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Acidic ocean blamed for scallop die-off

Grand Mal

Grand Mal

Russian warship, go f*** yourself!
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10 million scallops that died in the waters off Vancouver Island were the victims of a falling pH. level in the ocean. The pH. has fallen a full point, from 8.2 to 7.2 and the more acidic water means the shellfish can't properly form shells.

Acidic water blamed for West Coast scallop die-off

"Oyster die-offs in Washington state and Oregon dating back a decade have also been linked by National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration researchers to acidification and rising carbon dioxide levels."
 
Grand Mal said:
10 million scallops that died in the waters off Vancouver Island were the victims of a falling pH. level in the ocean. The pH. has fallen a full point, from 8.2 to 7.2 and the more acidic water means the shellfish can't properly form shells.

Acidic water blamed for West Coast scallop die-off

"Oyster die-offs in Washington state and Oregon dating back a decade have also been linked by National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration researchers to acidification and rising carbon dioxide levels."
Click to expand...

This is a natural scenario to "eschew obfuscation" because this CO2 thing is so friggin' absurd and I'm sure of that because myriad conservative posters have eschewed prognostications and scientific data to corroborate events of this nature. To think that all that CO2 can do sumpin' besides AGW. Boggles the senses, turn off the mind.
 
DaveFagan said:
This is a natural scenario to "eschew obfuscation" because this CO2 thing is so friggin' absurd and I'm sure of that because myriad conservative posters have eschewed prognostications and scientific data to corroborate events of this nature. To think that all that CO2 can do sumpin' besides AGW. Boggles the senses, turn off the mind.
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I never worried about this issue, just figured all we're doing is putting all that carbon back where it came from anyway, but a full point on the pH scale? Who knows what that means.
 
Pity. Scallops is tasty creatures.
 
Grand Mal said:
10 million scallops that died in the waters off Vancouver Island were the victims of a falling pH. level in the ocean. The pH. has fallen a full point, from 8.2 to 7.2 and the more acidic water means the shellfish can't properly form shells.

Acidic water blamed for West Coast scallop die-off

"Oyster die-offs in Washington state and Oregon dating back a decade have also been linked by National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration researchers to acidification and rising carbon dioxide levels."
Click to expand...

Now I have to pay even more for scallops? A travesty for sure
 
Grand Mal said:
10 million scallops that died in the waters off Vancouver Island were the victims of a falling pH. level in the ocean. The pH. has fallen a full point, from 8.2 to 7.2 and the more acidic water means the shellfish can't properly form shells.

Acidic water blamed for West Coast scallop die-off

"Oyster die-offs in Washington state and Oregon dating back a decade have also been linked by National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration researchers to acidification and rising carbon dioxide levels."
Click to expand...


Changes in the jet stream and glacier ice melting into the ocean can cause an increase in the ocean's acidity.
 
The #1 environmental issue is not temperature or climate change. It is our oceans and for many reasons.
 
Moot said:
Changes in the jet stream and glacier ice melting into the ocean can cause an increase in the ocean's acidity.
Click to expand...

Uh, could you go a little further with that?

Thanks

Thom Paine
 
Thom Paine said:
Uh, could you go a little further with that?

Thanks

Thom Paine
Click to expand...
Here's some information....

Scientists are trying to understand if the unusual weather in the Northern Hemisphere this winter — from record heat in Alaska to unprecedented flooding in Britain — is linked to climate change. One thing seems clear: Shifts in the jet stream play a key role and could become even more disruptive as the world warms....read
Is Weird Winter Weather Related to Climate Change? by Fred Pearce: Yale Environment 360

Warming Arctic May Be Causing Jet Stream To Lose Its Way : The Two-Way : NPR





http://www.neaq.org/conservation_and_research/climate_change/climate_change_and_the_oceans.php#acid

You're welcome.
 
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Moot said:
Changes in the jet stream and glacier ice melting into the ocean can cause an increase in the ocean's acidity.
Click to expand...

No they can't. Jet stream has nothing to do with it, and glaciers are generally alkaline. Ocean acidification is due to an increase in CO2 absorption.
 
A full point lowering means that the ocean water is TEN times more acidic.
Since pH is based on a logarithmic scale as: pH = -Log[H[SUP]+[/SUP]]
Grand Mal said:
I never worried about this issue, just figured all we're doing is putting all that carbon back where it came from anyway, but a full point on the pH scale? Who knows what that means.
Click to expand...
 
spud_meister said:
No they can't. Jet stream has nothing to do with it, and glaciers are generally alkaline. Ocean acidification is due to an increase in CO2 absorption.
Click to expand...
The jet stream is a fast moving air current that drags weather systems in its wake and since CO2 rises up into the atmosphere it stands to reason the jet stream would have a direct effect on CO2. The jet stream can have a direct effect the weather, wind velocities, storm size, patterns and duration, and even force warm air over the Artic and cold air over Georgia. It can also influence ocean currents, including the Gulf Stream and churn up cold water and CO2 from the bottom mixing it up with the warm water at the surface changing the temperature and PH of the oceans. So I'm inclined to disagree with you, the jet stream has a lot to do with it.
 
Grand Mal said:
10 million scallops that died in the waters off Vancouver Island were the victims of a falling pH. level in the ocean. The pH. has fallen a full point, from 8.2 to 7.2 and the more acidic water means the shellfish can't properly form shells.

Acidic water blamed for West Coast scallop die-off

"Oyster die-offs in Washington state and Oregon dating back a decade have also been linked by National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration researchers to acidification and rising carbon dioxide levels."
Click to expand...
Well, even the alarmists claim CO2 levels will only make a much smaller decrease.

Something else is the causer. Not CO2.

Natural changes perhaps?
 
Moot said:
The jet stream is a fast moving air current that drags weather systems in its wake and since CO2 rises up into the atmosphere it stands to reason the jet stream would have a direct effect on CO2. The jet stream can have a direct effect the weather, wind velocities, storm size, patterns and duration, and even force warm air over the Artic and cold air over Georgia. It can also influence ocean currents, including the Gulf Stream and churn up cold water and CO2 from the bottom mixing it up with the warm water at the surface changing the temperature and PH of the oceans. So I'm inclined to disagree with you, the jet stream has a lot to do with it.
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You have some sort of evidence that a breeze 10km above sea level can pull cold water and dead plankton up?
 
spud_meister said:
No they can't. Jet stream has nothing to do with it, and glaciers are generally alkaline. Ocean acidification is due to an increase in CO2 absorption.
Click to expand...

But not that much.

A full 1 point on the pH scale is a factor of 10.

This is probably some natural cyclical change, or from the aerosols traveling the jet steam from Asia.

Alarmist, choose your thoughts wisely. It is impossible that CO2 is the cause of a 1 pH change!
 
Lord of Planar said:
But not that much.

A full 1 point on the pH scale is a factor of 10.

This is probably some natural cyclical change, or from the aerosols traveling the jet steam from Asia.

Alarmist, choose your thoughts wisely. It is impossible that CO2 is the cause of a 1 pH change!
Click to expand...


CO2 can easily cause a pH change of one, depending on how much of it is dissolved in the water.

The pH of tap and distilled water is generally between 5-6 boil that same water to remove dissolved gases and the pH will rise as the CO2 leaves the water. Recall that pure water with no dissolved gases will have a pH of 7

So yes if the atmosphere has higher CO2 levels, and the ocean is absorbing it (which it will) the pH of the ocean will drop as a result. That of course does not excluded other factors in the pH drop (an increase or decrease in other ions in the water)

I will say I was surprised that oceanic pH was at 8, I had thought it would have been slightly acidic rather then basic in nature
 
Lord of Planar said:
But not that much.

A full 1 point on the pH scale is a factor of 10.

This is probably some natural cyclical change, or from the aerosols traveling the jet steam from Asia.

Alarmist, choose your thoughts wisely. It is impossible that CO2 is the cause of a 1 pH change!
Click to expand...

Is there math behind this? Chemistry wasn't my strong subject.
 
Lord Tammerlain said:
CO2 can easily cause a pH change of one, depending on how much of it is dissolved in the water.

The pH of tap and distilled water is generally between 5-6 boil that same water to remove dissolved gases and the pH will rise as the CO2 leaves the water. Recall that pure water with no dissolved gases will have a pH of 7

So yes if the atmosphere has higher CO2 levels, and the ocean is absorbing it (which it will) the pH of the ocean will drop as a result. That of course does not excluded other factors in the pH drop (an increase or decrease in other ions in the water)

I will say I was surprised that oceanic pH was at 8, I had thought it would have been slightly acidic rather then basic in nature
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Sorry, but something other than Co2 is causing that sharp of a pH decrease.
 
Lord of Planar said:
Well, even the alarmists claim CO2 levels will only make a much smaller decrease.

Something else is the causer. Not CO2.

Natural changes perhaps?
Click to expand...

No, apparently all the anthropogenic CO2 from all over the world is concentrating in the waters off the coast of Washington state.
 
To edit, 'p' means ' -Log ' in Chemistry.
pH = the negative log of the Hydronium/Hydogen ion concentration, as I showed in #11.
Something caused the Hydrogen ion concentration to increase OR the Hydoxide ion concentration to decrease or both.
The 'product' of the two conc. is a constant, 1.0 x 10[SUP]-14[/SUP].
pH + pOH add to 14, showing their inverse relation in another math way.

This 7.2 pH is now slightly less than our blood--at 7.4--but above natural rainfall--at 6.5--just below neutral at 7.
Conc. is measured in MOLES of Hydrogen ion per liter of solution,
with moles coming from mass in grams divided by molar mass, which comes from the Periodic table.

There are probably several hypotheses just hitting the table of investigation.

'Addendum'
The 6 or 7 in pH readings is not a "significant figure", since they are exponential place-holders.
A Hydrogen ion concentration of 0.000 0010, or 1.0 x 10[SUP] -6 [/SUP], yields a pH of 6.00.
pH of 7.00 comes from 1.0 x 10[SUP] -7 [/SUP].
The concentration of Hydrogen ion is TEN times less at 7.00 vs. 6.00 .

Deuce said:
Is there math behind this? Chemistry wasn't my strong subject.
Click to expand...
 
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Lord of Planar said:
Sorry, but something other than Co2 is causing that sharp of a pH decrease.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be surprised if it had something to do with seismic activity in that fault line off the Washington coastline.

Or possibly Godzilla.

Seriously, though.. 7.2 isn't acidic, folks. This isn't "acidification". What this is called is "neutralization".
 
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Please notice that the problems they are having is around Qualicum Beach in the Georgia Straits. This is an area not flushed well by the ocean and has some of the heaviest ship traffic in the world, for water that is near stagnant.

To blame this on CO2 and disregard other factors is ridiculous, unscientific, and alarmist.

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Qual...ay,+Nanaimo,+British+Columbia,+Canada&t=m&z=7

Georgia Straits Shipping 2003.JPG

I highly suggest that other possibilities be looked at before believing the propaganda that CO2 is to blame.
 
jmotivator said:
I wouldn't be surprised if it had something to do with seismic activity in that fault line off the Washington coastline.

Or possibly Godzilla.

Seriously, though.. 7.2 isn't acidic, folks. This isn't "acidification". What this is called is "neutralization".
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Very true. The salinity is a bit lower than the Pacific, and that has some effect of pH, but in the other direction I believe. I would have to look it up. I have forgotten so much about chemistry.
 
Lord of Planar said:
But not that much.

A full 1 point on the pH scale is a factor of 10.

This is probably some natural cyclical change, or from the aerosols traveling the jet steam from Asia.

Alarmist, choose your thoughts wisely. It is impossible that CO2 is the cause of a 1 pH change!
Click to expand...

Good, it's China's fault.
 
American said:
Good, it's China's fault.
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I don't know if it is or not. I would assume the acidity of those rains would have fallen out before they reach BC, but since there is so little water flow in those straits, any extra can be a contributing factor.
 
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