Protests over Missouri teen's death turn violent[W:647,807]

austrianecon said:

Each side is egging on the other side. Be it the police who told the "mob" to bring it, or the "mob" who did bring it by destroying property. Then police responding by firing tear gas and rubber bullets. I have no problem with tear gas, I have a problem with firing rubber bullets, they are just as lethal as standard 9mm bullets.

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I have more than a problem with the following than police using rubber bullets.

Loot in the white neighborhoods guys!!!

ya I can't get down with niggas ripping up their own neighborhoods—

That's counterproductive—



[...] gonna have to loot the white neighborhoods then—

[...] they tearing up their own neighborhood instead of terrorizing the white neighborhoods..loot,burned down and rob them,not your own—


If you gon @ least loot, go to the white people neighborhood—

Words from mentor. If you're going to riot and loot, at least take it to the rich white folk neighborhood. —

Tearing up ya own hoods ain't helping the cause—

Niggas in St. Louis need to go to the white people's area and start looting—

If you're gonna riot and kill people at least kill WHITE people. Why attack your own people?—

I simply wish black folk would riot white neighborhoods. Don't tear our shyt up. Go to where the police live. Makes more sense to me.—

Like why  they need take all this to the white neighborhoods

But come on black people we gotta do better. If you gonna riot go to the white neighborhoods and **** THEIR **** up.—

And gotdammit do it in the white neighborhoods or a heavily populated area or something, but you look stupid tearing up your own damn hood.—

i can't stand the fact that black folks have riots in our own neighborhood. you wanna make a statement? go riot in the white neighborhoods!—

go looting the white neighborhoods! go burn their businesses down! don't tear down businesses in our neighborhoods. c'mon man—

The rioters should go into white neighborhoods and burn their buildings. why destroy your own environment?—

You tearing down yo own community like what ? At least go mess up the white neighborhoods stuff !!!!!!—

Them niggas in STL better burn the White Neighborhoods if they want to get the point across.—

They need to go to the white neighborhoods & tear it down!—

Go to the white neighborhoods with the rioting and looting.—

Burn only the white neighborhoods—

Riots need to start destroying rich white neighborhoods—

‘Loot … and rob them, not your own'; Twitter users advise black people to loot white neighborhoods | Twitchy

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Excon said:

Which is akin to allowing someone you know post an image on the internet of you robbing a store.
:doh

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I stand corrected.
It wasn't a friend that took that photo, but a pretty brave reporter who was later beat down by the mob. Luckily a preacher was there to stop the thugs.



The looter is still an idiot though, and I am glad he is, as he let the reporter take the pic without repercussions.

austrianecon said:

I am gonna start off by saying I condemn anybody who destroys private property for gain or for payback. It's not called for.

But I will say this. Each side is egging on the other side. Be it the police who told the "mob" to bring it, or the "mob" who did bring it by destroying property. Then police responding by firing tear gas and rubber bullets. I have no problem with tear gas, I have a problem with firing rubber bullets, they are just as lethal as standard 9mm bullets. Seen situations like this many times as a kid visiting family in Northern Ireland, peaceful protest turns into a full blown riot just with a snap of a finger because both sides miscalculate.

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Police should respond to riots with lethal force.

No tear gas, no rubber bullets...just an audible warning and a little time to disperse, then sharpshooters engage people activly destroying property or looting. A gun-cam to confirm each shot.

You want to have a march? Some peacfull civil disobedience? A demonstration? No problem, more power to you.

Riot & die.

Excon said:

I stand corrected.
It wasn't a friend that took that photo, but a pretty brave reporter who was later beat down by the mob.

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That's why "high-capacity" mags.

Excon said:

Look at this looter.

Covered showing he knows he is wrong.
W/gun tucked in waist band. Figures.

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He's just trying to find a pair of jeans that fit.

Jerry said:

Police should respond to riots with lethal force.

No tear gas, no rubber bullets...just an audible warning and a little time to disperse, then sharpshooters engage people activly destroying property or looting. A gun-cam to confirm each shot.

You want to have a march? Some peacfull civil disobedience? A demonstration? No problem, more power to you.

Riot & die.

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Police have no right to respond with lethal force, period. That would be extrajudicial and unconstitutional in the US and it actually serves no purpose but to inflame the situation even more. You can ask Brits, Ukrainians, Egyptians, Iranians (under the Shah), Romanians, Tunisians and another dozen examples in history (including the Boston Massacre) how it works out for the Governments who justify killing those who "riot".

austrianecon said:

Police have no right to respond with lethal force, period. That would be extrajudicial and unconstitutional in the US and it actually serves no purpose but to inflame the situation even more. You can ask Brits, Ukrainians, Egyptians, Iranians (under the Shah), Romanians, Tunisians and another dozen examples in history (including the Boston Massacre) how it works out for the Governments who justify killing those who "riot".

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I'm not the government, I'm a private citizen, and I say kill them, or lead them to my house and I'll kill them.

Jerry said:

I'm not the government, I'm a private citizen, and I say kill them, or lead them to my house and I'll kill them.

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And where did I say you were the government? I am only pointing out if police had that right it would be illegal and stupid. Btw, police would probably shoot you too as you'd be using a firearm and committing murder.

austrianecon said:

And where did I say you were the government? I am only pointing out if police had that right it would be illegal and stupid. Btw, police would probably shoot you too as you'd be using a firearm and committing murder.

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It's self defence if they're rioting on my property. Or do you not know enough about the topic to have caught that? You have to know how to trick people into giving you legal cause in order to get away with it. So since police are to wimpy and chicken **** to actualy do their job and put rioters down, bring them to me and I'll do it. The Army taught me very well.

Jerry said:

It's self defence if they're rioting on my property. Or do you not know enough about the topic to have caught that? So since police are to wimpy and chicken **** to actualy do their job and put rioters down, bring them to me and I'll do it. The Army taught me very well.

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It's not self-defense, if you seek engagement. Someone being on your property is not justification under the self-defense laws even in the most conservative states. I am sure the Army taught you how to kill, taught my brother the same thing but again, as you said you are a civilian now so you have to follow the law. Now go back and read your state's self-defense law and see if you are justified shooting someone who is loitering and not trying to enter your home.

austrianecon said:

It's not self-defense, if you seek engagement.

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It's not self defence if I start it or if I go to them. It is self-defence if they come to me. I'll even post warning signs for 'no trespassing' & trespassers will be shot'.

austrianecon said:

Someone being on your property is not justification under the self-defense laws even in the most conservative states.

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Right. They have to also be comitting a feloney. Burning cars & buildings & looting are felonies. As with a any fist fight, I'll let them do a little damage first so my case looks better in court.

austrianecon said:

I am sure the Army taught you how to kill, taught my brother the same thing but again, as you said you are a civilian now so you have to follow the law.

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Oh I'm still in the service, but reservists are civilians, strictly speaking. Anyone not on active duty orders is a civilian.

austrianecon said:

Now go back and read your state's self-defense law and see if you are justified shooting someone who is loitering and not trying to enter your home.

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Rioters don't loiter. They riot. If they just lotered then they wouldn't be called rioters. They would be loiterers. I wouldn't fire on loiterers but it would be nice if civilians could buy tear gas. Strange that we can have the means to kill but not lesser non-lethal tools which might avoid killing at all. One tazer isn't going to disperse a bar fight. One lil can of OC isn't going to stop that mob from beating the crap out of that guy. A tear gas grenade or two, however, could....but civilians can't own that, but we have rifles. Go figure.

I think I'll start shopping for the most AWB compliant rifle I can find just for this aplication. Lets see, it'll need to have a nice soft wood stock. A brushed or blued metal finish, nothing black. Lever or bolt action. Fixed mag, not detachable. Holds 10 or fewer rounds. A modest scope. Registered with my insurence. I'll need to start buying a hunting license every year and take a few outdoorsy pics with this rifle somewhere in it. I'd like a real hunting rifle to have a suppressor & bipod but that brakes the AWB-compliant concept. Hmm what else....

austrianecon said:

And where did I say you were the government? I am only pointing out if police had that right it would be illegal and stupid. Btw, police would probably shoot you too as you'd be using a firearm and committing murder.

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Lets say a horde of thugs just ransacked the Grocery store down the street from your neighborhood.

Right after they set the place on fire they head down Mainstreat directly towards your neighborhood.

You know they're coming and you know their intentions so what are you allowed to do to defend your property and Family ?

I can tell you what my neighbor's would do. They would empty their well stocked gun safes and arm themselves and chances are they wouldn't wait for absolute legal justification to use those weapons.

The Status quo for dealing with rioters seems to be centered around discretion. Its a ridiculous and dangerous policy.

Give them enough room and time to get it out of their systems and all at the expense of the law abiding populace.

Because the advantage of discretion is always given to the rioting Mob, NOT to the people who are targeted, not to the shops, not to the public in general.

IMO Laws for self defense and the ability to use deadly force to protect yourself and your family should be relaxed during a riot.

I saw a video of 3 or 4 rioters jumping up and down on the hood of a occupied vehicle in traffic.

The guy just sat there in his car, scared I'm sure hoping they wouldn't drag him out so he could be the next Reginald Denny.

Jerry said:

Time for buisness owners to arm and kill rioters in the act.

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I don't know the laws in Missouri but that's certainly an option. As was already stated earlier in this thread, looters are hurting the family of the victim and hurting their own community they live in by acting out violently. What is interesting in our society is that at some level, such illegality as looting is tolerated. The thought that police who are being scrutinized (now by the Feds) will look the other way instead of arresting or defending private property such as these stores. The thought may be "Oh well, let them loot because if we arrest or God forbid, shoot one of the looters it will only make the violence and acting out even worse." So the looters get a free pass. If a store owner shoots a looter, wouldn't that also compound the violence and incite more violence?

Jerry said:

I'm not the government, I'm a private citizen, and I say kill them, or lead them to my house and I'll kill them.

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So by your words you want to set them up so you have a reason to kill???

Are you listening to yourself?

Rule One: Respect anyone wearing a pistol.
Rule Two: Respect a cop wearing a pistol.
Rule Three: Do not attack a person wearing a pistol.
Rule Four: Do not attack a cop wearing a pistol.
Rule Five: If you are stupid stay indoors.

rcart76 said:

So by your words you want to set them up so you have a reason to kill???

Are you listening to yourself?

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I want to set rioters up so that I have legal excuse to kill them. Yes, I hear myself. I want rioters shot dead in the act. You have no right to riot. It's to bad rioting isn't legal excuse enough all on its own to kill, we have to jump through all these legal hoops. If there's a riot sonewhere, it should be perfectly legal to grab your rifle, go to the riot with prior intent to kill, target a person **imediatly engaged in** burglery, grand theft, arson, or agrivated assult, and shoot & kill that person. Anyone just running along with the crowd isn't directly harming anyone or anything and so they're not valid targets.

A national Castle Doctrine.

Jerry said:

I want to set rioters up so that I have legal excuse to kill them. Yes, I hear myself. I want rioters shot dead in the act. You have no right to riot. It's to bad rioting isn't legal excuse enough all on its own to kill, we have to jump through all these legal hoops. If there's a riot sonewhere, it should be perfectly legal to grab your rifle, go to the riot with prior intent to kill, target people imediatly engaged in burglery, grand theft, arson, or agrivated assult, and shoot & kill that person.

A national Castle Doctrine.

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Do you think that the problem ends with your gun? You are a vet (by the way thanks for your service) and you seen war infested countres where there is constant riots and chaos. Is that the country you want to live in? Why escalate the situation even more by self injecting yourself in the madness. It will make it even worse.

rcart76 said:

Do you think that the problem ends with your gun? You are a vet (by the way thanks for your service) and you seen war infested countres where there is constant riots and chaos. Is that the country you want to live in? Why escalate the situation even more by self injecting yourself in the madness. It will make it even worse.

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Excuse me but do these rioters think the problem ends with the buildings they vandalized, the cars they burned, the loot they stoll or the people they beat up? Rioting doesn't solve how police react to situations. I have seen a war infested county where there is constant riots and chaos and that is exactly what I want put down here.

Please demonstrate, march, protest, flame the cop in media, say and do all peacfull things you wish......but riot and die.

rcart76 said:

Do you think that the problem ends with your gun? You are a vet (by the way thanks for your service) and you seen war infested countres where there is constant riots and chaos. Is that the country you want to live in? Why escalate the situation even more by self injecting yourself in the madness. It will make it even worse.

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Riots and chaos take place because good people do nothing to stop it.

rcart76 said:

Do you think that the problem ends with your gun? You are a vet (by the way thanks for your service) and you seen war infested countres where there is constant riots and chaos. Is that the country you want to live in? Why escalate the situation even more by self injecting yourself in the madness. It will make it even worse.

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Ridiculous.

The chaos IS the rioting and the policies that give the rioters the power of discretion as they're allowed to basically wear themselves out.

The policies of isolating communities to keep the damage to a minimum doesn't work anymore.

Thanks to Social media rioters have now moved out of the ghetto and into areas that are more affluent.

A mall was attacked yesterday in Missouri and it was all organized on Twitter.

Citizens standing up for their rights or citizens given the right to defend themselves doesn't equate to more chaos.

It what keeps chaos in check. Simply look to the parts of the United States where conceal carry is allowed and you'll notice a lack of this type of activity.

When was the last time people rioted like this in Texas ?

These people are in serious need of a good community organizer.

Ockham said:

Missouri police shooting of teen Michael Brown sparks protests, looting, vandalism - CBS News


The looting and violence is in response to the shooting of Michael Brown when, according to police, Brown and another man assaulted the police officer, there was a struggle and shots were fired, ultimately killing Brown. The two men in the alleged assault were not armed. However, a different account was provided by one Dorian Johnson, who says the struggle was initiated by the police officer, who assaulted Brown - Brown broke free and started to run when the police officer then shot Brown.

The point of this post is NOT justifying or dismissing the shooting which was the flashpoint of the violence (though I am resigned to the fact it will devolve into that at some point) but I'm more interested in why looting is the preferred method of showing distrust and dissatisfaction with police actions, when the owners of these stores which were broken into have absolutely NOTHING to do with the police shooting. Why is looting and destroying innocent people's livelihoods the preferred method of action in these circumstances? We see this time and time again - and I'm reminded of the 1992 So.Central LA riots.

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The cry of not enough businesses to serve poor inner city communities, and yet, given 1/2 an excuse, promptly go and destroy the very businesses the community is in need of, probably minority owed businesses at that.

Somehow this doesn't add up. Yet it happens time and time again.

Do you suppose that there'd be more businesses serving those communities if this didn't keep happening?

Excon said:

I watched through the eyes of this persons twitter account.

https://twitter.com/AntonioFrench


Look at this looter.

Covered showing he knows he is wrong.
W/gun tucked in waist band. Figures.

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Come on now. He is obviously very upset about the shooting and is showing his dissatisfaction about the unwarranted way the police treat him by stealing.

We can all understand that, can't we?

Cryptic said:

There is probably not a alot of logic to it. Rahter, say, 5% of the population is criminal and will act accordingly- especially if they are unilkely to get caught.

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You are way under estimating that, especially in some areas.

Ockham said:

Also called LEAN - Juice, Skittle, codine cough syrup, vodka (optional).

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If they have the vodka, why do they need the rest of it?