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Aging America heading for disaster

Ockham said:
I don't read this as having to do with old people --- old people are the same no matter where you go. It's that we don't have a resurgence of population in the post baby boom years. The birth rate per 1,000 seemed to have peaked in the 20th century early on, in the 1940-1961 boomer years it was relatively high but has been slowly dropping. The high amount of boomers, their life expectancy of living longer, and the lowering number of births since then all sort of contribute. Do I think the OP has a valid point? Yeah... but it's not the boomers fault they were born then or living so long. I certainly do not see a resurgence of 5% growth like the 1980's or 1990's. Those days I think are well past us and yes, to a lesser extent we will see a economic decline like Japan though I think the U.S. economy can absorb some of the sharp edges if our lawmakers and politicians don't bone us unexpectedly.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005067.html
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Boomers are from 1946 to 1964. So their first official year of retirement was 2011.
 
The problem is that productive, educated married couples are having fewer kids to raise to be educated and productive; meanwhile, poorly educated and highly government-dependent people are multiplying like mosquitoes outside of traditional family structure, and they are producing no taxable income.

The result is, only 47 percent of Americans work, and far less pay significant taxes. When the top 25 percent of Americans pay almost 90 percent of the taxes, it just doesn't work. One person can't pay the taxes for four people and take care of their own family to boot.

And now we're considering granting amnesty to a huge swath of illegals. That certainly won't help the situation at all.
 
shrubnose said:
Maybe all of us old people (I'm 70+) should plant one of those.
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What these younger idiots don't realize, is that the policies and attitudes towards the elderly that they emplace now, will bite them in the ass in 20+ years. The dumb, arrogant ****s don't think they'll age or be affected.
 
grip said:
What these younger idiots don't realize, is that the policies and attitudes towards the elderly that they emplace now, will bite them in the ass in 20+ years.
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 The dumb, arrogant ****s don't think they'll age or be affected.
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That's the truth,for sure. What they don't realize is that when they look at us they are seeing themselves in the future.

No one on this planet ever has, or ever will, escaped old age and death.

Eventually their day will come.

And I'm not wishing any bad luck on them, just stating a fact.
 
The baby boomer generation was encouraged to breed and were given financial incentives to do so, with no regard for how all those people would be taken care of down the road. Those were the expectations of consumer capitalism at its outset.

Social security is bust. In most other countries in the world, the children have to take care of their parents until they die as there are no old age homes. In America, the demand for retirement homes is about to skyrocket, which means many Americans should get comfortable with the idea of taking care of the elderly directly, by themselves.

The main thing that pisses me off about this situation is that money was taken from social security by successive administrations and wasn't replaced. They didn't give two ****s about who that would affect down the road. This system treats old people like dirt, just like it does everyone else. They only thing about the current quarter, and maybe the next quarter, but never beyond that. It's sick.
 
grip said:
All they do is consume, not produce, huh? How about all the infrastructure, technology and wealth they pass on for free to their unappreciative brats? If we burned up all the resources we leave behind, this next generation would be back to caveman days.
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Um....you do know that engineers say our infrastructure is decaying and rate it at D+?

That much of our technology is manufactured in China ever since you old people dropped the ball with free trade agreements?

That wealth is so concentrated in the hands of the 1%, the economy is sputtering from lack of demand?

That the opportunity cost of keeping all those old people alive for another few years at the end of their lives is that students have pay out of pocket and now have so much debt its considered the next economic bubble?
 
grip said:
All they do is consume, not produce, huh? How about all the infrastructure, technology and wealth they pass on for free to their unappreciative brats? If we burned up all the resources we leave behind, this next generation would be back to caveman days.
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They didn't pass on anything "for free."
 
ChunkySalsa said:
Um....you do know that engineers say our infrastructure is decaying and rate it at D+?

That much of our technology is manufactured in China ever since you old people dropped the ball with free trade agreements?

That wealth is so concentrated in the hands of the 1%, the economy is sputtering from lack of demand?

That the opportunity cost of keeping all those old people alive for another few years at the end of their lives is that students have pay out of pocket and now have so much debt its considered the next economic bubble?
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Your point is?

Do you really want to sell your humanity for a few dollars?

joko104 said:
They didn't pass on anything "for free."
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They sure didn't make everyone pay for their inheritance or rebuild all the buildings, bridges, highways, airports, businesses, etc etc.
 
grip said:
They don't know if they want us to live longer and make money from turning us into cyborgs with catheters, knee, hip implants, pacemaker/defibrillators or tell us, we can't be fixed to save money. We're all going to get old, unless they start stamping us with an expiration date. How about let's be humane and take care of the helpless (infants, disabled, sick and old) for now and try to control the making of 4+ children families? Then the population of older folks won't be any problem.
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No offense but these are economic realities.


You aren't worth as much as you were. You are fixed income when you retire which means you spend less but cost society more. Problem is our system taking care of the infants, old, sick and disabled is a Pyramid scheme. All of our trust funds are now drawing money from the General Fund and is ballooning. The whole system is built upon the idea the next generations will take care of the previous generation. Problem is you need population birth rates to stay the same or greater to keep this going. It isn't happening and hasn't.

We can't fix our problem because older/retired Americans are the largest voting block. So it just same old ****, different day. We have to change the system or some point in our near future 100% of the budget will go to just taking care of the infants, old, sick and disabled.
 
grip said:
All they do is consume, not produce, huh? How about all the infrastructure, technology and wealth they pass on for free to their unappreciative brats? If we burned up all the resources we leave behind, this next generation would be back to caveman days.
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You were PAID for that in your pre-retirement years. And nobody passes wealth on for free, nobody. It will be taxed at 50% when you die.
 
grip said:
Your point is?

Do you really want to sell your humanity for a few dollars?
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I'll throw in a few dollars to have you end your life humanly.. see how that works? :2razz:

BTW that was joke.
 
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austrianecon said:
I'll throw in a few dollars to have you end your life humanly.. see how that works? :2razz:

BTW that was joke.
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Bless the youth for they are the future. I just wish we would've passed on our hard earned ethics, that our parents gave us.
 
austrianecon said:
You were PAID for that in your pre-retirement years. And nobody passes wealth on for free, nobody.
It will be taxed at 50% when you die.
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Not if you give it away before you die.

Which is what I am in the process of doing.

The tax on zero=zero
 
Eric7216 said:
I guess that I misspoke. I agree that SS is a Ponzi scheme. I just wish that it wasn't.
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The idealist in me thinks that maybe there was a way to make it like an insurance/annuity fund and spread out risk and still fulfill some need to help the elderly but we didn't do that.
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Social Security was never designed to be the sole retirement income for anyone.
 
grip said:
What these younger idiots don't realize, is that the policies and attitudes towards the elderly that they emplace now, will bite them in the ass in 20+ years. The dumb, arrogant ****s don't think they'll age or be affected.
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Men in my family die young, so there is a good chance I won't be.
 
Henrin said:
Men in my family die young, so there is a good chance I won't be.
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Then stand for the rest of us and be rewarded in the next life. Or at least take comfort that you didn't let a bunch of smart alecks screw over those who cared.
 
shrubnose said:
Not if you give it away before you die.

Which is what I am in the process of doing.

The tax on zero=zero
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You were still taxed on it. Be it capital gains or income.. it was taxed. Government taxes everything that moves.
 
grip said:
Then stand for the rest of us and be rewarded in the next life. Or at least take comfort that you didn't let a bunch of smart alecks screw over those who cared.
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I don't believe in reincarnation, and honestly, I don't want another life. I'm kind of happy this one will be short anyway. I have no interest in being old.
 
Henrin said:
I don't believe in reincarnation, and honestly, I don't want another life. I'm kind of happy this one will be short anyway. I have no interest in being old.
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It's called a "continuation", not reincarnation. Death is a lie, always has been.

No one wants to be old, it's a lesson in appreciation of Gods gifts. You're not given a choice in this matter.
 
grip said:
It's called a "continuation", not reincarnation. Death is a lie, always has been.

No one wants to be old, it's a lesson in appreciation of Gods gifts. You're not given a choice in this matter.
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Honestly, this thing we call life is overrated and all this talk of people not appreciating it are crap. There is nothing really to appreciate. I'm not depressed even if I might sound like it, but just that I can't find purpose in this thing we call life. It doesn't seem to have any and when we get old the purpose it did have is replaced with lose of function, aging and just general misery. It's not a good transfer and not one I'm interested in making. There is nothing there I desire to purchase, and nothing there worth acquiring. If I'm reborn or continued or whatever, I would rather have that than old age. I have seen people suffer when they reach their mid fifties and beyond and that just isn't for me. God can call it a gift if he wants, but I can consider it a crappy gift and reject it.
 
Henrin said:
Honestly, this thing we call life is overrated and all this talk of people not appreciating it are crap. There is nothing really to appreciate. I'm not depressed even if I might sound like it, but just that I can't find purpose in this thing we call life. It doesn't seem to have any and when we get old the purpose it did have is replaced with lose of function, aging and just general misery. It's not a good transfer and not one I'm interested in making. There is nothing there I desire to purchase, and nothing there worth acquiring. If I'm reborn or continued or whatever, I would rather have that than old age. I have seen people suffer when they reach their mid fifties and beyond and that just isn't for me. God can call it a gift if he wants, but I can consider it a crappy gift and reject it.
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You're ahead of your time.

Don't sell Him short, for you haven't seen the end game. Wait till He's given from the cup of plenty, before you make a final judgment. It more than makes up for all that we have suffered in this lifetime. And I mean, WAY than makes up for.
 
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grip said:
Your point is?

Do you really want to sell your humanity for a few dollars?
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My point is that with the way the older generation has flooded the market, we'd be lucky to get two bits, let alone a few dollars.
 
ChunkySalsa said:
My point is that with the way the older generation has flooded the market, we'd be lucky to get two bits, let alone a few dollars.
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It isn't the average share holder that's done this but the greedy 30 year old bastard.
 
shrubnose said:
Social Security was never designed to be the sole retirement income for anyone.
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True. But it is often sold as the sole retirement income for anyone. A politician is more likely to argue for increased SS benefits than to campaign for more savings, individual retirement accounts, or even stating what you just stated. Instead we get politicians wringing their hands about how many old people are in poverty and we need to raise SS. I have never seen a public service advertisement urging people to wait until 66 or so to start drawing SS. Most people draw a reduced amount at 62, or before on SS disability which is at record levels.
 
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