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Inmate Dies 2 Hours After Execution in Arizona

Scrabaholic said:
Only execution ensures they will never kill again.
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And all the people who kill who weren't guilty of the crimes they committed....just stopping possible future murders?

You cannot punish someone for something they might do in the future. There's no such thing as future crime. And society on large is protected just as well by life in prison without parole. And it's cheaper, so we don't have to waste money on some archaic and unnecessary system of death.
 
j-mac said:
How compassionate of you.
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It's not compassion, our justice system is not for revenge. It's a statement of fact. If you use it for revenge, you break the whole thing.
 
SheWolf said:
The guy was a sick ****, and perhaps mentally ill. I make no excuses for him. I think what he did was disgusting. I know a lot of women who have dealt with domestic violence. I have seen domestic violence, and I constantly see stupid ass people saying that those women are dumb for not getting out. It's hard to get it. It's dangerous to get out. Unfortunately not many people try to actually empathize with the victims of domestic violence or rape for that matter. A lot of people don't actually understand DV, and I dearly wish they did.

They guy that killed that family in Texas also had a history of DV.

Instead of trying to educate ourselves as a society on DV and memorializing the victims in a positive way, we are more concerned about the perpetuators.
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It makes me extremely mad when I hear people say that women who are victims of domestic violence caused their own problems. I know someone who was a victim, and what she went through was absolute hell. To this day, 15 years later, she still bears the scars - physical & emotional. Once I knew the entire backstory, I understood fully how she became trapped. DV is a horrible, awful issue.
 
Ikari said:
It's not compassion, our justice system is not for revenge. It's a statement of fact. If you use it for revenge, you break the whole thing.
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Revenge is your construct...I simply don't care in the slightest about a piece of **** that tortured and killed innocent people....If he suffered, ok....if he didn't, ok....maybe they should just have put a bullet in his head...
 
opendebate said:
I think it's destructive to us as a society when we engage in acts of vengeance like this and revel in the suffering of another human being. While we are no doubt better off without this human amongst us it's quite a different matter to volunteer your conscience to become a part of the faceless mob seeking this kind of pseudo justice and enjoying his torture.
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The problem with you folks his killing - yet you would have absolutely murdering a man for contradicting your claims while some crazy fool murdered 10's of people.... I find your plight ionic at best...

I'm personally anti-death penalty but some people are sick and twistd and dont even have remorse -- IMO they were looking to die from the day they were born amd om sp,e cases murdered other inmates but some of these inmates on Death Row are there fore reasons that are valid and others that are petty...

I work extensively with the Innocents Project but some of these guys need to go....

Then we all know there are plenty of innocent me on Death Row as we speak, and I have read too many cases where innocent men have bee put to death, due to bad council, bias, juries or just demeanor due to intelligence issues....

I could get deeper into this philosophy , however that would cause me a conflict of interest..
 
Ikari said:
It's not compassion, our justice system is not for revenge. It's a statement of fact. If you use it for revenge, you break the whole thing.
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I agree. And yet the death penalty is not for revenge (unless you solely consider the victim and his or her family). However, for society at large, it is to eliminate a threat. With that being said, my biggest problems with the death penalty include the possibility of innocent people being put to death for crimes they did not commit, and also the government having the power to kill its citizens.. not a good precedent.
 
Ikari said:
And all the people who kill who weren't guilty of the crimes they committed....just stopping possible future murders?

You cannot punish someone for something they might do in the future. There's no such thing as future crime. And society on large is protected just as well by life in prison without parole. And it's cheaper, so we don't have to waste money on some archaic and unnecessary system of death.
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Life without parole does not ensure they won't kill again. They can kill inside prison, including prison staff (if you don't care about other inmates). Also, they can escape and kill while on the run.

Execution protects society by ensuring a convicted murderer will never, ever kill again.
 
Scrabaholic said:
Life without parole does not ensure they won't kill again. They can kill inside prison, including prison staff (if you don't care about other inmates). Also, they can escape and kill while on the run.
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Everyone in the prison, whether inmates or guards, are there voluntarily and they're well aware of the risks. At that point, we've done a sufficient job of protecting society. Seeking absolutes is stupid.

Execution protects society by ensuring a convicted murderer will never, ever kill again.
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And we kill instead.
 
ecofarm said:
Everyone in the prison, whether inmates or guards, are there voluntarily and they're well aware of the risks. At that point, we've done a sufficient job of protecting society. Seeking absolutes is stupid.
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Evidently, your society disagrees.



And we kill instead.
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Nothing wrong with killing at certain times.
 
Scrabaholic said:
Evidently, your society disagrees.
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That's the best you can do? Clearly, you are incapable of refuting my points.

Let's not pretend that the death penalty is about the person killing again. It's about vengeance.

Nothing wrong with killing at certain times.
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In defense, sure. Killing a helpless harmless captive is not defense.
 
Scrabaholic said:
Life without parole does not ensure they won't kill again. They can kill inside prison, including prison staff (if you don't care about other inmates). Also, they can escape and kill while on the run.

Execution protects society by ensuring a convicted murderer will never, ever kill again.
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Escape from high level security prison is unlikely and the death penalty does nothing to shore up that probability. There is a lot of violence in prison, but the death penalty does nothing to affect those probabilities either. Additionally, there are various prison reforms we could j itiate that would have a much greater affect on those overall probabilities.

So again, not much is gained from having this expensive, archaic, dangerous, and unnecessary form of punishment.
 
I think we need a death row inmate version of the hunger games. All proceeds from pay-per-view go to the families of the victims. We can also PPV the executions.
 
The death penalty is not about vengeance- at least not for every person especially within the system. The people who sentence and carry out the penalty have no connection with the victim or the family of the victim. Therefore, the "it's all about vengeance" argument is null.
 
Rhiannon said:
The death penalty is not about vengeance- at least not for every person especially within the system. The people who sentence and carry out the penalty have no connection with the victim or the family of the victim. Therefore, the "it's all about vengeance" argument is null.
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Its about punishment.
 
ecofarm said:
That's the best you can do? Clearly, you are incapable of refuting my points.
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What points?


Let's not pretend that the death penalty is about the person killing again. It's about vengeance.
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It is about just punishment and protection of society.



In defense, sure. Killing a helpless harmless captive is not defense.
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lmao @ helpless harmless.
 
Ikari said:
Escape from high level security prison is unlikely and the death penalty does nothing to shore up that probability. There is a lot of violence in prison, but the death penalty does nothing to affect those probabilities either. Additionally, there are various prison reforms we could j itiate that would have a much greater affect on those overall probabilities.

So again, not much is gained from having this expensive, archaic, dangerous, and unnecessary form of punishment.
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You might want to google 'murderers who have escaped prison to kill again'.
 
Ockham said:
Frankly, they should just execute him like he executed the two people he killed. They'll get the drug combinations right and all will be well.

I loved the first sentence though... "prompting his lawyers to request an emergency halt to the procedure." Or what... he'll die? :lamo
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how could anyone halt the procedure if he had already taken the drugs?
 
Scrabaholic said:
You might want to google 'murderers who have escaped prison to kill again'.
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And I bet that's a small fraction of the overall stats and becoming increasingly unlikely from maximum security facilities.
 
Ikari said:
And I bet that's a small fraction of the overall stats and becoming increasingly unlikely from maximum security facilities.
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And yet the fact is that the only way to assure these animals never kill/rape/whatever again is to kill them. Isn't the truth something?
 
US Conservative said:
And yet the fact is that the only way to assure these animals never kill/rape/whatever again is to kill them. Isn't the truth something?
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They are human beings, first off. I know, dehumanizing the enemy is a common tactic so that we don't feel bad about killing; but we need to recognize and accept our own actions. Humans, that's who you are killing. The death penalty consumes innocent life as well, it's a method through which the government can legally kill its own citizens, it's ridiculously expensive (more so than housing an inmate for life), offers no further protections to society at large.

Violence in prisons doesn't immediately equate to killing inmates. There are other ways to deal with the problems more effectively, to actually decrease those numbers and incidents, than anything the DP can offer. It's not even a solution, it just makes problems.
 
Ikari said:
They are human beings, first off. I know, dehumanizing the enemy is a common tactic so that we don't feel bad about killing; but we need to recognize and accept our own actions. Humans, that's who you are killing. The death penalty consumes innocent life as well, it's a method through which the government can legally kill its own citizens, it's ridiculously expensive (more so than housing an inmate for life), offers no further protections to society at large.

Violence in prisons doesn't immediately equate to killing inmates. There are other ways to deal with the problems more effectively, to actually decrease those numbers and incidents, than anything the DP can offer. It's not even a solution, it just makes problems.
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This isn't a confused teenage foreign combatant, its a monster who was convicted to the highest standard of the law, but you are right-they ARE people (at least in form) so treat them well until we put a bullet through their heads.
 
Ikari said:
They are human beings, first off. I know, dehumanizing the enemy is a common tactic so that we don't feel bad about killing; but we need to recognize and accept our own actions. Humans, that's who you are killing. The death penalty consumes innocent life as well, it's a method through which the government can legally kill its own citizens, it's ridiculously expensive (more so than housing an inmate for life), offers no further protections to society at large.

Violence in prisons doesn't immediately equate to killing inmates. There are other ways to deal with the problems more effectively, to actually decrease those numbers and incidents, than anything the DP can offer. It's not even a solution, it just makes problems.
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I think you should stand in front of their victims families and say that stupid crap. If anything we should speed up the process to lower the costs, and be more humane.
 
j-mac said:
I think you should stand in front of their victims families and say that stupid crap. If anything we should speed up the process to lower the costs, and be more humane.
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Why is it that so many DP supoorters turn so quickly to emotional arguments? Speeding it up will only exacerbate the problems and lead to more innocents being killed by the State. I'm not so much fueled by revenge to suggest we kill innocent people to get to that one guy over there who we really want to kill. There's no advantage nor purpose to the death penalty any longer.
 
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