Dems seek to rally base over GOP's block of minimum wage bill

buck · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

Top Cat said:
I didn't claim a connection. I simply stated that many on the right claimed when MW was raised unemployment would rise, it didn't.

But, as I pointed out previously, it did... It probably even had something to do with the increase of the MW:

Here is an article claiming that the increase in WA of the MW was good, and even they indicate that UE went up afterwards

Minimum Wage In Washington: After 16 Years, State With Highest Minimum Wage Maintains Lower Unemployment Than National, Regional Averages.

These numbers suggest an initial unemployment shock between 2000 and 2003, followed by a gradual reduction.

The line chart above suggests that Washington indeed saw an increase in unemployment at a faster rate than the national and regional averages in the first years after the 1999 wage mandate; but then there was a leveling-off and a steep decline in joblessness from 2004 to 2007.

Sean.McDonnell · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

JRSaindo said:
Because its a perpetual cycle that never ends. Ever since the dollar went off the gold standard we had this problem of dealing with inflation, wages, and cost of living increases. What need is there for wages and prices to keep going up? Society doesn't benefit from this (as you stated purchasing power is less today than 40-50 years ago), so who does? The banks. Wages decline as inflation builds and the bankers/financiers are the only ones who benefit. Plain and simple. The eroding value of the dollar is the problem, not minimum wage.

Raising the minimum wage will cause either A) cost of product/service increases to make up for lost profit, or B) layoffs will increase. So you want to make more while also paying more, leaving the net gain near zero? That is efficient? I don't follow the logic.

Minimum wage is a joke, the FED is a joke, and society is a joke. I'm just waiting for the reset. Hope it happens in my lifetime.

You made a small bit of sense until that last line, then any credibility seemed to fly out the window.

JW Radcliff · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

I hope the Dems do run on it. Lord knows they can't run on the current economy so they have to invent some "crisis"

Bottom line is Dems rant how the working "poor" live paycheck to paycheck so employers must pay them more

If the employers are forced to pay more, then the working "poor" will then live welfare check to welfare check

joG · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

Top Cat said:
Wow, so you liken Obama to a communist? Honestly, the chicken little mentality is, if nothing else, tiring. Haters gotta hate...

No, not at all. Just mentioned an elementary economic fact. In most cases fiddling the prices reduces welfare. The more central to allocation that price is, the more risk you run, the more damage you do.

Deuce · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

ocean515 said:
LOL

With that answer, it's clear you don't understand how a business operates, and what it takes to cover costs. Kind of symbolic of the havoc Prog/Libs have subjected business to with their agenda.

You're telling me that a dollar in costs takes more than a dollar to cover.

Deuce · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

Erod said:
"And, and, and.....if we made a law where everyone made a million an hour, we could all be........millionaires!!"

First-grade economic thinking attracts first-grade economic voters.

No. First-grade thinking is taking any idea and extrapolating to ridiculous extremes, and then attacking that.

Conservatives attack increasing the minimum wage... so maybe they think we shouldn't have wages at all! Conservatives love slavery!!!!

iguanaman · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

vasuderatorrent said:
If investors get 0.0% return on their investment the answer is 318,395 employees at $7.25 an hour or 228,550 employees at $10.10 an hour. Investors usually want to receive 12% on their investment.

If the value of all outstanding stock at the beginning of the year was $45,900,000,000 or less then it would cover 0 employees.

You have to remember rich people are greedy, filthy, disgusting and horrible people. They won't invest in a company at all unless they will receive a profit. Sometimes you have to consider the reality of the world.

With that in mind: What was the value of all outstanding stock at the beginning of the year for McDonalds?

Big numbers have the potential to empower liars to make misleading statements. Answer the question or stop with the lies.

I could care less about how much the stockholders make and it is not determined only by profit either. Employee salaries as a % of operating costs have been steadily declining for 35 years. How long will workers take less and less while companies make more and more?

vasuderatorrent · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

iguanaman said:
I could care less about how much the stockholders make

I noticed that. Carry on with your nonsensical lies. Just beware. Some people know that you are deliberately using big numbers to tell lies.

or you could answer the question:

What was the value of all outstanding stock at the beginning of the year for McDonalds?

vasuderatorrent · May 1, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

iguanaman said:
I could care less about how much the stockholders make and it is not determined only by profit either.

January 1, 2013 Net worth of Mcdonalds = $15,293,600,000
December 31, 2013 Net worth of Mcdonalds = $16,009,700,000

Dividends paid in 2013 = $3,114,600,000

You are right. The profits for Mcdonalds in 2013 was around 25%.

JW Radcliff · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

Amazing how those who never ran a business, met a payroll, or had to deal with the mountain of regulations facing a business - can sit back and dictate who much an employer has to pay their employees

With the GDP at .1% liberals think adding to the cost of doing business is a good thing and will add jobs to the damn near stillborn Obama economy?

99percenter · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

iguanaman said:
I could care less about how much the stockholders make and it is not determined only by profit either. Employee salaries as a % of operating costs have been steadily declining for 35 years. How long will workers take less and less while companies make more and more?

Conservative · May 2, 2014

Top Cat said:
Dems seek to rally base over GOP's block of minimum wage bill - CNN.com

Very interesting...

Exactly, very interesting view of liberalism, having no problem spending SOMEONE else's money. Why is it that liberals who believe in paying someone X dollars don't go into business and do just that? What gives the govt. the right to demand that the private sector pay an employee a specified wage? Let the market decide and let people rise to the level they are capable of achieving.

Jack Fabulous · May 2, 2014

According to 2012 Bureau of Labor statistics 3.6 million people made the federal minimum wage or below.

A whopping 4.7% of the workforce, if you want to look at it that way.

It's a political stunt. A "tug on the emotional heartstrings" designed to divert attention from the fact that a more robust economy solves our problems much more effectively. But hey, why spend your efforts trying to actually improve things when token gestures that appeal to emotion are so much easier.

ttwtt78640 · May 2, 2014

Conservative said:
Exactly, very interesting view of liberalism, having no problem spending SOMEONE else's money. Why is it that liberals who believe in paying someone X dollars don't go into business and do just that? What gives the govt. the right to demand that the private sector pay an employee a specified wage? Let the market decide and let people rise to the level they are capable of achieving.

Increasing the federal MW level poses a tricky political problem; if one argues that it needs to rise based on inflation then all of the "safety net" benefits (based on the federal poverty level) and SS must rise as well - negating the argument that it would decrease those costs.

TheNextEra · May 2, 2014

The purpose of raising the federal min wage is to keep in line with inflation, not to make a living wage. I doubt inflation since 2009 is justified to the tune of $10.10 an hour though.

Conservative · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

iguanaman said:
I could care less about how much the stockholders make and it is not determined only by profit either. Employee salaries as a % of operating costs have been steadily declining for 35 years. How long will workers take less and less while companies make more and more?

Name for me a major company with shareholders that pay minimum wage to their employees and where do benefits fit into the pay structure in your world? Why do you care what some company makes in profits, pays in taxes? don't you choose where to spend your money? Why would you purchase goods and services from a company that you know or probably as you show don't know pays minimum wage?

What liberals don't understand is that when you mandate a particular wage you set a minimum wage for people as well as hurt small businesses which actually drives the economy. You see big profits and that is a red flag for you when the reality is those large profits are from companies who don't pay minimum wages.

Conservative · May 2, 2014

TheNextEra said:
The purpose of raising the federal min wage is to keep in line with inflation, not to make a living wage. I doubt inflation since 2009 is justified to the tune of $10.10 an hour though.

Stop telling a private business with their own money invested what to pay their employees and create a demand like has been created in North Dakota where minimum wage is irrelevant. Create a market based wage that creates more demand than supply and wages will rise significantly.

ocean515 · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

Deuce said:
You're telling me that a dollar in costs takes more than a dollar to cover.

Yes, I'm telling you that in order to cover a dollar of additional cost, it takes more than a dollar of revenue.

This concept is as fundamental as breath is to life. However, for some reason, I'm not surprised it's foreign to so many Liberal/Progressives.

buck · May 2, 2014

Jack Fabulous said:
According to 2012 Bureau of Labor statistics 3.6 million people made the federal minimum wage or below.

A whopping 4.7% of the workforce, if you want to look at it that way.

It's a political stunt. A "tug on the emotional heartstrings" designed to divert attention from the fact that a more robust economy solves our problems much more effectively. But hey, why spend your efforts trying to actually improve things when token gestures that appeal to emotion are so much easier.

Just because I am curious, can that be broken down even further? What percentage of that 3.6 millioin are just kids working through HS and college? What percentage are married to a spouse that makes a good living? What percentage are single parents?

polgara · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

ocean515 said:
Yes, I'm telling you that in order to cover a dollar of additional cost, it takes more than a dollar of revenue.

This concept is as fundamental as breath is to life. However, for some reason, I'm not surprised it's foreign to so many Liberal/Progressives.

I have thought for years that politicians must think money grows on trees. Damned if they weren't right after all! :lamo: There is a Money Tree Plant Crassula OvataI] that grows in Asia...sort of like a bonsai tree with little flowers. We just live on the wrong side of the globe, ocean. They grow wild in China - no wonder they always have money to lend us! :mrgreen: Maybe millions of those plants could be imported and planted in DC...and think of the relief taxpayers would feel when they know that they can just walk outside their door and pick enough leaves to buy that new car! It boggles the mind...

Greetings, ocean515. :2wave:

Jack Fabulous · May 2, 2014

buck said:
Just because I am curious, can that be broken down even further? What percentage of that 3.6 millioin are just kids working through HS and college? What percentage are married to a spouse that makes a good living? What percentage are single parents?

Here's a pretty good breakdown... Characteristics of Minimum Wage Workers: 2012

A quick FYI, half of minimum wage workers are under 25 years old.

Conservative · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

ocean515 said:
Yes, I'm telling you that in order to cover a dollar of additional cost, it takes more than a dollar of revenue.

This concept is as fundamental as breath is to life. However, for some reason, I'm not surprised it's foreign to so many Liberal/Progressives.

The liberal ignorance of business is staggering. An increase in cost of one dollar adds one dollar in expense and reduces profit by a dollar. An increase in one dollar in revenue generates somewhere between 8 cents and roughly 35 cents in profit to the company due to the costs of the products businesses have to buy. Liberals have no problem spending someone else's money.

buck · May 2, 2014

Jack Fabulous said:
Here's a pretty good breakdown... Characteristics of Minimum Wage Workers: 2012

A quick FYI, half of minimum wage workers are under 25 years old.

TY. Tend to be young, tend to be never married and tend to work part time. Leads me to the conclusion that it's about what I assumed.

Minimum wage workers tend to be young. Although workers under age 25 represented only about one-fifth of hourly paid workers, they made up about half of those paid the Federal minimum wage or less. Among employed teenagers paid by the hour, about 21 percent earned the minimum wage or less, compared with about 3 percent of workers age 25 and over.

Never-married workers, who tend to be young, were more likely than married workers to earn the federal minimum wage or less (about 8 percent versus about 2 percent).

About 11 percent of part-time workers (persons who usually work less than 35 hours per week) were paid the federal minimum wage or less, compared with about 2 percent of full-time workers.

ocean515 · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

Conservative said:
The liberal ignorance of business is staggering. An increase in cost of one dollar adds one dollar in expense and reduces profit by a dollar. An increase in one dollar in revenue generates somewhere between 8 cents and roughly 35 cents in profit to the company due to the costs of the products businesses have to buy. Liberals have no problem spending someone else's money.

Exactly!

$1 dollar in additional cost could require $10 or more in additional revenue to cover it, just to stay even. A $3 per hour increase with 4 employees could take $4-500,000 in additional annual revenues to cover and perhaps even more.

The lack of understanding is disturbing, but frankly is not surprising. It certainly explains why so many liberals are anti-business in their actions and attitudes.

Compare how our two states are run, and what the results look like.

coyotedelmar · May 2, 2014

Re: How $10.10 an hour could get votes in November

ocean515 said:
Yes, I'm telling you that in order to cover a dollar of additional cost, it takes more than a dollar of revenue.

This concept is as fundamental as breath is to life. However, for some reason, I'm not surprised it's foreign to so many Liberal/Progressives.

You might want to let these folks know, because they found that a 10% increases in US Minimum wage causes a 4% increase in food prices, and .4% increase overall. In other words it isn't one-for-one:
http://www.le.ac.uk/economics/research/RePEc/lec/leecon/dp06-9.pdf

Dems seek to rally base over GOP's block of minimum wage bill

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