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Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly.....[W:696:1188]

Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Excon said:
Getting to that point and actually being there, are two different things. But yes, I find that starting to be the case.
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I have no idea what you're trying to say.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
Im sorry they felt the need to send in an army of federal agents in the first place to collect a debt. Thats pathetic...almost as much pathetic as your continued defense of their actions.
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I didn't see an army in any of those photos.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Wiseone said:
You whined for two pages about being asked hypothetical and now you ask me my own hypothetical in your argument?

You're just a troll
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Actually, it was your fellow liberals that whined about you positing a lame hypothetical. I simply pointed out how stupid your lame hypothetical was. And now...comically...you cant even answer the hypothetical YOU posed.

You're..something....
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Strucky said:
Ironic that Liberals keep pounding on it like it happened while at the same time DEMANDING women assume combat roles in the military lol
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Ironic that you are doing every thing you can to twist away from the fact that the militia guys out there were willing to sacrifice their women and children as shields. Is there anything more craven and cowardly than that?

Repugnant, low IQ hillbillies with guns, defending a deadbeat welfare queen that (surprise!) is an old school racist.

And yet, the ultra right still sees them as heroes. Amazing.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Moot said:
Excon said:
Moot said:
Excon said:
Moot said:
I have to disagree, Buck. I don't think Bundy's use of the term "Negro" makes him a racist anymore than it makes my own mother a racist for still using the term "Oriental" when talking about Asians.
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It is getting to the point that using Asian can be found to be offensive.
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"Asian" is offensive?
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Getting to that point and actually being there, are two different things. But yes, I find that starting to be the case.
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I have no idea what you're trying to say.
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:doh
Still having problems following what has been said even though you quote it.
:doh
Figures.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Moot said:
I didn't see an army in any of those photos.
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Do you see any fees collected or just greater cost following that failed attempt at debt collection? Just how much do you think it costs to send in contracted cowboys, armed BLM agents, state and locals...etc?

But hey...at least it got the job done right? Oh...wait...no...they couldnt even do THAT right.

Maybe next time they could send in the 'real' army. Call in a drone strike or two. Hey...screw them...right? They deserve it. Maybe wiseone could lead the charge. Hell...they might even let you join in...you are both all about it.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Excon said:
:doh
Still having problems following what has been said even though you quote it.
:doh
Figures.
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No, just having trouble understanding what you're trying to say. Are you saying "Asian" is offensive?
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

beefheart said:
that (surprise!) is an old school racist.
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No one is defending a racist. Old school or otherwise.
Content and context matter in what was said. He said nothing that is racist but that which was of compassion.

You might try listening to what he said fully.
 
re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:696]

beefheart said:
You said what the BLM did was unlawful.

I'm waiting for you to cite what laws they were in violation of, the actual laws, not just your opinion.
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I camt prove a negative, but youre welcome to prove that theey have the authority to collect a debt, under arms. Good luck!
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
Im sorry they felt the need to send in an army of federal agents in the first place to collect a debt. Thats pathetic...almost as much pathetic as your continued defense of their actions.
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There are so many viable and far more intelligent ways this situation could have been handled that it borders on comical. Except of course we are talking about a bureaucracy. The decision was made to grand stand and make a overly strong show of force, it backfired in this instance. Last I checked the cost of this boondoggle far exceeded the debt owed, though how much of that was after the situation escalated I can't say. I don't think the powers that be figured on the backlash that came about from their choice to go this route, which they should have been mindful of after Ruby Ridge and Waco. The social media component of this story is fascinating to me, I don't much care for social media but use it for convenience to keep up with some family and friends. I could tell this was going to be BIG pretty early on just by how much I was seeing the story get play on FB alone. Particularly among some of my friends and family that work in the farming/ranching community in several states from coast to coast.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
Do you see any fees collected or just greater cost following that failed attempt at debt collection? Just how much do you think it costs to send in contracted cowboys, armed BLM agents, state and locals...etc?

But hey...at least it got the job done right? Oh...wait...no...they couldnt even do THAT right.

Maybe next time they could send in the 'real' army. Call in a drone strike or two. Hey...screw them...right? They deserve it. Maybe wiseone could lead the charge. Hell...they might even let you join in...you are both all about it.
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Uh....the standoff was over the removal of Bundy's cows on federal land....not debt collection. Some people are thick but you're a mile wide.
 
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Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Moot said:
No, just having trouble understanding what you're trying to say. Are you saying "Asian" is offensive?
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"It is getting to the point that using Asian can be found to be offensive."​

There is no equivocation in what I said.
It is getting to that point.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Moot said:
Uh....the standoff was over the removal of Bundy's cows....not debt collection. Some people are thick but you're a mile wide.
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And the administration is STILL batting zero. Couldnt collect the debt, couldnt take the cows...but DID manage to bungle a simple conflict between one US citizen and the whole of the BLM. Did manage to run up greater expenses doing it. Did manage to look even more impotent and embarrassing than before.

On a roll, baby.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Filthy McNasty said:
There are so many viable and far more intelligent ways this situation could have been handled that it borders on comical. Except of course we are talking about a bureaucracy. The decision was made to grand stand and make a overly strong show of force, it backfired in this instance. Last I checked the cost of this boondoggle far exceeded the debt owed, though how much of that was after the situation escalated I can't say. I don't think the powers that be figured on the backlash that came about from their choice to go this route, which they should have been mindful of after Ruby Ridge and Waco. The social media component of this story is fascinating to me, I don't much care for social media but use it for convenience to keep up with some family and friends. I could tell this was going to be BIG pretty early on just by how much I was seeing the story get play on FB alone. Particularly among some of my friends and family that work in the farming/ranching community in several states from coast to coast.
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Ultimately that IS the point. Its not about whether or not Bundy is a 'hero' (he isnt) or the debt is just (it is)...it is about just how horribly screwed up and mismanaged this debacle was.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

It is awesome to hear those that espouse all the things Bundy believes react in disbelief that the world outside internet forums see his language as racist.

..."but nothing he said was racist"
 
re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:696]

apdst said:
I camt prove a negative, but youre welcome to prove that theey have the authority to collect a debt, under arms. Good luck!
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So, when you said it was unlawful, that was just your opinion, not based on any actual law that you could produce.

Just wanted to get that straight, and on record. So, there is no actual, concrete law that you can cite to back what we now know is your opinion that what the BLM did was unlawful.

It is OK for you to have that opinion, however you have not been able to offer up any proof to it being a correct opinion.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

1750Texan said:
It is awesome to hear those that espouse all the things Bundy believes react in disbelief that the world outside internet forums see his language as racist.

..."but nothing he said was racist"
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You seem to be confused as nothing he said was racist. All referenced spectrums have folk who know that.
Listen to his full unedited words. Content and context matter. They were not racist.


Excon said:
I see you are not paying attention to the full content and context of his statements.
Or that of his body guard.




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Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
Do you see any fees collected or just greater cost following that failed attempt at debt collection? Just how much do you think it costs to send in contracted cowboys, armed BLM agents, state and locals...etc?

But hey...at least it got the job done right? Oh...wait...no...they couldnt even do THAT right.

Maybe next time they could send in the 'real' army. Call in a drone strike or two. Hey...screw them...right? They deserve it. Maybe wiseone could lead the charge. Hell...they might even let you join in...you are both all about it.
Click to expand...

I think everyone who applauds this stupidity should arm themselves and join ranks with BLM next time.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Excon said:
"It is getting to the point that using Asian can be found to be offensive."​

There is no equivocation in what I said.
It is getting to that point.
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Okay, I see what you're trying to say now. Thanks for being patient. :)

There's been so many politically correct name changes it wouldn't surprise me if it did.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
Ultimately that IS the point. Its not about whether or not Bundy is a 'hero' (he isnt) or the debt is just (it is)...it is about just how horribly screwed up and mismanaged this debacle was.
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I agree. One of the most obvious options is one the BLM knows and practices with regularity, when not choosing to put on some field kabuki. They wait as they often do, until Bundy kicks off from this mortal coil and then they move in and seize the land with a lien and wallah, they get everything. This was brought up on NPR very early in the standoff. All on the panel seemed to agree that the government wanted to grand stand and make an example of Bundy. So this was the outcome of that strategery. Now we have this story coming out of Texas where the BLM is trying to jump in and seize land from a private citizen and from the state. It seems to me that the BLM is oblivious to the concept that they might be acting in a rather concerning manner to we the citizens.
 
re: Cliven Bundy stands by racially charged comments, ‘That’s exactly what I said’[W:696]

beefheart said:
So, when you said it was unlawful, that was just your opinion, not based on any actual law that you could produce.

Just wanted to get that straight, and on record. So, there is no actual, concrete law that you can cite to back what we now know is your opinion that what the BLM did was unlawful.

It is OK for you to have that opinion, however you have not been able to offer up any proof to it being a correct opinion.
Click to expand...

If the BLM doesnt have legal authorization as a law enforcement agency/police force, then yes, it's unlawful. Can you show us its authorization?
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
Actually, it was your fellow liberals that whined about you positing a lame hypothetical. I simply pointed out how stupid your lame hypothetical was. And now...comically...you cant even answer the hypothetical YOU posed.

You're..something....
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No I don't think cops should use lethal force to collect unpaid traffic tickets, but my hypothetical wasn't that it was if a gang had taken over part of a city and had used the threat of force to prevent police from enforcing the law. OR what if a rancher had a million dollars in unpaid fines and him plus several hundred militia used threat of force to prevent police from enforcing any law.

Personally I think the police would need to reestablish themselves in both cases.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

Excon said:
You seem to be confused as nothing he said was racist. All referenced spectrums have folk who know that.
Listen to his full unedited words. Content and context matter. They were not racist.


​
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I agree with you. When I listened to the full interview, and tried to understand the context of his words, I came away with thinking he's a rambling old goat who was trying to very hard to make a point and he didn't do it well, but he's not a racist.

Good luck getting others to agree though.
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

apdst said:
I think everyone who applauds this stupidity should arm themselves and join ranks with BLM next time.
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Or at least get their talking points squared away.

The sad thing is they ahve really kinda painted themselves into an ugly little box. In their kneejerk rush to defend all things Obama, they have INSISTED that...well...golly...its been 20 years...and...what other choice did they have OTHER than to escalate this? Can you think of another choice? There WAS no other choice (oh...and I'll add in moots "besides...its REALLY George Bush's fault!").

And the problem is...it DIDNT WORK. The BEST they could think to do...failed. So...well...damn...NOW what? If they do ANYTHING differently well...sonofabitch...turns out there were maybe other alternatives AFTER all...who knew. And if they WORK? well........errrrrrmmmmm....

And the simple fact that THIS is how they endorse problem resolution...well...that certainly explains the embarrassment that is our current foreign policy.

I dont know...maybe another "line in the sand"....
 
Re: Bundy questioned whether blacks were better off as slaves

VanceMack said:
And the administration is STILL batting zero. Couldnt collect the debt, couldnt take the cows...but DID manage to bungle a simple conflict between one US citizen and the whole of the BLM. Did manage to run up greater expenses doing it. Did manage to look even more impotent and embarrassing than before.

On a roll, baby.
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Yes, yes, we know...you would have preferred it turn out like WACO.
 
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