• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

UPDATE 2-U.S. EIA cuts recoverable Monterey shale oil estimate by 96 pct

Gimmesometruth said:
They get investment monies in advance of drilling, if news comes out of a major find, investment (stock prices) increase. It is very much in there interest to say "there is oil there".
Click to expand...

All I know is they are prepping for a major drilling push. They are bringing contractors and hiring employees at a very high rate higher than I have seen. I just went in to negotiate a contract yesterday for one of my customers and they are inquiring about me adding equipment and what kind of time frames I can do it in. So something is up. The internal reports I have been privy to and the external reports don't match so I don't know what the deal is exactly. Personally I think the first of the fracking permits are due in, and that's why the gear up.
 
DA60 said:
Where did I say they get money from the government to drill for oil?

Answer...I didn't.

They do get billions in 'subsidies' though:

'Currently, the U.S. government provides $4 billion in subsidies every year to the major oil producers.'

Obama plan to end U.S. oil subsidies rejected - Business - CBC News

and

Fossil Fuel Subsidies in the U.S. | Oil Change International


You don't agree? Take it up with the sources...I don't much care.


Good day.
Click to expand...

Neither source names a single specific subsidy. Why is that, you think?
 
apdst said:
Oil companies do not get cash money from the government!
Click to expand...
What part of stock purchases/investment did you not understand?

It does no good to lie about how big a resevoir is, because if it doesn't produce, the invested money is lost.
Click to expand...
That is assuming all stock bought is sold and that the corp did not profit from the investment monies......but that still is not the point.....your point was that it is not in the oil corps interest to pump up possible findings....but it is...it attracts investment.

The oil companies have zero to gain by pressuring the EIA to over-estimate the size of the reserve.
Click to expand...
Patently false.
 
DA60 said:
Where did I say they get money from the government to drill for oil?

Answer...I didn't.

They do get billions in 'subsidies' though:

'Currently, the U.S. government provides $4 billion in subsidies every year to the major oil producers.'

Obama plan to end U.S. oil subsidies rejected - Business - CBC News

and

Fossil Fuel Subsidies in the U.S. | Oil Change International


You don't agree? Take it up with the sources.


Good day.
Click to expand...

What subsidies are you talking about? The government provides NO money for exploration or anything else. And oh by the way the oil companies pay royalties permit fees and a whole host of other taxes and fees other industries DONT pay.
 
apdst said:
Neither source names a single specific subsidy. Why is that, you think?
Click to expand...

There isn't one. They are calling tax code a subsidy. Which its not.
 
PirateMk1 said:
What subsidies are you talking about? The government provides NO money for exploration or anything else. And oh by the way the oil companies pay royalties permit fees and a whole host of other taxes and fees other industries DONT pay.
Click to expand...

You don't agree...take it up with them.

I don't care whether you think they get subsidies or not.



Good day.
 
Last edited:
DA60 said:
'May 21 (Reuters) - The U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) on Wednesday cut its estimate of recoverable oil in California's Monterey shale by 96 percent, casting doubt on what was once thought to be America's next major energy play.

In what could be welcome news for environmentalists and a potentially bad omen for oil drillers, such as Venoco Inc, with large leases in the region, the EIA slashed its forecast of technically recoverable reserves, citing production difficulties from initial wells.

The reserves were downgraded by 96 percent, from 13.7 billion barrels estimated by a government-funded report in 2011, to just 600 million barrels, the EIA said. A detailed report is expected to be released next month.'

UPDATE 2-U.S. EIA cuts recoverable Monterey shale oil estimate by 96 pct | Reuters
Click to expand...

Does it really matter what the government believes? If private companies do the drilling and extraction, then we will soon know whether the reserves are viable or not.
 
PirateMk1 said:
There isn't one. They are calling tax code a subsidy. Which its not.
Click to expand...

They STILL think, even after years a debunking, that oil companies somehow get tax deductions that no other business qualifies for.
 
DA60 said:
You don't agree...take it up with them.

I don't care whether you think they get subsidies or not.


Good day.
Click to expand...

Ask who??
 
apdst said:
They STILL think, even after years a debunking, that oil companies somehow get tax deductions that no other business qualifies for.
Click to expand...

What other business gets an "oil depletion allowance"? ;)
 
Gimmesometruth said:
What part of stock purchases/investment did you not understand?

That is assuming all stock bought is sold and that the corp did not profit from the investment monies......but that still is not the point.....your point was that it is not in the oil corps interest to pump up possible findings....but it is...it attracts investment.

Patently false.
Click to expand...

Dry holes don't generate profit; not even in the Liberal fantasy land.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
What other business gets an "oil depletion allowance"? ;)
Click to expand...

What do you want to make a bet that every other mineral extraction company gets a similar benefit in the tax code. By the way that's a fancy term for depreciation and an oil well is a depreciable asset. As is a mine or other limited life span asset.
 
apdst said:
Dry holes don't generate profit; not even in the Liberal fantasy land.
Click to expand...
You keep moving your goal post:

apdst said:
The oil companies have zero to gain by pressuring the EIA to over-estimate the size of the reserve.
Click to expand...
Again, patently false, speculative investment is spurred by such announcements.

Not that I would ever imagine you to acknowledge your error.....but you are totally incorrect.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
What other business gets an "oil depletion allowance"? ;)
Click to expand...

Every business in America is allowed to depreciate loss in capital. Farmers are allowed to count their crops as capital and can deduct a reduction in market prices. Grocery stores do it all the time.
 
Gimmesometruth said:
You keep moving your goal post:

Again, patently false, speculative investment is spurred by such announcements.

Not that I would ever imagine you to acknowledge your error.....but you are totally incorrect.
Click to expand...

Again, if a well doesn't produce oil, the investors see zero profit. If Joe's Oil loses investers's money too many times investors lose confidence in Joe's ability to find and produce, then stop investing.

You should stop insisting that investments make money when there's no profit.
 
apdst said:
Every business in America is allowed to depreciate loss in capital. Farmers are allowed to count their crops as capital and can deduct a reduction in market prices. Grocery stores do it all the time.
Click to expand...

Ummm as you are fond of saying- can I see the text on farmer's being able to take fluctuations in market price for their crop as depreciation? I know I can take any loss in the sale of a momma cow (which really isn't because of the calves she gave me and the passing of years in the owing of her.) I can depreciate farm equipment, any rent for land is a deduction, things like that....

Never heard that about the wheat I raise due to market prices, take a lowering in feeder or stocker calf market price reductions as a depreciation loss........ do tell....
 
notquiteright said:
Ummm as you are fond of saying- can I see the text on farmer's being able to take fluctuations in market price for their crop as depreciation? I know I can take any loss in the sale of a momma cow (which really isn't because of the calves she gave me and the passing of years in the owing of her.) I can depreciate farm equipment, any rent for land is a deduction, things like that....

Never heard that about the wheat I raise due to market prices, take a lowering in feeder or stocker calf market price reductions as a depreciation loss........ do tell....
Click to expand...

If you sell at a loss, you can deduct the loss. Simple.
 
apdst said:
Again, if a well doesn't produce oil, the investors see zero profit. If Joe's Oil loses investers's money too many times investors lose confidence in Joe's ability to find and produce, then stop investing.

You should stop insisting that investments make money when there's no profit.
Click to expand...
Um, the point is, the oil corp always has an interest in news that spurs speculative investment.

You are too invested in your original post to admit to your error......which is why you continue to move your discussion to other subjects.

You lost the point, you are wrong......and we are done.

Tah-tah.

:2wave:
 
Gimmesometruth said:
Um, the point is, the oil corp always has an interest in news that spurs speculative investment.

You are too invested in your original post to admit to your error......which is why you continue to move your discussion to other subjects.

You lost the point, you are wrong......and we are done.

Tah-tah.

:2wave:
Click to expand...

I think you nailed it.
 
PirateMk1 said:
What do you want to make a bet that every other mineral extraction company gets a similar benefit in the tax code. By the way that's a fancy term for depreciation and an oil well is a depreciable asset. As is a mine or other limited life span asset.
Click to expand...

That is in addition to a US production tax break - it would be difficult, indeed, for them to move that mineral/depreciable asset offshore. ;)
 
apdst said:
Every business in America is allowed to depreciate loss in capital. Farmers are allowed to count their crops as capital and can deduct a reduction in market prices. Grocery stores do it all the time.
Click to expand...

That oil depletion allowance is signifcantlly different than a fixed asset depreciation allowance. A farmer cannot "depreciate" their crops.
 
PirateMk1 said:
Ok cranky.
Click to expand...

No...I mentioned it, posted links...my interest in subsidies is over for now (the thread is about shale oil reserves, after all).

You wouldn't take the hint.

Just because I find something uninteresting doesn't necessarily make me 'cranky'.

Can we move on, please?
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom