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ISIS Boasts Air Strikes are not Effective

US Conservative said:
Dog and pony shows can be effective political stunts, and thats all this is. Obama going to war for the senate.
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Yup.

And he might be a hero for "winning" a "ten year war" a week before the election.

That's my conspiracy theory anyhow.
 
US Conservative said:
So then give me the option with the least amount of "rule" by others. Thats not a direct democracy.
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Like like being ruled by a warlord or the church?

That's pretty much what happens when we don't have a strong central government.
 
So it looks like ISIS, Boehner and Ron Paul are all in agreement. Why doesn't it surprise me that conservatives find allies among violent fundamentalists?
 
US Conservative said:
I mean not willing to fight the war Obama has committed to fighting-if he does not have the resolve he should never have gone in, hes been anti-war since his earliest days.

This is all for politics-he wants a war to win the senate. It wont work.
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Resolve? His resolve is to impose massive social change here at home. I don't think he has much interest in foreign affairs. And I also don't think that he fundamentally "gets it."
 
nota bene said:
Resolve? His resolve is to impose massive social change here at home. I don't think he has much interest in foreign affairs. And I also don't think that he fundamentally "gets it."
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You are of course right. Any actions there are only meant for politics here, he could not care less.
 
The ISIS "source" could be a CIA guy reciting a statement written by a CIA propagandist to encourage the American public to support the commitment of western troops on the ground. In fact, such a scam to sell the new re-branded war to America is entirely likely.
 
US Conservative said:
You are of course right. Any actions there are only meant for politics here, he could not care less.
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Only a graduate of the finest schools America has to offer would feel smart enough, and superior enough, to want to change the most successful democracy in the history of the world.
 
And yet another thread turns into a giant anti-Obama daisy chain involving the usual suspects. You're going to start chafing at this rate.
 
Cryptic said:
Here is an ISIS fighter boasting that the air strikes are not militarily effective.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/29/world/meast/isis-fighter-and-defector-interviews/index.

Sadly, he is probably right. ISIS is an army of militiamen operating is relatively small groups whose main armoured vehicles are pick up trucks turned into Mad Max style "technicals". Most supplies- and they dont need alot, are requisitioned from the locals (voluntarily, forcibly or coerced) and transported in individual civilian trucks. Likewise, there are not alot of easily demarcated front lines in the fighting.

As the similarily orgainized Serbs demonstrated in Kosovo, these types of forces mix in with civilians and can be very difficult to identify and stop. Then factor in that ISIS includes members who are veterans of both Iraq and Afghan conflicts who probably have a long list produced list of "dos and donts" produced by Darwinism when it comes to avoiding precision airstrikes.

In short, my guess is that effective air strikes need US spotters on the ground.
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Breaking news....the enemy declares their foes actions are ineffective.
 
US Conservative said:
First, we dont live in a direct democracy, and second, dems in battleground states after years of railing against IRAQ as doves are suddenly hawks. These are actual congressional reps, not me.

Explain to me the democrat way.
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Dont you know? Obama and the democrats are neocons.
 
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Grant said:
Only a graduate of the finest schools America has to offer would feel smart enough, and superior enough, to want to change the most successful democracy in the history of the world.
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He's gonna inform you that the US "is not a democracy, we are a republic".

That's on page 21 of the conservative debate manual, listed under "statements to cloud the issue with when you are losing an argument". You watch.
 
Grant said:
Only a graduate of the finest schools America has to offer would feel smart enough, and superior enough, to want to change the most successful democracy in the history of the world.
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Despite the lefts track record, they still insist they know utopia is just a few laws away. Its magical thinking.
 
imagep said:
Yup.

And he might be a hero for "winning" a "ten year war" a week before the election.

That's my conspiracy theory anyhow.
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I don't know about 'winning' it but like taking credit for Bush's negotiated Iraqi withdrawal, I'm sure he will at least claim it to be so. And that will be enough for his chickenheads.
 
imagep said:
He's gonna inform you that the US "is not a democracy, we are a republic".

That's on page 21 of the conservative debate manual, listed under "statements to cloud the issue with when you are losing an argument". You watch.
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Tell it! :monkey
 
VanceMack said:
I don't know about 'winning' it but like taking credit for Bush's negotiated Iraqi withdrawal, I'm sure he will at least claim it to be so. And that will be enough for his chickenheads.
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It will be Obama's "Mission Accomplished" moment, just prior to the election.

At least that's my theory.

Might not turn out to be such a success long term, but by most accounts I am reading, this war is winding down fast. One Air Force General was just quoted as saying something to the effect of "ISIS is having difficulty gathering troops", and actionable targets are apparently becoming scarce.
 
Cryptic said:
Here is an ISIS fighter boasting that the air strikes are not militarily effective.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/29/world/meast/isis-fighter-and-defector-interviews/index.

Sadly, he is probably right. ISIS is an army of militiamen operating is relatively small groups whose main armoured vehicles are pick up trucks turned into Mad Max style "technicals". Most supplies- and they dont need alot, are requisitioned from the locals (voluntarily, forcibly or coerced) and transported in individual civilian trucks. Likewise, there are not alot of easily demarcated front lines in the fighting.

As the similarily orgainized Serbs demonstrated in Kosovo, these types of forces mix in with civilians and can be very difficult to identify and stop. Then factor in that ISIS includes members who are veterans of both Iraq and Afghan conflicts who probably have a long list produced list of "dos and donts" produced by Darwinism when it comes to avoiding precision airstrikes.

In short, my guess is that effective air strikes need US spotters on the ground.
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That explains the propaganda war to get us to stop.
 
imagep said:
It will be Obama's "Mission Accomplished" moment, just prior to the election.

At least that's my theory.

Might not turn out to be such a success long term, but by most accounts I am reading, this war is winding down fast. One Air Force General was just quoted as saying something to the effect of "ISIS is having difficulty gathering troops", and actionable targets are apparently becoming scarce.
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:lamo "war"

After several Missions the Brits actually dropped a bomb. Yay...war.

Are we at war BTW?
 
VanceMack said:
:lamo "war"

After several Missions the Brits actually dropped a bomb. Yay...war.

Are we at war BTW?
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The media has hyped up the evilness and the power and strength of ISIS to the American public. You have Fox News which spent weeks ranting about Christians being persecuted by ISIS, and idiots like Rep. Trent Franks and Gov. Rick Perry, Lou Barletta, and Marco Rubio who have all been claiming that ISIS is planning on attacking us. That Franks guy claimed that we know it to be a fact that ISIS "we know that ISIS is present in Ciudad Juarez or they were within the last few weeks..."

Apparently, conservatives like to have an enemy, a boogyman that they can be afraid of, and conservative politicians have jumped on this chance to turn ISIS into that boogyman.

As far as the majority of our dumb arse citizens know, ISIS is the biggest threat that the US has ever seen, and they perceive our airstrikes against ISIS as being a war.

It's almost a reverse "wag the dog" scenario.

Republicans need to ridicule and criticize and attempt to control Obama, so republicans create the worst ever evil villan (by exagerating the threat and power of ISIS), and "force" Obama to combat that enemy.

Obama needs a big win, so he sit's back goes along with the game (knowing all along what the conservative goal is). He is then (apparently) "drug" into this war, doesn't have a plan then comes up with a plan, and wins a "10 year war" in just 10 weeks. A pretty spectacular win at that (based upon the median and conservatives exagerating this enemy to no end), with zero or limited US military casualties. Obama becomes a national hero, and centrist and independent voters show up in drove to vote conservative idiots out of office.
 
imagep said:
The media has hyped up the evilness and the power and strength of ISIS to the American public. You have Fox News which spent weeks ranting about Christians being persecuted by ISIS, and idiots like Rep. Trent Franks and Gov. Rick Perry, Lou Barletta, and Marco Rubio who have all been claiming that ISIS is planning on attacking us. That Franks guy claimed that we know it to be a fact that ISIS "we know that ISIS is present in Ciudad Juarez or they were within the last few weeks..."

Apparently, conservatives like to have an enemy, a boogyman that they can be afraid of, and conservative politicians have jumped on this chance to turn ISIS into that boogyman.

As far as the majority of our dumb arse citizens know, ISIS is the biggest threat that the US has ever seen, and they perceive our airstrikes against ISIS as being a war.

It's almost a reverse "wag the dog" scenario.

Republicans need to ridicule and criticize and attempt to control Obama, so republicans create the worst ever evil villan (by exagerating the threat and power of ISIS), and "force" Obama to combat that enemy.

Obama needs a big win, so he sit's back goes along with the game (knowing all along what the conservative goal is). He is then (apparently) "drug" into this war, doesn't have a plan then comes up with a plan, and wins a "10 year war" in just 10 weeks. A pretty spectacular win at that (based upon the median and conservatives exagerating this enemy to no end), with zero or limited US military casualties. Obama becomes a national hero, and centrist and independent voters show up in drove to vote conservative idiots out of office.
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:lamo

Of COURSE. ISIS isn't evil all on it's own. The butchering of children...well...that was bad but not THAT bad. And poor Obama and all those democrats clamoring for action...they would REALLY prefer to be statesmen, but Fox News and the republicans are MAKING them go to war.

It's not their fault.

:lamo

So...is that a yes or no? Are we at war?
 
VanceMack said:
:lamo

Of COURSE. ISIS isn't evil all on it's own. The butchering of children...well...that was bad but not THAT bad. And poor Obama and all those democrats clamoring for action...they would REALLY prefer to be statesmen, but Fox News and the republicans are MAKING them go to war.

It's not their fault.

:lamo

So...is that a yes or no? Are we at war?
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Of course ISIS is evil, but I suspect that it's not nearly as large or as powerful as it has been recently hyped up to be. The largest estimate that I have seen is that they maybe have as many as 85,000 strong supporters, of whom maybe less than half are actually combatants. The idea that this force would be able to conquer the world, and to invade the US, is ludicrous.

Obviously this isn't an "all out WW2" type war effort, but yes, if we are using our military to bomb other countries, I would say that we are at war (more or less), even if an official declaration of war hasn't been voted on by congress (which is constitutionally required for it to be officially a war).

Part of the issue I have with the far right mindset is that you guys can only see black and white. You seem to have this psychological or emotional need to determine absolutes. Few things in this world are absolute, there are varying degrees of almost everything.
 
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imagep said:
Of course ISIS is evil, but I suspect that it's not nearly as large or as powerful as it has been recently hyped up to be. The largest estimate that I have seen is that they maybe have as many as 85,000 strong supporters, of whom maybe less than half are actually combatants. The idea that this force would be able to conquer the world, and to invade the US, is ludicrous.

Obviously this isn't an "all out WW2" type war effort, but yes, if we are using our military to bomb other countries, I would say that we are at war (more or less), even if an official declaration of war hasn't been voted on by congress (which is constitutionally required for it to be officially a war).

Part of the issue I have with the far right mindset is that you guys can only see black and white. You seem to have this psychological or emotional need to determine absolutes. Few things in this world are absolute, there are varying degrees of almost everything.
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So you are on record as saying Obama is such a limp impotent bitch that he allows himself to order military strikes because of Fox News. That all the democrats demanding action aren't doing so because they believe in their words but because they have been goaded into it.

I think that's a weird mixture of pathetic and funny as Hell.

Great. So...we are war. And how do you win a war? What is the end game? Who is the enemy?
 
VanceMack said:
So you are on record as saying Obama is such a limp impotent bitch that he allows himself to order military strikes because of Fox News. That all the democrats demanding action aren't doing so because they believe in their words but because they have been goaded into it.

I think that's a weird mixture of pathetic and funny as Hell.
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Sometimes things just come together, without even having a plan, and sometimes even well made plans end up backfiring.

I'm saying that all he had to do is to sit back and watch those on the right inadvertantly make him a hero.

And yes, it is "a weird mixture of pathetic and funny as Hell." I'm glad we could agree on that part.
 
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