-handout-image-was-being-cleaned-u1.jpg
 
Grant said:
The World Preface | Pew Research Center's Religion & Public Life Project Unfortunately a large number of Muslims support terrorism,9/11,women’s oppression,sharia laws,honor killings If the subject interests you you can also do some research yourself.Read the reports and learn.You've wandered into the kiddy pool.Don't get snotty. It's me sending you some learning material.A Muslim guilty of the murder of an innocent Canadian soldier.
Click to expand...

Non-answers, dodges, changes of subject, and a link that merely shows that most attached to Islam are about at the level the west was in the 1950's.

If you are going to promote racist and bigoted notions on this site, you could at least have the courage to admit to your ideology. Adding cowardice to your list of descriptors hardly enhances your image.
 
Jetboogieman said:
It's a good thing Canadians reject your hateful premise.
Click to expand...
Am I dealing with children here??? It is radical Muslims who are doing the hating, not me and my fellow Canadians. It is the Jihadists who are murdering Canadians (and many others). You are talking as though all Muslims are terrorists, which they are not. Why is that so difficult to understand?

There are many of good Muslims, I am staying in a neighborhood full of them right now. BUT!!! There are Muslims who want to kill Canadians, as has been clearly demonstrated. Therefore, until all of this is resolved, there should be a moratorium on Muslim immigration. We cannot tell the difference between "Good" Muslims and "Bad" Muslims so we should be bringing in those who, as of this time in history, are not linked to Jihad or terrorism of any sort. Perhaps, after a step like this is taken, the "Good" Muslims will finally rise up, in a serious way, against those among them who are preaching hatreds.

Ugly protest, ugly response | Levant | Columnists | Opinion | Toronto Sun

Pro-Gaza protests worldwide tainted by anti-Semitism; Calgary organizer to apologize for violence | National Post

Why would we want to import these genuine hatreds, not your fabricated 'hate", to Canada???
 
Ganesh said:
Non-answers, dodges, changes of subject, and a link that merely shows that most attached to Islam are about at the level the west was in the 1950's.
Click to expand...
So you haven't read the research.
If you are going to promote racist and bigoted notions on this site, you could at least have the courage to admit to your ideology. Adding cowardice to your list of descriptors hardly enhances your image.
Click to expand...
Do you still not understand that Islam is not a race? Can you have your parents explain it to you perhaps?
 
Grant said:
Am I dealing with children here??? It is radical Muslims who are doing the hating, not me and my fellow Canadians. It is the Jihadists who are murdering Canadians (and many others). You are talking as though all Muslims are terrorists, which they are not. Why is that so difficult to understand?

There are many of good Muslims, I am staying in a neighborhood full of them right now. BUT!!! There are Muslims who want to kill Canadians, as has been clearly demonstrated. Therefore, until all of this is resolved, there should be a moratorium on Muslim immigration. We cannot tell the difference between "Good" Muslims and "Bad" Muslims so we should be bringing in those who, as of this time in history, are not linked to Jihad or terrorism of any sort. Perhaps, after a step like this is taken, the "Good" Muslims will finally rise up, in a serious way, against those among them who are preaching hatreds.

Ugly protest, ugly response | Levant | Columnists | Opinion | Toronto Sun

Pro-Gaza protests worldwide tainted by anti-Semitism; Calgary organizer to apologize for violence | National Post

Why would we want to import these genuine hatreds, not your fabricated 'hate", to Canada???
Click to expand...

So whats your excuse for the Moncton Shootings where more died?

You can't tell the difference between a good person or a bad person most of the time and you would seek to deny people the opportunity to come to this country based on one aspect of who they are as a person.

I could never and would never support such a position because it is inherently racist and wrong.
 
CRUE CAB said:
And this is what you get in a disarmed society.
Click to expand...

... this is what you get in an ignorant society....

Canada ranks 12th in arms per capita, with 30 guns per 100 (by comparison, the US is at 88 guns per hundred people, almost twice that of Switzerland)....

#12 - Canada | 15 nations with the highest gun ownership | Deseret News

Canada has 1/6 the rate of homicides by guns as the US (.51 per 100,000 vs. 3.21 per 100,000)...

The reason there was no carnage in the Parliament attack was the gun only held seven bullets.

Ottawa gunman used an illegally acquired 30-30 Winchester rifle: expert | Vancouver Observer

America has far more shootings per capita than our friends to the north. Apparently, what you get with an unarmed society is less gun violence...
 
upsideguy said:
... this is what you get in an ignorant society....

Canada ranks 12th in arms per capita, with 30 guns per 100 (by comparison, the US is at 88 guns per hundred people, almost twice that of Switzerland)....

#12 - Canada | 15 nations with the highest gun ownership | Deseret News

Canada has 1/6 the rate of homicides by guns as the US (.51 per 100,000 vs. 3.21 per 100,000)...

The reason there was no carnage in the Parliament attack was the gun only held seven bullets.

Ottawa gunman used an illegally acquired 30-30 Winchester rifle: expert | Vancouver Observer

America has far more shootings per capita than our friends to the north. Apparently, what you get with an unarmed society is less gun violence...
Click to expand...

What makes a the real difference between the countries are the social problems regarding race in the inner cities.. Remove the Black on Black violence and the stats become closer.

People of good faith will have to get together to resolve this issue, which has now become a crisis.
 
Jetboogieman said:
So whats your excuse for the Moncton Shootings where more died?

You can't tell the difference between a good person or a bad person most of the time and you would seek to deny people the opportunity to come to this country based on one aspect of who they are as a person.

I could never and would never support such a position because it is inherently racist and wrong.
Click to expand...
Race again???

What have you got against people from Chile? Why not allow them to enter Canada? Are you a racist? Or people from Taiwan? More racism??

The fact is that Canada can chose who can enter the country from anywhere around the world and they should not bring in those who might increase any social problems here. Brazilians don't condone Honor killings, etc., nor do people from the Philippines. Why not give them a chance to live and work in Canada?

Unfortunately a large number of Muslims support terrorism,9/11,women’s oppression,sharia laws,honor killings
 
Grant said:
So you haven't read the research.Do you still not understand that Islam is not a race? Can you have your parents explain it to you perhaps?
Click to expand...

I have indeed read your piece. Some of the key points are: although most Muslims feel strongly about their religion, they also believe that others should follow their own beliefs in peace. Although many support Sharia law, the vast majority do not support the most violent interpretations of it, and most support it in mostly civil decisions, as apposed to criminal ones. Most support modern science and western culture. Those that have the most regressive views are, not surprisingly, located in the most backward and uneducated locations, or in some cases ongoing war zones, with some consequently hardened views.

Many of the attitudes expressed were not much different from where the west was a few decades ago, and where many regions still are to this date.

As for race, your are playing with semantics in order to avoid unfavorable judgement on your views, which I guess you cannot find the fortitude to openly support.

"..It’s difficult to discuss prejudice without clarifying what it is. The fourth edition of the American Heritage College Dictionary provides four meanings for the term—from “an adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge or examination of the facts” to “irrational suspicion or hatred of a particular group, race or religion.” Both definitions apply to the experiences of ethnic minorities in Western society. Of course, the second definition sounds much more menacing than the first, but prejudice in either capacity has the potential to cause a great deal of damage..."

What Is Racial Prejudice? – Definition & Examples
 
Grant said:
Race again???

What have you got against people from Chile? Why not allow them to enter Canada? Are you a racist? Or people from Taiwan? More racism??

The fact is that Canada can chose who can enter the country from anywhere around the world and they should not bring in those who might increase any social problems here. Brazilians don't condone Honor killings, etc., nor do people from the Philippines. Why not give them a chance to live and work in Canada?

Unfortunately a large number of Muslims support terrorism,9/11,women’s oppression,sharia laws,honor killings
Click to expand...

Free though blogs?

5 second google search again.

People come from all over the world to live in Canada including every country you just mentioned, a huge chunk of my town is Philipino, not just muslims and there is absolutely no data to suggest that they cause more social issues than any other group we let into the country.

I am an Immigrant from Britain and South Africa and my wife is Japanese and we have made a life here.

How would it ever be acceptable to have denied us that if one of us had happened to be muslim.

You can twist it any way you want, but your position is based on nothing more than fear, xenophobia and lies.

We must confront and defeat radical Islam wherever it thrives but I refuse to believe that we must set the house on fire to save it, that is abandon our principles of fairness, tolerance, equality, multiculturalism and freedom to satisfy the fears of a few hate mongerers like you and piss on the very principles we'll be claiming to protect by discriminating.
 
Grant said:
What makes a the real difference between the countries are the social problems regarding race in the inner cities.. Remove the Black on Black violence and the stats become closer.

People of good faith will have to get together to resolve this issue, which has now become a crisis.
Click to expand...

Ahh never fails ... racism at its worst..
 
Grant said:
Race again???

What have you got against people from Chile? Why not allow them to enter Canada? Are you a racist? Or people from Taiwan? More racism??

The fact is that Canada can chose who can enter the country from anywhere around the world and they should not bring in those who might increase any social problems here. Brazilians don't condone Honor killings, etc., nor do people from the Philippines. Why not give them a chance to live and work in Canada?

Unfortunately a large number of Muslims support terrorism,9/11,women’s oppression,sharia laws,honor killings
Click to expand...

The very first item on your quoted list suggests that 20% of British Muslims approved of the subway bombing there. Of course, a closer examination reveals that 20% actually said that they thought they could "understand the feelings and motivations" of the bomber, but also that 99% absolutely opposed their actions.

I think I can "understand the feelings and motivations" of the bomber. Some strong psychopathic tendencies, a low IQ, a strong need to make a pathetic life have some meaning, and an uninformed and misguided understanding of world geopolitics. I would likely have replied in the same fashion to that question.

Need we read any further in your 90 second find?
 
Ganesh said:
I have indeed read your piece. Some of the key points are: although most Muslims feel strongly about their religion, they also believe that others should follow their own beliefs in peace. Although many support Sharia law, the vast majority do not support the most violent interpretations of it, and most support it in mostly civil decisions, as apposed to criminal ones. Most support modern science and western culture. Those that have the most regressive views are, not surprisingly, located in the most backward and uneducated locations, or in some cases ongoing war zones, with some consequently hardened views.

Many of the attitudes expressed were not much different from where the west was a few decades ago, and where many regions still are to this date.

As for race, your are playing with semantics in order to avoid unfavorable judgement on your views, which I guess you cannot find the fortitude to openly support.

"..It’s difficult to discuss prejudice without clarifying what it is. The fourth edition of the American Heritage College Dictionary provides four meanings for the term—from “an adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge or examination of the facts” to “irrational suspicion or hatred of a particular group, race or religion.” Both definitions apply to the experiences of ethnic minorities in Western society. Of course, the second definition sounds much more menacing than the first, but prejudice in either capacity has the potential to cause a great deal of damage..."

What Is Racial Prejudice? – Definition & Examples
Click to expand...

Right. Most Muslims are peace-loving, etc. We know that. Unfortunately we don't know who the non-peaceful Muslims are.

The argument can't be made that we should not allow immigrants in because of their race, sex, etc. but it is our responsibility to say no to people who intend to murder Canadians.

ISIS urges jihadists to attack Canadians: ‘You will not feel secure in your bedrooms’ | National Post

Rather than stigmatizing Canada it would be making a stand against those who who treat women third class citizens, who support FGM, honor killings, and so on. Ask Western Europeans how they feel about the changes in their cultures since Muslims began arriving in large numbers. There are just too many people in the world who want to call Canada home and who are no danger to Canadian citizens. These are the people we should be looking at as future Canadians.

Or people like her. BBC News - Malala: The girl who was shot for going to school
 
Jetboogieman said:
Free though blogs?

5 second google search again.

People come from all over the world to live in Canada including every country you just mentioned, a huge chunk of my town is Philipino, not just muslims and there is absolutely no data to suggest that they cause more social issues than any other group we let into the country.

I am an Immigrant from Britain and South Africa and my wife is Japanese and we have made a life here.

How would it ever be acceptable to have denied us that if one of us had happened to be muslim.

You can twist it any way you want, but your position is based on nothing more than fear, xenophobia and lies.

We must confront and defeat radical Islam wherever it thrives but I refuse to believe that we must set the house on fire to save it, that is abandon our principles of fairness, tolerance, equality, multiculturalism and freedom to satisfy the fears of a few hate mongerers like you and piss on the very principles we'll be claiming to protect by discriminating.
Click to expand...
Yes, people do come from all over the world to live in Canada. You seem to have a flair for the obvious.

A commitment to fairness and tolerance does not include those who are unfair, intolerant, and who intend to create terrorism in Canada. It is the Muslims, by the wway, who are spreading hate. not me. It is Muslim men who are abusing women and young girls, who don;t allow women to go out on their own, who often murder little girls with their FGM operations. We have to speak out against this rather than blindly accepting this backward behavior. About the Film | Honor Diaries - A Film About Women's Rights

And you think this is about race???
 
It kinda pisses me off that Canadians are treating this "consistent" nonsense as a 9/11 type thing...

The Canadians need to zip it and forget about it.

This type of **** happens almost every week in the US but Canada finds it 9/11-ish???
 
Ganesh said:
The very first item on your quoted list suggests that 20% of British Muslims approved of the subway bombing there. Of course, a closer examination reveals that 20% actually said that they thought they could "understand the feelings and motivations" of the bomber, but also that 99% absolutely opposed their actions. I think I can "understand the feelings and motivations" of the bomber. Some strong psychopathic tendencies, a low IQ, a strong need to make a pathetic life have some meaning, and an uninformed and misguided understanding of world geopolitics. I would likely have replied in the same fashion to that question. Need we read any further in your 90 second find?
Click to expand...
The blog was breaking down the research. You can do the research yourself if you find that information faulty. using your stats then, erroneous though they are, what does 1% of Muslims mean in real numbers?

This deals with international numbers.

Where Terrorism Finds Support in the Muslim World | Pew Research Center's Global Attitudes Project
 
PeteEU said:
Ahh never fails ... racism at its worst..
Click to expand...

why do left-wingers call facts "racist"

black on black crime in the USA skews our numbers. Whites in America have lower rates of violent gun crime than whites in many nations that have idiotic anti gun policies
 
Grant said:
Yes, exactly! What they share is the same set of religious beliefs. Some sympathize with terrorists and most don't. I suggest that Canada does not play Islam roulette, hoping that the Muslim they invite to emigrate to Canada is not a terrorist, or a sympathizer.. Instead I suggest we look to other countries, with people who are keen to become good Canadians and share our common values. This is wrong?
Great idea!!His father is Syrian.
Click to expand...

No, they don't "share the same set of religious beliefs," unless you also feel all sects of Christianity or Judaism "share the same set of religious beliefs."

Shia Muslims, Sunni Muslims, Sufis, et. al. have wildly different interpretations of the Quran, and there's subsects within those sects (say, Wahabbists has a subsect of Sunnis) who have even MORE different interpretations.

Claiming all Muslims "share the same set of religious beliefs" is like claiming that Jim Jones, Billy Graham, Pope Francis and Thomas Monson "share the same set of religious beliefs."
 
Mr.Nick said:
It kinda pisses me off that Canadians are treating this "consistent" nonsense as a 9/11 type thing... The Canadians need to zip it and forget about it. This type of **** happens almost every week in the US but Canada finds it 9/11-ish???
Click to expand...
That it happens almost every week in the US is not a great endorsement of US policies. Maybe Canada should try a different approach.
 
Kobie said:
No, they don't "share the same set of religious beliefs," unless you feel all sects of Christianity or Judaism "share the same set of religious beliefs." Shia Muslims, Sunni Muslims, Sufis, et. al. have wildly different interpretations of the Quran, and there's subsects within those sects (say, Wahabbists has a subsect of Sunnis) who have even MORE different interpretations. Claiming all Muslims "share the same set of religious beliefs" is like claiming that Jim Jones, Billy Graham, Pope Francis and Thomas Monson "share the same set of religious beliefs."
Click to expand...
Yes, there are different interpretations in the teachings of the Koran, just as there is in the Bible. But of course Christians are not killing each other in defense of their beliefs, as are Muslims.
 
TurtleDude said:
why do left-wingers call facts "racist". black on black crime in the USA skews our numbers. Whites in America have lower rates of violent gun crime than whites in many nations that have idiotic anti gun policies
Click to expand...
While that is clearly true this fact is supposed to remain unspoken lest Blacks be offended, or charges of 'racism' are raised. It is this ignorance of the facts and therefore the inability to do anything about it, that will ensure Black on Black crime continues. As we see on this thread, "Racism" is the laziest (and most foolish) charge possible to try and make a point.
 
Grant said:
That it happens almost every week in the US is not a great endorsement of US policies. Maybe Canada should try a different approach.
Click to expand...

I'm not endorsing anything I'm stating facts.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom