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Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents[W:76]

Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

It's not "some people" who don't like cops. It's most people.

And yet you refuse to acknowledge that this disapproval might actually stem from the behavior of police... I don't personally know what the proportion is, but I know it isn't arbitrary, nor does it reflect some kind of moral failing on the part of the general public. Police don't do the same job they used to do, and they don't do it the same way, and the people of this nation don't approve of these changes.

I've been on police forums, and the notion that the community is "the boss" always gets a good chuckle from the leo members there.

Then they have lost sight of the mission they are tasked with.

Actually that's a broad brush. There are conservatives that are against police abuse as well. I realise most of them here on this board are fine with it, its mostly conservative libertarians that take issue with it.

It's still very strange how the most vocal anti-government people are often those most supportive of government agents (police) even when they are engaging in the exact kind of tyranny that these people are most vocally against. It seems that government tyranny is acceptable on a local level to them, as well when it is directed towards people they deem inferior, which is usually poor blacks.

Saw on the internet news somewhere that some people have filed a $40 million lawsuit against officers who were in Ferguson trying to control the crowds, stems from officers ordering a mother and child in a Mc D's restaurant onto the floor while they were purchasing ice cream, they were cuffed and hauled away for asking why they were told to leave and why they were being ordered around, since they weren't the ones causing the so called trouble.

Exactly the sort of thing that police should not be able to do. They are not there to issue orders. They are there to uphold the law. That means if they want to control you, move you, arrest you, detain you, or threaten you, they need probable cause and a warrant. There is no excuse for police threatening and hurting innocent people like this. If there isn't enough information and no obvious immediate danger, the police should withdraw.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

And yet you refuse to acknowledge that this disapproval might actually stem from the behavior of police... I don't personally know what the proportion is, but I know it isn't arbitrary, nor does it reflect some kind of moral failing on the part of the general public. Police don't do the same job they used to do, and they don't do it the same way, and the people of this nation don't approve of these changes.



Then they have lost sight of the mission they are tasked with.



It's still very strange how the most vocal anti-government people are often those most supportive of government agents (police) even when they are engaging in the exact kind of tyranny that these people are most vocally against. It seems that government tyranny is acceptable on a local level to them, as well when it is directed towards people they deem inferior, which is usually poor blacks.



Exactly the sort of thing that police should not be able to do. They are not there to issue orders. They are there to uphold the law. That means if they want to control you, move you, arrest you, detain you, or threaten you, they need probable cause and a warrant. There is no excuse for police threatening and hurting innocent people like this. If there isn't enough information and no obvious immediate danger, the police should withdraw.

Don't know if the media had actually reported on exact number arrested and detained during those demonstrations, but there could be many more lawsuits filed against Ferguson and St Louis county police too.

Speaking of detaining, years ago, living in Chicago, I was detained on several occasions, and had my car searched by CPD, and asked questions like what are you doing in this neighborhood. News reported that St Louis county cops have done that type of thing scores of times, according to federal lawsuits filed over the years. I can't say their motives, but profiling comes to my mind.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Then they have lost sight of the mission they are tasked with.

They're well aware that everything they post is public so they keep it clean and civil for the most part, but they really don't bother hiding their impression of non-leo's as being childlike, without moral compass and in need of being controlled.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

They're well aware that everything they post is public so they keep it clean and civil for the most part, but they really don't bother hiding their impression of non-leo's as being childlike, without moral compass and in need of being controlled.

Then they have no business being tasked with upholding the laws of a democratic nation.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Then they have no business being tasked with upholding the laws of a democratic nation.

I don't know. I've always heard that the job attracts essentially three different elements.

1). The Clock Puncher. This is the guy you want to have to deal with if you're ever in the unfortunate position of having to deal with cops. This guy doesn't need to make a point, he's just there to do his job. He'll also be more willing to use discretion and let something slide if an offense is too trivial to make a big deal out of.
2). The Napolean. You don't want this guy. But suffice it to say that any time a news story comes out about a cop doing something morally repugnant, safe odds are that it's going to be a Napolean.
3). The Holy Roller. You don't want this guy either, but he's preferable to the Napolean. Basically he see himself as the one thing that stands between civilization and chaos, and is always proving that point. He'll give you a ticket or throw your ass in jail because that's just the right thing to do, and that's the end of any discussion. I got a ticket by one of these for an absolute bull**** thing once, and I can't believe I didn't contest it.

But the one thread that ties all of these together is authority. You will respect their authoritah or you're going to have a bad day.
 
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Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Did you post this seriously?

What does the context of my post tell you?
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Yep, any displays of humanity while wearing a badge makes you a worthless waste of oxygen. Maybe if we're lucky, they'll do the honorable thing, right? When was the last time someone expressed sadness over a cop losing his/her life or acknowledging a job well done? Actually, getting away from law enforcement is probably the best thing to happen to them. I swear they should all just walk off the job since almost nobody gives a **** about what happens to them anyway.

Agree completely. An officer let how he felt in a tense situation slip out. Did he shoot anyone, did he assault anyone? No! I dispised a lot of people I use to sell Flooring to, but I did not go out back with their flooring and slice it all up with a carpet knife. To me, this is a knee jerk overreaction by the police department. It also shows they don't really care about how a tense situation could potentially effect their officers emotionally.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

How is demilitarization of the police supposed to work? Give them BB guns, or what?

Anything beyond handguns and perhaps shotguns goes only to SWAT teams and SWAT teams are restricted to dealing only with truly highly dangerous situations - not crowd control or serving warrants for drug possession.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

How is demilitarization of the police supposed to work? Give them BB guns, or what?

The militarization of the police refers to arming them with weapons and other gear specifically created to combat armed enemies of the state as opposed to citizens. So that right there should help to answer your question.
 
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Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

You don't get it, they are protecting and serving the community FROM the worthless wastes of oxygen and their actions. You want it the other way around apparently. The protesters, the rioters, they ARE worthless wastes who destroy lives and property.

Just because you've deemed these people wastes of life it does not give the police the authority to be abusive, to point weapons at unarmed people etc. if the cops can't control their anger they shouldn't have access to weapons. I know if I pointed my handgun at an unarmed person and threatened to kill them it would rightfully be taken away from me forever and I'd be locked up. Why the double standard for cops?
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Just because you've deemed these people wastes of life it does not give the police the authority to be abusive, to point weapons at unarmed people etc. if the cops can't control their anger they shouldn't have access to weapons. I know if I pointed my handgun at an unarmed person and threatened to kill them it would rightfully be taken away from me forever and I'd be locked up. Why the double standard for cops?

So you equate you walking up to someone on the street you don't know and pointing a firearm at them to..... being called out to the scene where people are robbing and shooting other people as the same thing?
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

So you equate you walking up to someone on the street you don't know and pointing a firearm at them to..... being called out to the scene where people are robbing and shooting other people as the same thing?

As far as I know the protester the cop pointed his weapon at and threatened to shoot had broken no laws nor was that individual threatening the cop.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

As far as I know the protester the cop pointed his weapon at and threatened to shoot had broken no laws nor was that individual threatening the cop.

That was not my point. My point was that the comparison made above was completely ignorant. I do believe the cop should be disciplined, but I think firing him was a bit to far.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

That was not my point. My point was that the comparison made above was completely ignorant. I do believe the cop should be disciplined, but I think firing him was a bit to far.

Why is it ignorant? If anything the cop should be treated more harshly because he's an agent of the state who abused his authority.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Why is it ignorant? If anything the cop should be treated more harshly because he's an agent of the state who abused his authority.

Or.... he had a human reaction to an azzhole.... But again, cops cant be human.. They should be cyborgs with absolutely no emotion.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Or.... he had a human reaction to an azzhole.... But again, cops cant be human.. They should be cyborgs with absolutely no emotion.


There is no room for anger in law enforcement. Cops who cannot keep their anger in check need to find different careers - ones where their anger won't get people killed or lives ruined.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Still think only the police should have guns? That is the liberal position, isn't it?

Don't lie and try to put words in my mouth. I have never said anything even remotely close to that. I happen to have a concealed carry license, and own guns. The only thing I have ever said is that background checks are needed.
 
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The relationship between the police and the residents in Ferguson has been forever poisoned.
The only solution is to fire all the police there including the chief and disband the department.
Then hire all new police officers and start a new department as was done in the nearby town of Jennings a few years ago.
Wilson will understand ...
He was one of them.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Agree completely. An officer let how he felt in a tense situation slip out. Did he shoot anyone, did he assault anyone? No! I dispised a lot of people I use to sell Flooring to, but I did not go out back with their flooring and slice it all up with a carpet knife. To me, this is a knee jerk overreaction by the police department. It also shows they don't really care about how a tense situation could potentially effect their officers emotionally.

I bet you didn't tell the people you sold flooring to to go **** themselves, like this officer did.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

OK I was gone from the board for 2 weeks and thus I haven't seen all the posts regarding Ferguson. However, as far as I can tell, in all the posts on DP about all the things that happened in Ferguson no one has posted even a word about the officers who went home after their duty shift and baked batches of cookies and handed them out to protesters the next day.

I think they should have gotten store-bought cookies...homemade cookies have to many germs. Yuck.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

There is no room for anger in law enforcement. Cops who cannot keep their anger in check need to find different careers - ones where their anger won't get people killed or lives ruined.

There is no room for anger in protests. Protesters who cannot keep their anger in check should not participate. There is no room where their anger can get people killed, destroy private property and ruin a private business.

Yes, we have a right to peacefull protest. Yet, seems not to long ago Bundy supporters were armed and did point weapons as LE. How about the people in Ferguson who broke into stores to loot. Should they not be held accountable?

People should be held accountable for their actions no matter what they are doing on or off work.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

While I do not agree with the actions of many of the protestors (in fact, I don't really agree with the protests to begin with considering I feel they jumped the gun big time here), I do agree with the disciplinary actions against these two police officers. Both showed they had the wrong tempers and attitudes for the job from their actions.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

I don't know. I've always heard that the job attracts essentially three different elements.

1). The Clock Puncher. This is the guy you want to have to deal with if you're ever in the unfortunate position of having to deal with cops. This guy doesn't need to make a point, he's just there to do his job. He'll also be more willing to use discretion and let something slide if an offense is too trivial to make a big deal out of.
2). The Napolean. You don't want this guy. But suffice it to say that any time a news story comes out about a cop doing something morally repugnant, safe odds are that it's going to be a Napolean.
3). The Holy Roller. You don't want this guy either, but he's preferable to the Napolean. Basically he see himself as the one thing that stands between civilization and chaos, and is always proving that point. He'll give you a ticket or throw your ass in jail because that's just the right thing to do, and that's the end of any discussion. I got a ticket by one of these for an absolute bull**** thing once, and I can't believe I didn't contest it.

None of that is an excuse for violating the law that they are charged to uphold. If someone wants to be a cop, they need to be of sterner stuff. They need to be held to the highest of standards.

But the one thread that ties all of these together is authority. You will respect their authoritah or you're going to have a bad day.

Which is the exact wrong attitude that police should have.
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

Don't lie and try to put words in my mouth. I have never said anything even remotely close to that. I happen to have a concealed carry license, and own guns. The only thing I have ever said is that background checks are needed.

Well, maybe not you personally....but it seems to be the popular liberal position, does it not?
 
Re: Police officer resigns, another is fired after Ferguson incidents

I don't have the answer to those questions, but can tell you this from past experiences.

1. military service trained people years ago on how to accept people for what they are, and to accept diversity.

2. when employed with the Navy as a civilian, pre employment training was a requirement on how to accept people for who they were and what they did. Dealing with ethnicity and other aspects of acceptance. How to handle harassment in the working environment, how to report it, etc..

Don't know if either still have classes on any of this, but I believe civilians, or cops employed by city, state and county governments could use some pages out of the federal guidelines book.

Some of the most important lessons to be learned from these sensitivity classes is how to deal with peoples emotions, and to be a good listener and to try to help. Not to involve yourself into squabbles, to control your emotions, most exercising self control, not to over react to certain situations.

It takes time and money to train people, some communities seem quick to hand out authority without any schooling or training to back it up.

Seems like a great idea. I can't believe there isn't something like this in place already.
 
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