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Ukraine accuses Russia of launching invasion

Actually a lot of the populace wanted to go with the EU and cried foul when Russian's puppet didn't.



In 2012, the EU initialled deals on free trade and political association with Ukraine; however, EU leaders stated that these agreements would not be ratified unless Ukraine addresses concerns over a "stark deterioration of democracy and the rule of law", including the imprisonment of Yulia Tymoshenko and Yuriy Lutsenko in 2011 and 2012.[2][3][4][nb 1] Deadlines where set for Ukraine to carry out the required changes to its justice and electoral systems in order to enable the formal signing of their agreements with the EU in Vilnius on 29 November 2013.[8] But although the then Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych had urged the Ukrainian parliament to adopt laws so that Ukraine could meet the EU's criteria,[9][10][nb 2] the Ukrainian government suspended preparations for signing the association agreement on 21 November 2013.[6][12] Yanukovych still attended the aforementioned EU summit in Vilnius on 28–29 November 2013 where the association agreement was originally planned to be signed but it was not.[9][13] The decision to put off signing the association agreement led to large, widespread protests in Ukraine.[14] These led to the removal of Yanukovych and his government by parliament after the 2014 Ukrainian revolution in February 2014.[6][15] Since then Ukraine is in turmoil because of the 2014 Crimean crisis and the 2014 pro-Russian conflict in Ukraine.[1][6]

The political part of the Association Agreement was signed on 21 March 2014 by the new Prime Minister, Arseniy Yatsenyuk.[1] Meanwhile the EU has attempted to stabilise Ukraine by freezing assets of Russians and Ukrainians and by granting financial help to Ukraine.[1][6][16] The economic part of the Ukraine–European Union Association Agreement on 27 June 2014 by the new President, Petro Poroshenko.[17]

Ukraine

Yes, polls showed a 50/50 split. Little wonder that Russia responded as they did. Btw, you seem to disapprove of Putins response to the Ukrainian coup, do you approve of Obama's?
 
You have it wrong and overly simplistic. You really need to do some more reading of reliable sources. Of course the west would love to have Ukraine as part of the west but you have your facts wrong.

Oh I see. Attempted NATO expansion, swift Russian pushback, and stalemate.
 
Good news, the Ukrainian Presidnet and Putin are talking.
Kremlin denies that Poroshenko and Putin agreed on ceasefire (UPDATES)

Bad news, is that there are alot of details to figure out. I think the largest annd most difficult issue will be whether or not Ukrainian troops must leave those provinces in their entirety.

In the past, Putin insisted on all Ukrainian forces leaving and the Ukrainians have completely refused as this would lead to the gradual loss of both provinces to Putin. Now, maybe they are talking about Ukrainian forces only needing to move heavy artillery out of range of large rebel held towns.
 
Good news, the Ukrainian Presidnet and Putin are talking.
Kremlin denies that Poroshenko and Putin agreed on ceasefire (UPDATES)

Bad news, is that there are alot of details to figure out. I think the largest annd most difficult issue will be whether or not Ukrainian troops must leave those provinces in their entirety.

In the past, Putin insisted on all Ukrainian forces leaving and the Ukrainians have completely refused as this would lead to the gradual loss of both provinces to Putin. Now, maybe they are talking about Ukrainian forces only needing to move heavy artillery out of range of large rebel held towns.

Putin needs a way to save face and eventually have the sanctions lifted that are stifling his economy. This is a start.
 
Jeez....another 'Ukrainian said this' thread.

Enough already.

Who started this thread anyways?

...

Never mind.
 
Still waiting for you to be precise. For what do you want a link. That the US was covertly involved in the situation that led to the overthrow of the Kiev government and implementation of a pro-Western government. Or that Russia's response is natural, and likely that they are willing to pay the cost to deny Ukraine becoming a NATO member, or perhaps something else you wish for.

Come onnnnnn! Don't insult my intelligence. You know damn well what I asked for. All you have to do is read my post!

One more time: where is the prove that your contention that the west, Europe, NATO, CIA, whatever, was behind the protests, overthrow, etc. of the Ukraine government that lead to the situation we are in. All I ask for is a link from a credible source to back up your contention. I'll be waiting but I won't hold my breath.
 
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Yes, polls showed a 50/50 split. Little wonder that Russia responded as they did. Btw, you seem to disapprove of Putins response to the Ukrainian coup, do you approve of Obama's?

Damn right I approve of Obama's. I suport my CIC and country and it's a fact that Putin is behind the rebels, has sent in troops, and has already annexed a country. What more do you want? Are you blind?

I'll take my president and my country over some 5 foot 4 inch thug, thief, and murderer that has the morals of a demon.
 
Putin needs a way to save face and eventually have the sanctions lifted that are stifling his economy. This is a start.

I hope the full sanctions are still implemented, and stay in place until there is a lasting peace. Putin has been an expert at promising one thing while actually doing the opposite.

In the meantime, the UN could provide expert consultants from northeren Ireland to advise local governments, police and paramilitary forces how to get along with each other. Northeren Ireland and eastern Ukraine have alot in common with each other:
- Two peoples with a shared history, but with seperate identities live on the same land
- Both peoples have legitimate greviences
- Neither side can truly win militarily
- Depite differences, both have a lot in common- so much that they cant really tell each other apart.
- Both sides have alot of factions ranging from the hardcore to the moderate
 
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Heya Monte. :2wave: Didn't Russia's and China's Oil deal go thru? Are they not accepting each others currency and not converting to the US dollar? War Games and exercises together. Plus both having disputes with us and now the Chinese refusing BO's Proposal for that region and the disputes with Vietnam, Japan, and the Philippines?

I think they will be supporting each other for some time.....and solidly.

Yep, and of necessity. They've also both pointed to US aggressions for their actions at the UN and their co-operation and the recent and marked build up of their respective militaries.
 
Putin needs a way to save face and eventually have the sanctions lifted that are stifling his economy. This is a start.

All parties would fancy saving face. Perhaps this is why Poroshenko reached out to Putin.
 
Damn right I approve of Obama's. I suport my CIC and country and it's a fact that Putin is behind the rebels, has sent in troops, and has already annexed a country. What more do you want? Are you blind?

I'll take my president and my country over some 5 foot 4 inch thug, thief, and murderer that has the morals of a demon.

Well now, did you feel that way about CiC Bush? And yes Putin is supporting the separatists in east Ukraine, who would deny that, and further who would condemn it other than those Americans as hypocritical as the day is long. Love that patronising spirit.
 
Come onnnnnn! Don't insult my intelligence. You know damn well what I asked for. All you have to do is read my post!

One more time: where is the prove that your contention that the west, Europe, NATO, CIA, whatever, was behind the protests, overthrow, etc. of the Ukraine government that lead to the situation we are in. All I ask for is a link from a credible source to back up your contention. I'll be waiting but I won't hold my breath.

I have no way of knowing whether you have below average, above average or average intelligence. I do know that your partisan glasses have clouded your vision and you can't see US intrigue in Ukraine.
 
Simpleχity;1063712878 said:
The Russian proposal for autonomy (federation) in east Ukraine is quite unlike Swiss or American federation. Under the Russian schema, the federalized oblasts in the east (Luhansk/Donetsk) would be able to ratify foreign economic and military treaties independent of Kyiv. In essence, a country within a country conducting foreign relations that are at odds with the national government.

I never said it was anything like the US or Swiss today. But rather like the US proposal under the Articles of Confederation, you know the Constitution before the current Constitution. There is nothing wrong with Russia's plan in allowing Donetsk and Luhansk to strike agreements with others (obviously Russia) when this area's biggest trade partner is Russia, not EU, not even Western Ukraine, but Russia. It would make economic sense for Kyiv to allow this economically considering Donetsk and Luhansk are the richest regions in "Ukraine" when it comes to natural resources and rest of Ukraine is piss poor broke and is about to get it's ass handed to it by the IMF.

It's a short term solution in which Kyiv won't be on the hook to rebuilt in the those areas but will still collect income from those areas. It'll keep EU/NATO at bay for Russia and settle Russian nerves who always politically and militarily expected NATO not to expand past East Germany.
 
I have no way of knowing whether you have below average, above average or average intelligence. I do know that your partisan glasses have clouded your vision and you can't see US intrigue in Ukraine.

Like I said just as I thought. You can't provide a link so you try and squeeze out. Not surprising.

And just for sheets and giggles I'm two points shy of Mensa in the I.Q. department. So it's none of the above.
 
Just as I figured. All conjecture. You ain't got squat.

Wrong. I'm just tired of looking it up every time somebody insists on it. It's been documented endlessly, in threads all over this forum. So, I don't care that your apologising for Obama, or what he says and does, Crimea is back where it belongs.
 
Like I said just as I thought. You can't provide a link so you try and squeeze out. Not surprising.

And just for sheets and giggles I'm two points shy of Mensa in the I.Q. department. So it's none of the above.

And like I said, such links have been provided in dozens of posts on various threads in this forum. If you want to know, you'll look. However you prefer to blindly support Obama in Ukraine, but it won't change anything. Crimea is where it should be.
 
Wrong. I'm just tired of looking it up every time somebody insists on it. It's been documented endlessly, in threads all over this forum.

You mean that there was a phone call indicating that Yatsenyuk would be a prominent political figure? That proves diddly squat about a US-engineered coup.
 
You mean that there was a phone call indicating that Yatsenyuk would be a prominent political figure? That proves diddly squat about a US-engineered coup.

No, that's a mere piece of it, but then you know that.

According to the United Nations General Assembly Declaration of Principles of International Law and under the terms of the United Nations Charter, effectively the Russia population have a right to secede from Ukraine. In an interview with the Voice of Russia Harvard Professor Francis Boyle says that there is no real government in Ukraine right now, and called it a gang of neo-Nazis, fascists and rightist thugs. There is clear cut discrimination against Russians in Ukraine with public demands in Kiev that Russians be killed. According to Professor Boyle what happened in Kiev was a playbook coup d’état by the CIA. Victoria Nuland, the Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs, working with the US Ambassador, were instrumental in carrying out the coup d’état, as it has been proven they were working with “the brown shirts”: Svoboda, the right sector, the Bandera Nazis and skinheads .
 
No, that's a mere piece of it, but then you know that.

Oh, that's right! Nuland was handing out cookies at a Maidan protest! That proves covert ops.

Those two things and the aid package(s) to the post-revolution government are literally the only things I've seen as an attempt to connect NATO to the overthrow of Yanukovych.
 
And like I said, such links have been provided in dozens of posts on various threads in this forum. If you want to know, you'll look. However you prefer to blindly support Obama in Ukraine, but it won't change anything. Crimea is where it should be.

Oh yes the ol' I've posted it here before or it's obvious so I'm not posting a link.

Please you're making me laugh so hard I'm about to fall off my chair.
 
See ya. Use google if its even important to you.

First you say it's not clear what I'm asking for.

Then you say to google it myself.

And finally you say it's been posted here already.


You know the more you fib the deeper the hole gets.
 
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