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Obama warns US will 'isolate' Russia if Putin doesn't pull back in Ukraine

Russian soldiers are wearing generic green instead of their colors.
They are instigating Pro-Russian riots.
Baier on FOX is an excellent watch.
Instead of slamming Obama, they're one of the few FOX programs to do great reporting .
We'll see. It all takes time to divert oil and gas destined to someplace else. Then there is the cost factor as oil prices rise. I doubt if europe will push it too far, especially if Russia threatens to cut off the oil and gas.
 
The World has plenty of sources of oil and gas.
A little rationing to get by blockading of ALL Russian goods wouldn't hut the World.
But it would hurt Russia, deeply.
And the G-7 could reform in June .

It'd hurt the hell out of the EU and just how are they going to blockade goods? How are they going to take any UN action? The membership won't ever vote for it and Russia is on the security council and has veto power.

Kicking Russia out of the G8 would only free Russia to make bilateral agreements enriching just Russia and weaken the G8 (G7 in that case).
 
We'll see. It all takes time to divert oil and gas destined to someplace else. Then there is the cost factor as oil prices rise. I doubt if europe will push it too far, especially if Russia threatens to cut off the oil and gas.

The world is producing roughly 80-85 million barrels of oil per day. Russia produces about 12 % of that. The world does not have 8 million barrels of reserve production to make up for that production. Combine that with the reduction of Iran's production, the amount of excess oil is minimal. Which is why the price of oil is around the $100 per barrrel mark +/- a few dollars, and not $50.


The diversion would just mean that oil that went to Europe goes to Asia at extra cost and the oil that was going to go to Asia goes to Europe at extra cost

Economc isolation will mean a stop of Russian investments in the EU and NA, and a stop in EU investments in Russia

Political isolation will mean Russia gets kicked out of bodies like the G8.

All of which Russia can live with. Strategically Russia coud not live without the port in Crimea, and being replaced there with a Nato port.
 
That's correct Pero.....which if they tried the Sanctions. It hurts the EU and not just Russia. Which then the EU wont want to pay all those Royalties that Putin will surely place into effect.


Russia sets Ukraine agenda with diplomacy, threats

Hague said "the world cannot just allow this to happen." But he, like other Western diplomats, ruled out any military action. "The U.K is not discussing military options. Our concentration is on diplomatic and economic pressure."
Market reaction to the Russian seizure of Crimea was furious Monday. In European trading, gold and oil rose while the euro and stock markets fell. The greatest impact was felt in Moscow, where the main RTS index was down 12 percent at 1,115 and the dollar spiked to an all-time high of 37 rubles.

Russia's central bank hiked its main interest rate 1.5 percentage points Monday to 7 percent, trying to stem financial outflows.

Gazprom, the Russian energy giant, was also big loser, its share price down 13 percent as investors worried about how it would get its gas to Europe if hostilities kept up, since much of it goes through Ukrainian pipelines.....snip~

Russia sets Ukraine agenda with diplomacy, threats - NewsTimes

Yep, if the Ukraine cut the pipelines, you can be sure the Russian Army won't be far behind. One thing in the world of geopolitics, one must realize the history of the Ukraine is deeply tied to Russia and has been part of Russia for a very long time. Heck it only became a country in 1991. This is Russia's backyard, much like Mexico and Canada are in ours. Rather what he is doing is right, wrong or indifferent, we ought to realize the history and where the Ukraine is at.
 
Look at Iran, sanctions hasn't done a thing there. North Korea, Cuba, etc.
Are you really saying that sanctions didn't affect Iran?
That Iran didn't elect a moderate leader due to sanctions?
That Iran didn't come to the table cuz they were starving?
That Israel and Congressional war-hawks still want sanctions, since they don't work ?
 
Once again, just how to you suppose those sanctions are to be put in place?
 
I personally suspect there are a good many people in positions of power who do not want us to have an edge, in the arena of geopolitical power, but would rather us just be essentially impotent at wielding any influence whatsoever. We are gradually reducing ourselves to irrelevancy in any significant manner.

That literally makes no sense whatsoever. They wouldn't even be in positions of power if they didn't want to continue the status quo which is that of American military dominance and involving ourselves in under people's affairs to further our interests.
 
Russia can't afford to cut into their profits.

We will see. I am no expert on that side of the world, but I do not think Putin would care much. If he wants the Ukraine it is his.
 
Only in your own mind. But I digress...

While I firmly believe Putin has overstepped his bounds, I have to ask those who are insisting that the Obama Administration take stronger action beyond imposing sanctions against Russia, what exactly do you think should be done?

And let's remember this: Other than Granada, Reagan never fired a shot at any other country, not even a single bullet in Russia's direction throughout the Cold War era. He got others to do it albeit very underhandedly (i.e., Iran/Contra...stinger missles smuggled into Pakistan so that the Afghan rebels could fight a more definitive war against their Russian invaders). Clinton eventually decided to take military action against the Kurds in Kosovo, but only with unilateral support. The only time Bush I led an attack against another country during his Presidency was when the Kuwuiti Prince asked for his help directly. And we all know what a mess GWB made with his pre-emptive strike against Iraq.

So, I ask you folks, what exactly is Pres. Obama to do at this point considering that not one shot has been fired from a Russian gun aimed at a Ukrania citizen or its military? I get that Putin is taking similar actions as Hilter did when he invaded Poland and its citizens gave up without a fight. It's history somewhat repeating itself here. But again, other than marshalling international support and isolating Russia still further, what other action would you suggest be taken at this point?

A reasonable suggestion might be that he and Kerry just STHU. It seems they each have a penchant for speaking sans thought. There are too many future considerations for them to entertain such bluster at this time. This stage was set by -O- and the SoS actions and inactions during the last five years. O has no stick and has a frail hand.
This administration's foreign policy has been an embarrassment since its outset.

Thom Paine
 
It'd hurt the hell out of the EU and just how are they going to blockade goods? How are they going to take any UN action? The membership won't ever vote for it and Russia is on the security council and has veto power.
But I just read Helix tell me to let the EU take care of itself.
Since you're telling me what the EU can't do, what can they do?
Can you answer without blaming Obama, which GOP war-mongers did today ?
 
I think you put too much faith into the IMF.
Sanctions rarely work especially if one is a tough dictator who is willing to put his countries people through heck.
Then you are against what one wing of the GOP is publicly calling for?
How do you feel about the GOP's many wings attacking the POTUS this early into a crisis created by Putin ?
 
A reasonable suggestion might be that he and Kerry just STHU.
Are you good with a dozen GOP war-mongers shooting off their mouths, playing into Putin's hands?
Are you saying this Putin crisis is another event when the POTUS and SoS are not allowed to speak ?
 
Two things, again remembering that I'm not at all a patriot...

Three times you've said this! I don't think you have to worry about being confused for a patriot.
 
But I just read Helix tell me to let the EU take care of itself.
Since you're telling me what the EU can't do, what can they do?
Can you answer without blaming Obama, which GOP war-mongers did today ?

What are you talking about. Yes, this is in the EU neighborhood, and they have oil and gas agreements with both Russia and the Ukraine. So rightfully, if anyone is going to deal with this, it's the EU. They can't do squat really, but they're diplomatically closer to Russia and have many more business ties with Russia than we do.

Anything else you're asking is lost in the GOP partisan slam language. Leaves me wondering how this all of a sudden became the GOPs fault. :roll:
 
Are you good with a dozen GOP war-mongers shooting off their mouths, playing into Putin's hands?
Yep. They have as much of a right to war monger since they're elected as any left wing wingnut shooting their mouths off about anything else. It's freedom of speech, not freedom of speech you agree with.

Are you saying this Putin crisis is another event when the POTUS and SoS are not allowed to speak ?
I wish they wouldn't, for their own sakes - no one elses. But they have the freedom to spout off and threaten while looking foolish and certainly have done so.
 
Are you good with a dozen GOP war-mongers shooting off their mouths, playing into Putin's hands?
Are you saying this Putin crisis is another event when the POTUS and SoS are not allowed to speak ?

Sorry NIM, I don't understand your second question.

Can ya' explain further?

Thanks
Thom Paine
 
Three times you've said this! I don't think you have to worry about being confused for a patriot.
Just want to be sure to separate myself from those that are so patriotic as to be blind to the realities of USA. And you're right, I hate bullies, and USA is nothing anymore if not a bully. So my observations and opinions are reality, not dedication to the country. Should say, some of our extreme conservatives had posted similar, it would mostly be patriotism, forgive me if I don't want to accidentally get in an ilk such as that.
 
Would you prefer war as GOP war-mongers did in Syria ?

The Syrian situation isn't this situation. And your partisan hate aside, I've already made it clear here that I am not at all for the US intervening in this.

You still haven't answered the questions though - those sanctions you suggest, just how to you suppose those sanctions are to be put in place? By whom. And the blockade you suggested, who is going to do that and how?
 
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US intelligence not only dropped the ball on this one, they let it disappear down a mine shaft.
 
The Syrian situation isn't this situation. And your partisan hate aside, I've already made it clear here that I am not at all for the US intervening here.

You still haven't answered the questions though - those sanctions you suggest, just how to you suppose those sanctions are to be put in place? By whom. And the blockade you suggested, who is going to do that and how?

For sure EU won't do none of them.
 
Just want to be sure to separate myself from those that are so patriotic as to be blind to the realities of USA. And you're right, I hate bullies, and USA is nothing anymore if not a bully. So my observations and opinions are reality, not dedication to the country. Should say, some of our extreme conservatives had posted similar, it would mostly be patriotism, forgive me if I don't want to accidentally get in an ilk such as that.

Don't worry, I expect you to take the most anti-American attitude and viewpoint available. Of course you are doing this while benefiting form to freedoms these "patriots" win for you, but it's par for the course for someone with your character.
 
Don't worry, I expect you to take the most anti-American attitude and viewpoint available. Of course you are doing this while benefiting form to freedoms these "patriots" win for you, but it's par for the course for someone with your character.
No one has provided me with freedoms I couldn't have gotten in dozens of other countries that don't have the outrageous outflow of tax dollars to the MIC.
 
Are you good with a dozen GOP war-mongers shooting off their mouths, playing into Putin's hands?
Are you saying this Putin crisis is another event when the POTUS and SoS are not allowed to speak ?

Not everyone is in the bag for their political party on all issues, YOU of all people should know that. Regardless, sure they're allowed to speak, but we would hope they wouldn't say the dumbest things as they have been. There's plenty of blame for this to go around and as an American I judge my president and secty of state's part in this. They're making empty threats after they've failed diplomatically for years. So yes, considering they're just making the US look worse and worse every time they open their mouths, perhaps they should shut the hell up.
 
NATO is nothing but an excuse to do nothing. It is a defense negative. A joke. It would be far better to tell every NATO country "defend yourself" and we'd decide if anything happened if wished to involve. This would force them to built up far more than now.

Why do we defend Germany? That's nuts. They are the richest country in Europe. Spend their own money. Develop their own military. They don't back us up on anything anyway.

Those bases are not their for the defence of Germany. Their heavy use in the Iraq and Afghanistan war tells you that much.
 
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