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Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing

American said:
Feds move in on Nevada rancher's herd over illegal grazing | Fox News



I hope these federal agents don't go full retard over some cattle grazing. Helicopters? Really?
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"Show of force."


It was a technique of the Germans in Warsaw after 1939. A terrified populace is a controlled populace.

I missed the part where the land management outfit had a court order. They sued him right? And they have legal jurisdiction and all that?

I would not be so worried about Ruby Ridge, more like Pine Ridge

Leonard Peltier - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
This was common grazing ground, and used by the man's family since 1870. In 1946, the BLM was formed. I hope the feds turn out looking horrible after this.
 
Unless the government violated land rights then he is grazing illegally on land that is not his and I have no sympathy for him...
 
I'm torn on this one. On one hand, it's cows eating ****ing grass, does that really need paid for? Not sure how paying the government for your cows to eat grass protects this turtle... On the other hand, what difference does it make who the money goes to? If he feels that his family owns the land, well, I'd love to see documents saying so.
 
Sorry, I don't feel empathy for a guy who has used public lands for free in furtherance of his own personal business and private profit. The fact that he refused to pay applicable fees for years before grazing was banned tells me that he feels like he personally owns and is entitled to the free use of that land... forever.

Apparently the feds have been in and out of court for decades trying to adjudicate this in some way; the rancher basically says, "bite me." So if the feds round up a few hundred head of cattle to auction off for past grazing fees, he can just cry me a river.

Besides, the sight of a squashed tortoise makes me sad.
 
Then elect leaders who'll sale it to the highest bidder. What should be and what IS are two different things. What should be and IS ... Is no relevant to the party who owes tax payers $1.1 million in back fees who a bunch of anti govt zealots think is some kind of hero. He's nothing but a crook. At least Robin Hood gave his loot to the masses this guy just wants it all for him. Screw him

American said:
The federal govt has no business controlling 84% of a state. It's cost money.
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And BTW NV is not on the top 20 leach states. I don't know where it ranks, but it's below the top 20 so you aren't subsidizing much when it comes to BLM land. Our local FEDs are pretty good guys and haven't ever caused me any grief.
 
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I hoping that all the poorly educated extremists run to Nevada with their guns drawn. It would make for good entertainment.
 
Fox News is saying that local "militias" are forming. They say this could be the next Waco.

Militias? Is that true? If not Fox is putting the lives of the protesters at risk. I do not feel that it would be safe to join a protest in support of the cattle owners thanks to Fox News.

Do not take children to any protest in support of the cattle owners. Fox News is reporting militias are forming. Best to keep children away from the whole thing in my opinion. If Fox is claiming that local militias are forming then it really could be a Waco event.

Is what Fox reports true? Are local militias being formed? Militias? You would think that sort of thing would only happen in the USA.. Oh yeah. Well any normal western nation would not allow 'militias' to be formed. And instead of talking about it on the news the police would arrest any citizen trying to form a militia. You cant be having militias. Settle down Merica. Geez.
 
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CalGun said:
Then elect leaders who'll sale it to the highest bidder. What should be and what IS are two different things. What should be and IS ... Is no relevant to the party who owes tax payers $1.1 million in back fees who a bunch of anti govt zealots think is some kind of hero. He's nothing but a crook. At least Robin Hood gave his loot to the masses this guy just wants it all for him. Screw him



And BTW NV is not on the top 20 leach states. I don't know where it ranks, but it's below the top 20 so you aren't subsidizing much when it comes to BLM land. Our local FEDs are pretty good guys and haven't ever caused me any grief.
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Don't take my comments out of context. I was responding to a jerk who expects the rest of the country to pay for management of land that should belong to Nevada. How honest your federal people are out there irrelevant, I shouldn't be paying for your land management. It's your state, you pay for it. Sorry dude. And as far as that cattle rancher is concerned, that should be for a Nevada court to decide, and not the federal govt. So my statement still stands, the governor should tell the feds to leave or he'll run them off. 200 federals out there againt one rancher is ridiculous anyway.
 
Fearandloathing said:
"Show of force."


It was a technique of the Germans in Warsaw after 1939. A terrified populace is a controlled populace.

I missed the part where the land management outfit had a court order. They sued him right? And they have legal jurisdiction and all that?

I would not be so worried about Ruby Ridge, more like Pine Ridge

Leonard Peltier - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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The federal govt needs to be taken down a few notches, and their jurisdiction reduced. If it weren't federal land in the first place, there wouldn't be any feds there.
 
Dittohead not! said:
We, the people, own quite a lot of land here in California, too. So what? Does that mean we should just give it away?
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California should give some of its land to Texas. At least Texas would put it to good use, maybe create some jobs with it.
 
Ockham said:
The 10th Amendment:


What part exactly are you attributing to the farmers claim?
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Exactly what is says. If the power isnt delegate to the US, then its the peoples. The govt doesnt have the power to control land in such a way, thus according to the 10th, the people DO.
 
DashingAmerican said:
I'm torn on this one. On one hand, it's cows eating ****ing grass, does that really need paid for? Not sure how paying the government for your cows to eat grass protects this turtle... On the other hand, what difference does it make who the money goes to? If he feels that his family owns the land, well, I'd love to see documents saying so.
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To play devils advocate, the reason it needs to be paid for is to limit demand. Its the tragedy of the commons. If everyone has free access to something they will abuse it. If they are responsible for their own part, they will be responsible with it or suffer the consequences. An interesting question would be whether this rancher would be willing to purchase the land he needs for grazing. Will the govt let him, or do they forbid citizens from controling it?
 
I'm not a fan of how the government manages itself or anything else. But I am a fan doing things under the rule of law. The rancher is just plain wrong. If there is a fee for grazing on federal land and he didn't pay it then there is consequence under the law. It doesn't matter who should own the land and it doesn't matter who pays for land management in Nevada. The man is in arrears with his grazing permit payments. He's a deadbeat. If he owed it to a bank, the bank would go to court to get restitution and the court would give it to the bank.
 
jonny5 said:
Exactly what is says. If the power isnt delegate to the US, then its the peoples. The govt doesnt have the power to control land in such a way, thus according to the 10th, the people DO.
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If I go by exactly what it says, you're wrong. Did you read the 10th amendment because I don't think you did... you seem to skip the part that doesn't align with your view.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
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The states, in this case, being the State of Nevada.
 
I hope everyone in those militias wind up getting killed. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
 
Ockham said:
If I go by exactly what it says, you're wrong. Did you read the 10th amendment because I don't think you did... you seem to skip the part that doesn't align with your view.



The states, in this case, being the State of Nevada.
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or to the people.
 
reinoe said:
I hope everyone in those militias wind up getting killed. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
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Gotta say, my fellow libertarians arent sounding very libertarian in this thread. Where is the stalwart defense of individual liberty to live your life as you please without harming others, the beleif in the smallest govt possible? Instead youre siding with the Man seizing land and property, and then charging free people to access it, not to mention cheering on the govt in killing.
 
jonny5 said:
Gotta say, my fellow libertarians arent sounding very libertarian in this thread. Where is the stalwart defense of individual liberty to live your life as you please without harming others, the beleif in the smallest govt possible? Instead youre siding with the Man seizing land and property, and then charging free people to access it, not to mention cheering on the govt in killing.
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You're speaking about reinoe, which is the same guy that argued that no one is forced to buy health insurance because they can accept the penalty. He is about as libertarian as any run of the mill liberal is a libertarian.
 
jonny5 said:
Gotta say, my fellow libertarians arent sounding very libertarian in this thread. Where is the stalwart defense of individual liberty to live your life as you please without harming others, the beleif in the smallest govt possible? Instead youre siding with the Man seizing land and property, and then charging free people to access it, not to mention cheering on the govt in killing.
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I also believe in the rule of law. The fees in place are to prevent any idiotic tom, dick, and harry from running roughshod over the wilderness and to maintain the balance of the habitat. If he's not willing to pay the fees then he should accept that he's unwilling to heard his cattle in the area. He's already been getting a free ride for nearly 20 years. **** that asshole. He wants to eat his cake and have it too.

He's harming others because he's harming the wilderness which I enjoy. Regardless of how you feel about the natural wildlife in the area, his herding is causing wildlife to be harmed. Live his life how he wants? **** that noise, sounds like petulant selfishness to me. Who's he paying to maintain the habitat? Nevada? The Feds? Oh he's not paying anyone.
 
Henrin said:
You're speaking about reinoe, which is the same guy that argued that no one is forced to buy health insurance because they can accept the penalty. He is about as libertarian as any run of the mill liberal is a libertarian.
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What was FACTUALLY INCORRECT about the statement I made? Did I agree that the situation was acceptable? No I did not and have also repeatedly stated that the mandate should have been ruled unconstitutional. Funny how you failed to mention that. And aren't you the guy who advocates that it's ok to watch pornagraphy of 8 year olds?
 
reinoe said:
What was FACTUALLY INCORRECT about the statement I made? Did I agree that the situation was acceptable? Get the **** outta here dude.
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Does the government ever impose on anyone according to you?
 
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